The problem I see with these threads is that people argue in a very black and white way. The fact is that both the game and community is worse than ever and at the same time they're really not.
The problem I see with these threads is that people argue in a very black and white way. The fact is that both the game and community is worse than ever and at the same time they're really not.
I agree with this. Even some small small UI changes would really help to improve the community experience. For example, why not at the end of each random dungeon pop up a window (similar to the loot window) that allows you to add any of your party members to your Friends/RealID list, or put them on a blacklist/ignore? The recipient would of course need to agree before becoming RealID friends. Sure it's easy to just to right click the portrait blah blah, etc etc but having a prompt pop up well...prompts someone to actually do it. Will everyone? Of course not, but it's such a simple thing that would surely help. Something else would need to take place in LFR though, as I don't think anyone would be thrilled about having a prompt with 24 names pop up
Similarly, and I'm sure this horse has been beaten to death, there should really be an option to group up with your realm or your battlegroup. This is a bit harder to implement than a simple UI change, but it would really open up some options and let you meet friends closer to "home". It would help to return the sense of community that people long for from vanilla/BC, while adding the spectacular quality-of-life change that LFD introduced in the first place. Longer queue times of course, but better than spamming in trade like you used to do. And at the end of the dungeon, same thing. Prompt to add friends or blacklist enemies. Beautiful.
I was expecting someone to point that one out, and I agree that it would be a problem, perhaps adding a % damage done threshold would help reduce that problem, and it is definitely something that would need tinkering, but if you consider the current alternative, i think it would be better anyways.
there are FAR more people willing to sit there and let you die to just collect one kill from a mob than even people who would hit the target for a few swings and let you kill it yourself, some damage is better than none imo.
Fod Sparta los wuth, ahrk okaaz gekenlok kruziik himdah, dinok fent kos rozol do daan wah jer do Samos. Ahrk haar do Heracles fent motaad, fah strunmah vonun fent yolein ko yol.
What difference does it make to me if someoneone tags stuff, as long as I get exp and loot, when I do golden lotus quests some people just put a dot on an elite mob im downing and run off, does it bother me, not at all why should I care im killing it anyway. Now if someone was to run around tagging mobs and hoping other people then do the work for them, well thats easy just dont attack and let him over aggro and die. Really isnt an issue in GW2, its not an issue in WoW when you can mob share either.
The only time i enjoy seeing people who arent in my party is when elite mobs need to be killed, like those ones for the firelands dailies or golden lotus dailies.
It really isn't. The people that would do that are the same people that would ignore you if they didn't get anything from it. Instead a lot more people will see an incentive to assist other players. In addition it will really help against situations where there's too many players for respawn rates to handle it properly. If nothing else it will improve the flow.
THE COMMUNITY BECOMES WHAT THE GAME BECOMES.
It's inevitable. The game is the problem. I completely stopped caring about the game after wotlk. The true wow to me, was TBC/vanilla. We all know how blizzard have changed the game.
This is completely true. It works in every game that has it, Rift, GW2, and LotRO are prime examples. I expect Blizz will come around on it, but not until the next xpac.
They've even stated they don't like the feeling that you are competing with everyone around you instead of working together. It's only a matter of time. I think people would complain about the daily design far less if a group effort of whoever is there can just run around and smash it out...you know...like heroes would do anyways.
Does kind of illustrate a gigantic huge problem with the community, and why these things had to be made, though.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 06:48 PM ----------
Aren't they still? It's not like people actually invite people into non-LF content all willy nilly. If anything, it's gotten monstrously worse with time.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 06:50 PM ----------
This is exactly it, EXACTLY it. I'd even go as to make an entirely unfounded hypothesis that most of the people who complain about this, at least on some level, have treated certain people like shit, felt they were above someone, or probably have some sort of opinion on "fails" or "bads" or some nonsense.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 06:59 PM ----------
A big problem with the community, especially THIS community, as in MMOC's community, is that they seemingly can't separate a bad person from a bad player, and treat them universally with the same contempt and vitriol. Moreover, they have a thin line in which they separate "acceptable" and "not acceptable". The community has so many problems, and Blizzard, frankly, sees zero problems with it.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 07:09 PM ----------
I really, really, really like this idea. It's something several XBOX Live games do after matches. Where it shows the players, let's you add them as friends, or avoid them, and depending on that, it aggregates a star score. Most everyone on XBOX Live will wind up with a 5 star score, so if you see someone who isn't new, and has low stars, or ANYTHING below three, you sure as hell know that person isn't swell.
Another thing they could really, really work on, is their original Raid finder tool, the one that just lets you list yourself available for normal raids/RBGs. Turn that into a sort of group finder, like the old one, but better, to find people who want to do certain content with people. Maybe have options like "Requires voice chat" "Requires so and so". "Requires hat", whatever. Keep that same realm only, and make it actually intuitive instead of worthless, and I bet you'd see a rise in people pugging content and RBGs
Actually the game is better than it ever was. Frankly, people clamoring for the old days are people who were "hardcore" and enjoyed their imaginary status in a virtual world.
You know, back in the days it was worse if you compare it to now.
But somehow when i look back, it had something cool about it > even the struggle in most parts made you feel like a GOD when u completed it.
Now i accomplish things without even noticing im on it.
But yea, it was worse.
Oh, so you don't mind that people will bot the heck out of that feature?
Well, on my own level, it bothers me.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 08:42 PM ----------
Not in my country, we have data protection laws precisely for that.
---------- Post added 2012-12-31 at 08:44 PM ----------
Nope, it's the other way around. The society (and specifically, its loss of structure and the rise of individualism) is the cause and the game is the consequence, not the other way around.
MMO player
WoW: 2006-2020 || EvE: 2013-2020 // 2023- || FFXIV: 2020- || Lost Ark: 2022-
I still have fun in WoW, not sure about all you folks. There have been some idiots in every time period of the game, you just must be better at finding them than me
Its worse than it was before, game is getting old and newer games are better than it.
It's almost unavoidable: most people change (slowly over time) from helpful clueless newbie type having fun trying out different things and probably failing a lot (and accepting it) to an experienced skilled player who simply won't accept dumb mistakes or bad performance anymore from other players.
Happens in all games as far as I can tell. I used to play Quake 3 and Starcraft 1 extensively before WoW and the same shit happened - community got WAY more skilled on average but also WAY more arrogant and intolerant to newbies in the process.
Because once you stop being a newbie you start playing in a different "league" and expect the players you play with to not be significantly worse than you yourself are.
Last edited by TaurenNinja; 2012-12-31 at 08:51 PM.
I remember when rock was young.
1.) Its certainly more Wrath than it is BC.Start of WotLK can hardly be called "during WotLK", that's like saying slurpy is an overall good drink judging only by first sips.
Mind your tone will you? Here are the facts:
http://inanage.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/wow-subs.jpg
What exactly happened in 2009? Whole Acti-Blizz merger and casual direction mess. Now ask yourself how would it be if the blizzard kept updating like it did but kept it philosophy from start. LFD/LFR with consequences for bad behaviour, same for CRZ, Telling players to simply man up and conquer the content just like in TBC? Somehow the subscriptions kept rising during those dark cruel times. How is that?
2.) I get really tired of this "LULZ WRATH OF THE CASUALS" nonsense. Wrath saw the highest number of subscribers. Wrath is credited as having one of, if not the best, raid dungeons ever (Ulduar). There is example after example that Wrath is what people wanted. Perhaps it was tuned a tad too easy, yes. That is why Cataclysm became harder (But still not as hard as BC), and people rejected it. People sub when a new game is immediately coming out. That is what the uptick is at the "end" of BC.
Perhaps YOU should get your facts right.
Again, exceptions to the rule. Outliers. Although I like how you immediately suggest that its because I have no respect for myself or my leisure time. Awesome argumentative strategy dude.and I played back then and this was just true. There were always some guilds or two who were universally hated and avoided, and they were not exceptions of the rule. You either grew apathethic and played with whatever came up with little respect for your leisure time or you are vastly overestimating the power of alianation.
I am saying that there were more subscribers in Wrath than BC. This is a fact. I am saying that LFR caused people to play with more people than just on their server. This is a fact (And something you were bitching about in a previous post). Just because you're randomly adding in qualifications based on absolutely nothing doesn't mean what's actually happened. I do enjoy, though, how you take the negative interactions with people in LFR and extend that to the whole service.with more than ever? Could you correct that because it doesnt make sense? with more with whom? with what? If you meant playing more with each other then I think you confused played "with each other" and "next to each other". That's a HUGE difference.
and players mostly played with people they knew through guilds or friend lists. GREAT! ISNT THAT THE POINT OF SOCIALIZING IN MMORPGS?!
Because, you know, people NEVER were assholes when you only grouped up with them on their server.
Regardless of what your personal opinion is about a dungeon finder, people want it. People wanted it so bad that when SWTOR purposefully did NOT put it in initially, the backlash was amazing, and they then added it. Anecdotes (Which are essentially all of the 'complaints' from LFR/LFD come down to) are not scientific evidence. Sorry.
Hipster? Hardly. I'm just not warping the past to fit my narrative.That's not bashing. That's stating the truth, you're just hipster enough to make it look like it's bad.
This person has it exactly correct.The only time the greater populace of WoW doesn't act like complete assholes is when things are new and undiscovered. The early game of WoW and the beginning of each expansion are the only times this really happens, and it's because everybody is on roughly even ground.
Last edited by KrazyK923; 2012-12-31 at 11:08 PM.