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  1. #1

    Void Tendrils [PvP]

    Last night I tried running void tendrils vs some melee cleaves in 3s. It wasn't bad considering the number of warriors, who are impossible to fear. My problem is the talent only works when you're being trained. In order for me to help a teammate I have to run over next to when, which put me in danger of beind CCed and if I do run over to my teammate I can't be next to the enemy healer for a fear. I think the talent would be a much better choice if it had say a 20 yard range on it. This way I could still help my team. I would also help for catching healers to put them into a fear. As the game stands now psyfiend is the only real choice for pvp.

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    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Highmoon7 View Post
    Last night I tried running void tendrils vs some melee cleaves in 3s. It wasn't bad considering the number of warriors, who are impossible to fear. My problem is the talent only works when you're being trained. In order for me to help a teammate I have to run over next to when, which put me in danger of beind CCed and if I do run over to my teammate I can't be next to the enemy healer for a fear. I think the talent would be a much better choice if it had say a 20 yard range on it. This way I could still help my team. I would also help for catching healers to put them into a fear. As the game stands now psyfiend is the only real choice for pvp.
    Sure a 20 yard range would be epic but tendrils doesn't realy need changing, i find it very useful to do this with warriors: Spectral-> VT+SW+P-> Phantasme -->MB (start to move to the warrior) Void tendrils --> run --> repeat=profit.

    Use Void tendrils wisely, if u do u will realy like the abillity more and more.

  3. #3
    Bloodsail Admiral dannypoos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Appel View Post
    Sure a 20 yard range would be epic but tendrils doesn't realy need changing, i find it very useful to do this with warriors: Spectral-> VT+SW+P-> Phantasme -->MB (start to move to the warrior) Void tendrils --> run --> repeat=profit.

    Use Void tendrils wisely, if u do u will realy like the abillity more and more.
    A good warrior will leap or spell reflect it. trinket or avatar the tendrills and he will on you like a disease
    And once they on you , you aint getting a hard cast off easy and there free to controll into the situation they want xD

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by dannypoos View Post
    A good warrior will leap or spell reflect it. trinket or avatar the tendrills and he will on you like a disease
    And once they on you , you aint getting a hard cast off easy and there free to controll into the situation they want xD
    pretty much, from the warriors PoV either leap where you think he guised to or leap out of range using the speed boost to kite if you land and deal damage with the leap shockwave GG stunned until its over. You get tendrils? safeguard your demo banner or mocking banner if you cant then storm bolt them or mass spell reflect if you didn't have safeguard and either way you also have regular spell reflect possibly warbringer to stop them from even getting the cast off when you aren't back in range yet and even if they phantasm then its only one hard cast total they've gotten and worst case a good halo then you are back on them with disrupting shout and pummel ready and shockwave and leap coming back up soon

    not putting the warrior in any danger really and if you are using it to peel him even if the positioning works so you don't have to run far he can just kill it if hes got no better option it doesn't take more than 2-3 hits even without crits or MS
    Last edited by Vicarious; 2012-12-29 at 01:21 AM.

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    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicarious View Post
    pretty much, from the warriors PoV either leap where you think he guised to or leap out of range using the speed boost to kite if you land and deal damage with the leap shockwave GG stunned until its over. You get tendrils? safeguard your demo banner or mocking banner if you cant then storm bolt them or mass spell reflect if you didn't have safeguard and either way you also have regular spell reflect possibly warbringer to stop them from even getting the cast off when you aren't back in range yet and even if they phantasm then its only one hard cast total they've gotten and best case a good halo then they are back on your with disrupting shout and pummel ready and shockwave and leap coming back up soon

    not putting the warrior in any danger really and if you are using it to peel him even if the positioning works so you don't have to run far he can just kill it if hes got no better option it doesn't take more than 2-3 hits even without crits or MS
    It's true, but there are way to counter them, ive been testing alot of stuf out lately. It's hard to pull those casts off but u gotta do it with the stuff u have, combination with stacking resil+pvp power, inner fire glyph and either the glyph of renew or deflective shield u have a chance. But i do admit it's not easy.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Appel View Post
    It's true, but there are way to counter them, ive been testing alot of stuf out lately. It's hard to pull those casts off but u gotta do it with the stuff u have, combination with stacking resil+pvp power, inner fire glyph and either the glyph of renew or deflective shield u have a chance. But i do admit it's not easy.
    If you're dueling a warrior sure but you can't plan your entire spec glyphs and playstyle around countering one class and spec you just deal with the fact that they are going to be a pain in the ass with the setup that counters the majority of setups consistently.

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    Bloodsail Admiral dannypoos's Avatar
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    I dont mean to sound like a douche but ive dualed a few warriors and I cant beat them maybe it's a L2P for me.
    but im sceptical about beating them 1 on 1 in duel even more so if you have no orbs.
    I can survive for a while well they beat on me disperse the 1 button of doom. the fact that you cant do any damage to them and dots tickle them
    though you hardly get to keep up vamp touch let alone trying to get 3 orbs. they have soo meny tools atm they feel to me just 100% counter.
    others melee are a pain but I can beat them. all ranged arnt to bad either appart from mages they are a pain too.
    maybe I shouldnt be soo frustrated because overall we are pretty decent. but yeh hopefully 5.2 xD
    Last edited by dannypoos; 2012-12-29 at 03:20 AM.

  8. #8
    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    As shadow our biggest concern is melee. Those are our weakness, Based on that i think it's fairly obvious to spec to that. Fighting ranged aint realy a problem.
    And for you vicarious is warrior the only melee class? dont tell me ur using the mind spike glyph.. with divine insight? I see comments like that all the time still i am having way more succes versus melee then i see in these forums. Sure it's not the most easiest class to counter. But the options i gave are perfect to just give a glimpse on how you coud do it. The only class i am struggeling with are good/geared affliction locks. I realy dont wanna sound llike jerk but Spriest have always struggeld against melee, why wouldn't u spec to classes ur weak to?

  9. #9
    From my experience i'm suffering like mad melees and hunters.

    Well hunters not really so much, its more of a coin flip most of the time.

    Against other casters i'm having a good time, frost mages are a joke or at least, i'm very proficent at counter them.

  10. #10
    Void Tendrils can at least get you a little breathing room against warriors, which is more than the other options can do. It's also solid against other melee. If your own team includes melee, you can also use it offensively. Obviously not the best choice 100% of the time, but what talent is?

  11. #11
    The fact you have trouble with aff tells me all I need to know since they are the weakest lock spec especially against ranged. Other melee aren't much of a problem except monks but only really when 1v1 which doesn't matter and in arena its just their ability to get away so fast. Warriors are the biggest problem sure but tendrils don't help me against them more than psyfiend unless they are bad and just sit in them and then I was going to win anyways. Psyfiend is weak for some reasons but it can certainly eat grounding and reflects, be a good deterrent while you los or force them to either eat a fear or give you a hard cast/ some breathing room. If you're not using divine insight you're doing it wrong PI blows can be dispelled (or worse stolen)and requires we stand still freecasting to do anything with, its just haste DI gives you more shadow orb gen and faster build time even not counting more instant casts to not be interrupted. Or if you're using ToF in pvp just don't even say anything I don't want to know.

    Reflective shield is alright but its only like a maybe 60k shield so 25k damage before resil, after resil its more like half that and if you're using renew glyph without dark binding idk what to say. You might want to read the tooltip on shadowform. Either way you cant not have mass dispel glyph no matter what you're doing and in 2s you usually need the mana from the dispersion glyph(and the survival CD in 3s) so it doesn't leave much room for your choices there although they would be nice if there were 5 and 6 slots for major glyphs.

    edit: I swap out dispersion for mind spike for world pvp/dailys etc and keep dark binding and mass dispel in all the time
    Last edited by Vicarious; 2012-12-29 at 08:39 PM.

  12. #12
    Is nobody else high enough rated that warriors just drop a flag and intervene out of void tendrils? or did they fix that?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by hikamiro View Post
    Is nobody else high enough rated that warriors just drop a flag and intervene out of void tendrils? or did they fix that?
    no they do that, its just safeguard not intervene and that's how its supposed to work nothing broken to fix

  14. #14
    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicarious View Post
    The fact you have trouble with aff tells me all I need to know since they are the weakest lock spec especially against ranged. Other melee aren't much of a problem except monks but only really when 1v1 which doesn't matter and in arena its just their ability to get away so fast. Warriors are the biggest problem sure but tendrils don't help me against them more than psyfiend unless they are bad and just sit in them and then I was going to win anyways. Psyfiend is weak for some reasons but it can certainly eat grounding and reflects, be a good deterrent while you los or force them to either eat a fear or give you a hard cast/ some breathing room. If you're not using divine insight you're doing it wrong PI blows can be dispelled (or worse stolen)and requires we stand still freecasting to do anything with, its just haste DI gives you more shadow orb gen and faster build time even not counting more instant casts to not be interrupted. Or if you're using ToF in pvp just don't even say anything I don't want to know.

    Reflective shield is alright but its only like a maybe 60k shield so 25k damage before resil, after resil its more like half that and if you're using renew glyph without dark binding idk what to say. You might want to read the tooltip on shadowform. Either way you cant not have mass dispel glyph no matter what you're doing and in 2s you usually need the mana from the dispersion glyph(and the survival CD in 3s) so it doesn't leave much room for your choices there although they would be nice if there were 5 and 6 slots for major glyphs.

    edit: I swap out dispersion for mind spike for world pvp/dailys etc and keep dark binding and mass dispel in all the time
    Well the thing with mindspike glyph is that it blocks the cd with devine insight. It isn't realy helping anyone, dark binding is mandatory anyways fail me for not telling that, but thought everyone knew.
    There are a couple of glyphs outside (mass for arena and be helpfull in any situation) Reflective shield/renew is something i switch regualry, in duels i switch talents all the time, cus i like to have some choice.

    Touching quick on affliction locks. I ment in duels. The damage they can put out with their dots is insane, outside their cd's they are fragile i know. Ur comment on that seems weird like u never duel in durotar.. finely geared afflic lock with sum timing can be a beast if doing it right..Besides I am only here trying to help. Switching out different glyphs is fun and the best thing u can do to make it a win situation.

    I am just laughing and people having Mind spike glyph+ divine insight together, it's proven many times ive seen it with my own eyes that it doesn't increase anything. If ur getting 2 FDCL procs get a Divine insight proc aswell the system will take the instant mindblast from the glyph and wont cover the proc from Divine insight (it blocks) and still have ur mindblast on cd while it's glowing. It aint helping and it's annoying. It's just some tip, It's a 0,005% damaga increase or less. Using either inner fire glyph or renew if u dont need mass, saves lives realy.
    I hope you understand a bit what i mean with my horrible grammer.

    Void tendrils is just a nice little thing, i dont spec Psyfiend alot anymore these days. In arena it might prove usefull against casters. But Using either tendrils to put some one in place LOS of enemy healer is just to awesome. Just random bg fun i like to spec tendrils cus it's fun and easy. Plus u wont have the slight chance some one insta kills it (no matter the placing, it happends anyway)

    Once again, try to see thru my grammer and get the message. I am getting the grammer ($%^) all the time so safe ur time.


    PS: Dispersion glyph..? realy imo thats a waste of a slot. But i like the theorycrafting >.>
    Last edited by Alanar; 2012-12-29 at 11:38 PM.

  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral dannypoos's Avatar
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    The glyphs ive been using alot are dark binding, massdispell and prayer of mending. Like mentions the mind spike glyph kinda dosent work great with divine insight.
    I had a phase of using the fade glyph but changed it because didnt feel like I noticed the 10%

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Appel View Post
    Well the thing with mindspike glyph is that it blocks the cd with devine insight. It isn't realy helping anyone, dark binding is mandatory anyways fail me for not telling that, but thought everyone knew.
    There are a couple of glyphs outside (mass for arena and be helpfull in any situation) Reflective shield/renew is something i switch regualry, in duels i switch talents all the time, cus i like to have some choice.

    touching quick on affliction locks. I ment in duels. U wont kill a finely geared afflic lock with sum skillz and timing. U can try defending that, but thats bullshit. I am only here trying to help. Switching out different glyphs is fun and the best thing u can do.

    I am just laughing and people having Mind spike glyph+ divine insight together, it's proven many times ive seen it with my own eyes that it doesn't increase anything. If ur getting 2 FDCL procs get a Divine insight proc aswell the system will take the instant mindblast from the glyph and wont cover the proc from Divine insight (it blocks) and still have ur mindblast on cd while it's glowing. It aint helping and it's annoying. It's just some tip, It's a 0,005% damaga increase or less. Using either inner fire glyph or renew if u dont need mass, saves lives realy.
    I hope you understand a bit what i mean with my horrible grammer.

    Void tendrils is just a nice little thing, i dont spec Psyfiend alot anymore these days. In arena it might prove usefull against casters. But Using either tendrils to put some one in place LOS of enemy healer is just to awesome. Just random bg fun i like to spec tendrils cus it's fun and easy. Plus u wont have the slight chance some one insta kills it (no matter the placing, it happends anyway)

    Once again, try to see thru my grammer and get the message. I am getting the grammer ($%^) all the time so safe ur time.
    The mindspike glyph doesn't block anything, you don't lose the buff and its still up by the time mind blast comes off cd. If you even run into this situation and its only when its at two stacks either way unless it gets dispelled or you let them fall off they wont go to waste and most times I find myself using a one stack with mind blast and getting a proc mid cast or soon after for a CD reset and instant. The fact you don't know that tells me you used it for 5 minutes and either way it isn't about how big of an overall damage increase it is its about having one more offensive tool against melee, and the dispersion glyph is mostly a better choice for arena anyways but mind spike certainly isn't bad and definitely not for the reason you think it is.

    I don't duel much admittedly but I don't see the point switching glyphs in for them when you wont have those in for a real situation, why skew your playstyle?

    I could explain how to beat an aff lock but I don't see why it would be hard to figure out they aren't hard to deal with in arena and they are even less of a problem 1v1, the only things they have going for them are general lock talents not spec abilities. In fact I could beat 1v1 an aff lock in much better gear long before I finished my malevolent set, destro I would have to duel near a line of sight object to manage if they had full malevolent. Demo is by far the hardest to fight 1v1 and depending on the map can be extremely effective in arena as well. They are at least as good as destro though no matter what even after the chaos wave nerf, imp swarm eating AoE CCs and psyfiend fears makes them difficult to handle.

    Not sure why you insist on inner fire but inner sanctum is 6% spell damage reduction(also movement speed although no one really uses inner will much) and other than warriors and feral druids everyone else does at least some portion of their damage as spell damage. The armor bonus from inner fire is about 6% melee damage reduction in full malevolent gear either way for defense dispersion glyph is always better. Renew glyph really isn't the thing either, you don't gain any healing from it its just over a shorter time and if you're about to die that isn't the first spell I would be using. It would be good if we kept it up all the time and it lasted much longer but it doesn't and we don't so it isn't.

    Void tendrils isn't wrong I guess but it isn't going to help you against pretty much any caster blink out of it shift out of it freedom it windwalk totem the list goes on and on. That's assuming you even get them rooted los and then you have to run around to get over and back in los to hit them its just not going to get you much pressure if any the best you can do is put up pains and instant cast heals on the way over and back.

    Psyfiend you have to use carefully but it can be very good if someone is sheeped cycloned etc and you put it on top of them even if someone kills it that gives you free time to do whatever you want while they waste gap closers to and from. Put it out of melee range of you while you're running perpendicular to it and the melee on you either eats a fear or quickly kills it and gives you a hardcast or two or use it to bait an intim shout or interrupt/disrupting shout to setup for shadowfiend and burst with less risk of counter. Or against ranged especially mages keep them at a good distance so that they are going for one pillar to los you and you are out in front of the one across from it. When they go to make a move from that position with all their CDs you have any combination of root removers freedom phantasm etc and as a goblin I use rocket jump here to get back behind the pillar and put up a psyfiend out of los so they either lose their CDs or overextend possibly blink into my psyfiend and eat a fear so they have to waste block or if they don't then they eat a lot of damage and then have to block anyways. Point being there's no good outcome for them, and I wouldn't stand a chance with void tendrils.

  17. #17
    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicarious View Post
    The mindspike glyph doesn't block anything, you don't lose the buff and its still up by the time mind blast comes off cd. If you even run into this situation and its only when its at two stacks either way unless it gets dispelled or you let them fall off they wont go to waste and most times I find myself using a one stack with mind blast and getting a proc mid cast or soon after for a CD reset and instant. The fact you don't know that tells me you used it for 5 minutes and either way it isn't about how big of an overall damage increase it is its about having one more offensive tool against melee, and the dispersion glyph is mostly a better choice for arena anyways but mind spike certainly isn't bad and definitely not for the reason you think it is.

    I don't duel much admittedly but I don't see the point switching glyphs in for them when you wont have those in for a real situation, why skew your playstyle?

    I could explain how to beat an aff lock but I don't see why it would be hard to figure out they aren't hard to deal with in arena and they are even less of a problem 1v1, the only things they have going for them are general lock talents not spec abilities. In fact I could beat 1v1 an aff lock in much better gear long before I finished my malevolent set, destro I would have to duel near a line of sight object to manage if they had full malevolent. Demo is by far the hardest to fight 1v1 and depending on the map can be extremely effective in arena as well. They are at least as good as destro though no matter what even after the chaos wave nerf, imp swarm eating AoE CCs and psyfiend fears makes them difficult to handle.

    Not sure why you insist on inner fire but inner sanctum is 6% spell damage reduction(also movement speed although no one really uses inner will much) and other than warriors and feral druids everyone else does at least some portion of their damage as spell damage. The armor bonus from inner fire is about 6% melee damage reduction in full malevolent gear either way for defense dispersion glyph is always better. Renew glyph really isn't the thing either, you don't gain any healing from it its just over a shorter time and if you're about to die that isn't the first spell I would be using. It would be good if we kept it up all the time and it lasted much longer but it doesn't and we don't so it isn't.

    Void tendrils isn't wrong I guess but it isn't going to help you against pretty much any caster blink out of it shift out of it freedom it windwalk totem the list goes on and on. That's assuming you even get them rooted los and then you have to run around to get over and back in los to hit them its just not going to get you much pressure if any the best you can do is put up pains and instant cast heals on the way over and back.

    Psyfiend you have to use carefully but it can be very good if someone is sheeped cycloned etc and you put it on top of them even if someone kills it that gives you free time to do whatever you want while they waste gap closers to and from. Put it out of melee range of you while you're running perpendicular to it and the melee on you either eats a fear or quickly kills it and gives you a hardcast or two or use it to bait an intim shout or interrupt/disrupting shout to setup for shadowfiend and burst with less risk of counter. Or against ranged especially mages keep them at a good distance so that they are going for one pillar to los you and you are out in front of the one across from it. When they go to make a move from that position with all their CDs you have any combination of root removers freedom phantasm etc and as a goblin I use rocket jump here to get back behind the pillar and put up a psyfiend out of los so they either lose their CDs or overextend possibly blink into my psyfiend and eat a fear so they have to waste block or if they don't then they eat a lot of damage and then have to block anyways. Point being there's no good outcome for them, and I wouldn't stand a chance with void tendrils.
    You realy dont need to tell me how the glyphs work. I was only talking about the tendrils being a much better choice in MOST cases, so not all! BEWARE! it's still fine never said it sucked.

    Still, your opinion on the mind spike glyph is fine and all but i dont agree with it. It's clunky as fuck and it DOES block the use of Divine Insight. While waiting on that cd of mindblast you have a chance to either lose the stacks or lose the proc. I heard some one talking on twitter saying it was bugged and they are investigating it. The system right now isn't working great with those 2 combined. Therefore i prefer to use other glyphs instead. Just saying here is that i find the use of Renew or reflective shield a much better option outside mass and binding. I just dont like the mind spike glyph at all, it feels like a waste of slot. Still i see alot of good geared Spriest using it and still not passing me by on the meters( just an example).

    Ofcours like everyone knows the 6% spell damage reduction is great against casters! who knew?! Just like i said a couple of times i switch those glyphs or talents when i feels it's the right time or just feel like using it. The Same goes with ur choice of Disperion i guess it's just a preferance on playstyle. A 15 sec reduction is cool and all, but i prefer something else. Like i said before, Switching talents and stuff trying things out what is better against other classes is great fun and u learn a little more about it. (psst duels) Those ARE real situations and is great fun. I dont say u need to completely alter ur playstyle but some glyphs/talents work better then others.
    Maybe i just cant find myself in ur playstyle, perhaps thats the issue here.

    This thread isn't about how to do this and that againt casters or what ever i appreciate the effort but i was only talking about The actual use of Void tendrils. -> OP.

    Just real quick, once again i was talking about duels NOt arena cus like yea thats just something different anyways. I am not here to flame you man, it isn't cookiecutter anymore IMO. So people tend to use different stuff. I dont feel like going into a discussion what is better and what not. OP had a issue he was facing and i was trying to help and not talking about how to face affliction lol.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2012-12-30 at 12:56 AM.

  18. #18
    Bloodsail Admiral dannypoos's Avatar
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    Guys what's your opinion on prayer of mending glyph ? I use alot and I havent seen meny others using it.
    I use PoM nearly on cd too soo I find it really good, but I do mostly bg's

  19. #19
    You realy dont need to tell me how the glyphs work.
    apparently I do

    I was only talking about the tendrils being a much better choice in MOST cases, so not all! BEWARE! it's still fine never said it sucked.
    they aren't better in most cases, as my examples made the point of if you even half paid attention you would see they are not better against anyone except a warrior WHEN hes has zerk rage up and only then

    while waiting on that cd to come back up you might either lose the proc or u could have done alot more meanwhile.
    I'm not suggesting you stand there doing nothing while it comes off CD

    Still i see alot of good geared Spriest using it and still not pasing me by on the meters.
    meters, thanks for bothering to read where I said its not about the damage.....meters? seriously?

    Switching talents and stuff trying things out what is better against other classes is great fun and u learn a little more about it (psst duels) Those ARE real situations.
    didn't say I never duel I just don't sit in durotar all day, and you learn very little useful strategic info by using tools you wont have when you come across that situation in any other activity

    This thread isn't about how to do this and that againt casters or what ever i appreciate the effort but i was only talking about The actual use of Void tendrils. -> OP.
    reading comprehension eludes you

  20. #20
    Brewmaster Alanar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dannypoos View Post
    Guys what's your opinion on prayer of mending glyph ? I use alot and I havent seen meny others using it.
    I use PoM nearly on cd too soo I find it really good, but I do mostly bg's
    I use both Renew and prayer anytime it's up, but i haven't realy been using this one so far. I might try give it a go for fun. Does it stil provide any decent increase even with the offheal nerf?

    @ Vicarious Sorry you dont get the message that i was trying to tell you. You seem to miss it. Try to be helpfull and not trying to smart some one out for no reason. It's not even correct info.
    Last edited by Alanar; 2012-12-30 at 01:07 AM.

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