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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUntsAhts View Post
    DP can actually be on a 30 second cooldown, just have to give up Clemency, sadly. I like the change, but will have to test it out to be sure. Considerign copying my paladin to the PTR to see if PvP is bearable.
    In practice, you'll never get a 30 second cooldown Divine Protection because you won't be able to use anywhere near the amount of finishers that would take. It's realistically 45-50 seconds.

  2. #202
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    In practice, you'll never get a 30 second cooldown Divine Protection because you won't be able to use anywhere near the amount of finishers that would take. It's realistically 45-50 seconds.
    Plus, without Clemency I'm not even sure I'd have a spot in my 3v3 team :d

  3. #203
    Keyboard Turner
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    What about glyph of immediate truth?
    How could this affect our sustain? Since we are mostly just bursting and not peeling
    +Aint hand of purity getting a slight buff, making it 10%reduced damage income?

  4. #204
    Mechagnome Lethora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by josipf View Post
    What about glyph of immediate truth?
    How could this affect our sustain? Since we are mostly just bursting and not peeling
    +Aint hand of purity getting a slight buff, making it 10%reduced damage income?
    Immediate truth is a sustained dps loss.
    Lethora, 90 Protection Paladin, Shadowsong-EU
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    Raiding 25man, 10hrs/week, 14/14H.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by josipf View Post
    What about glyph of immediate truth?
    How could this affect our sustain? Since we are mostly just bursting and not peeling
    +Aint hand of purity getting a slight buff, making it 10%reduced damage income?
    Indeed hand of purity is getting buffed, but i still wouldn't give up clemency for it. It's just too good.
    What is mind? No matter.
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  6. #206
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Since you can change your talents in the arena countdown, I'd change to HoPur only if the opposing team is like Warlock + Shadow Priest or so. Anything else and you'll probably need clemency much more.

  7. #207
    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    In practice, you'll never get a 30 second cooldown Divine Protection because you won't be able to use anywhere near the amount of finishers that would take. It's realistically 45-50 seconds.
    Yeah only some lucky Divine Purpose procs can bring you close to 30sec. By the way, baseline Unbreakable Spirit for Ret and Prot sounds like a good idea to me.

  8. #208
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    Plus, without Clemency I'm not even sure I'd have a spot in my 3v3 team :d
    You have a spot on a 3v3 team?

    Yeah, you're right about Divine Prot CD - been in the prot mindset where I use Divine Purpose and its CD is actually pretty damn short.
    Hand of Purity still won't be worth it. In my opinion, for Ret, they should make it like Ironbark is for Resto druids. The target takes 20% less damage. 70% dot damage is too specific and situational, and the 10% reduction for 6 seconds isn't good enough to beat clemency.

  9. #209
    Warchief Velshin's Avatar
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    Does anyone have some nostalgia for Retri after that FoL 50% buff? with selfless healer talent it kinda remind me of TBC retri.

  10. #210
    The OOMadin? Yeah, I can see why having to cast FoL would remind you of that...
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumineus View Post
    The OOMadin? Yeah, I can see why having to cast FoL would remind you of that...
    I think he means wrath not tbc.

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    Does anyone have some nostalgia for Retri after that FoL 50% buff? with selfless healer talent it kinda remind me of TBC retri.
    That's probably referring to Sword of Light.. it's most likely not a big 50% increase but a 15% increase going from 130% to 150%.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    That's probably referring to Sword of Light.. it's most likely not a big 50% increase but a 15% increase going from 130% to 150%.
    Yeah wondering the same myself.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-16 at 02:04 AM ----------

    Well looks like it really will be a massive buff to flash of light, GC just confirmed sword of light will increase Flash of Light by 100%. Big buff... but... it makes Selfless Healer mandatory for Ret, which is bad design, it also puts us back on the roller coaster of too much healing or not enough. GC also says in the same post that they wanted MoP paladins to have more offensive pressure, but I don't see that happening without our own version of repent that is instant cast. and a buff to the rest of that tier so it can compete..a root on BoG for example.
    Last edited by Tangra; 2013-01-16 at 02:08 AM.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Tangra View Post
    Yeah wondering the same myself.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-16 at 02:04 AM ----------

    Well looks like it really will be a massive buff to flash of light, GC just confirmed sword of light will increase Flash of Light by 100%. Big buff... but... it makes Selfless Healer mandatory for Ret, which is bad design, it also puts us back on the roller coaster of too much healing or not enough. GC also says in the same post that they wanted MoP paladins to have more offensive pressure, but I don't see that happening without our own version of repent that is instant cast. and a buff to the rest of that tier so it can compete..a root on BoG for example.
    I think the type of role the devs expect paladins to play on the battlefield is one of this

    1) offensive pressure, using self heals plus your team healers heals to keep yourself alive and making you an powerhouse melee force. With our ability to get out of snares instantly/freedom and fast movement, we are just huge masses of unstoppable melee pressure. Our only weakness really is fear

  15. #215
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    A root on BoG and a 30 sec cd instant repentance(Ret only) would make that tier amazing. It'd make it a meaningful choice.
    That'd be pretty sweet. That would put Repent for Ret on par with Feral Cyclone next patch.
    Last edited by Valedus; 2013-01-16 at 02:26 AM.

  16. #216
    The FoL buff is 50% to what it is already doing, average 55k in Malevolent.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by Tangra View Post
    Well looks like it really will be a massive buff to flash of light, GC just confirmed sword of light will increase Flash of Light by 100%. Big buff... but... it makes Selfless Healer mandatory for Ret, which is bad design
    Agree. I don't know why they didn't just make it baseline for ret since the beginning. It's simply a ret pvp talent and offers us off-healing utility in addition to survival. They could replace it with a talent that is not too strong against EF and SS.

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Velshin View Post
    What I wonder as a paladin class player is that the Holy spec of this class is like a mage class. By saying that I mean there was not a single moment in WoW history that you feel holy spec of paladin is so weak or so unplayable either in pvp or pve..somehow only Ret suffering from this probem. Holy spec paladin is either OP or very good you never see it underpowered ever in pve or pvp.
    I guess you didn't raid in Sunwell. Or should I say Shamanwell Plateau. We were miles and a half behind all other healers in there. So no Holy has not always been OP. Besides wanting to see Holy nerfed in the hopes of Retri buffs is pretty pathetic. Sorry to say.

  19. #219
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    We don't necessarily want Holy nerfed, we want there to be a reason to bring a Ret Paladin that a Holy Paladin isn't just a better option.

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnmatrix View Post
    Agree. I don't know why they didn't just make it baseline for ret since the beginning. It's simply a ret pvp talent and offers us off-healing utility in addition to survival. They could replace it with a talent that is not too strong against EF and SS.
    Well, they just buffed EF on self and fixed SS so that you might actually get a shield from it. Regardless of how strong it is relative to the other two, people were still going to take SH just because it offers more dispel protection than SS and consumes less time/resources than EF. Hypothetically EF could be very strong because you can troll SpellAlert with it at one holy power, the problem is in practicality Ret is too squishy to engage in long play outlast tactics like that.
    OMG 13:37 - Then Jesus said to His disciples, "Cleave unto me, and I shall grant to thee the blessing of eternal salvation."

    And His disciples said unto Him, "Can we get Kings instead?"

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