Starting to understand the "Forced Dailies" argument

[KCguy]

If people want to cap valor points, do one dungeon a day (80 vp), one scenerio every day (40vp) for a week and you'll almost be capped. An hour a day. It's that easy. lol. Dailies aren't even necessary. Yeah if you want to get a few vp pieces sure you'll have to grind a certain faction, but so what? By no means do you have to grind every single faction. And if you don't want valor pieces, do LFR or even craft a bit of gear. Even if there's a few pieces you need that won't drop in LFR, is it so bad to have to grind a faction or two to get the vp piece? Not really.

[Faroth]

Apparently my raid is having trouble with some of the DPS not pulling their weight.

I was questioned about one or two pieces of my gear, and asked why I didn't have Valor gear in those slots.

I responded "because I dislike doing dailies."

They responded by saying if I didn't do them, I could be cut.

Of course there are alternatives..
-Don't raid
-Find another raid

Neither of which appeal to me.

So I dare say that I'm being "forced" to do dailies.

If you're raiding, then you're getting valor. If you do LFR once that's 450. Can't imagine weekly valor cap is difficult to reach.

No rep, no valor gear? No problem! Start upgrading.

2/2 helm
2/2 shoulders
2/2 chest
2/2 legs
Boots, gloves, belt are lower ilvl? Shouldn't be a problem as your valor point upgrading should start to offset those pieces you're waiting on.

[snuzzle]

Do you even know how much Vp you need to upgrade all your gear.... even if you spent it on NOTHING but upgrades, you wouldn't have enough. And that's presuming you are only spending it on BiS pieces and not things that are important like weapons/trinkets.

It doesn't matter how much you need, because you can't upgrade non-VP/non-epic gear with VP.

[alucardtnuoc]

It doesn't matter how much you need, because you can't upgrade non-VP/non-epic gear with VP.

But you just complained about not having things to spend VP on.... so what the hell are you trying to complain about.

1 item to upgrade = 1500
16 possible items to upgrade = 24000 (22500 if you use a single 2h)
24000 VP = 24 weeks to gather

If you are claiming that in 3 weeks you can't get a SINGLE item to upgrade i am calling bullshit. Crafted items, world drops, BMAH, regular AH, LFR, heroic dungeons and raids ALL can and do provide epics.

you do NOT need to do ANY rep grinds for ANY gear.

[Deleted]

As raider, I'd rather use my valor points for item upgrades instead of wasting them on the subpar 496 items.

[Bathory]

Use a flask

[Deleted]

Mentality like that is why I will never, ever raid. Not really a Blizzard or Warcraft problem, so much as a players taking the game too seriously problem. Of course, Blizzard encourages that with the way the gear system works, so it is partly their fault.

If you want to explore and strive to compete in a MMORPG you need to put in such effort.
Some people play to level up and then stand around in Stormwind roleplaying.
Some people play to raid and only level up because they have to, in order to continue raiding. These people often get bored with super casual raiding where people can't be bothered to put effort into their character, via daily quests, professions, enchants etc.
Some people play to kill other players and only level up because they have to, in order to continue competing.

If people didn't have reason to take WoW seriously the game would have less subscribers than Aion or AoC.

Personally, I raid. And I want to raid with people who simcraft themselves after every item upgrade and research theory every day. And do their dailies when there's an upgrade available there. And do PVP if there's an upgrade there.

As raider, I'd rather use my valor points for item upgrades instead of wasting them on the subpar 496 items.

The intellect ring for a non-spirit user is not subpar.

[Beefhammer]

Apparently my raid is having trouble with some of the DPS not pulling their weight.

I was questioned about one or two pieces of my gear, and asked why I didn't have Valor gear in those slots.

I responded "because I dislike doing dailies."

They responded by saying if I didn't do them, I could be cut.

Of course there are alternatives..
-Don't raid
-Find another raid

Neither of which appeal to me.

So I dare say that I'm being "forced" to do dailies.

Sucks to be in your position. I would leave and find a better group of people to play with. There are plenty of good guilds that do not require you to do anything but know your role. If your group is really having issues with DPs and not getting through fights 2 items will not fix your groups problems. The group has other issues.

[Deleted]

Sucks to be in your position. I would leave and find a better group of people to play with. There are plenty of good guilds that do not require you to do anything but know your role. If your group is really having issues with DPs and not getting through fights 2 items will not fix your groups problems. The group has other issues.

But 2 items on 10 or 25 players would. That's the point.

20 or 50 items will make a HUGE difference.

[alucardtnuoc]

But 2 items on 10 or 25 players would. That's the point.

20 or 50 items will make a HUGE difference.

Depends, if they're all say gloves and bracers, it's very minor upgrade to the raid.

If they were weapons or tier it would have the potential to be a lot larger.

[Sengiratolom]

Apparently my raid is having trouble with some of the DPS not pulling their weight.

I was questioned about one or two pieces of my gear, and asked why I didn't have Valor gear in those slots.

I responded "because I dislike doing dailies."

They responded by saying if I didn't do them, I could be cut.

Of course there are alternatives..
-Don't raid
-Find another raid

Neither of which appeal to me.

So I dare say that I'm being "forced" to do dailies.

Quite ironical that you say that some of your dpsers aren't pulling their weight, seeing the statements you wrote yourself.

1) your guild lacks dps
2) you have been slacking on ways to improve your gear
3) someone points out that you could improve a thing or 2 with valor items.
4) you outright tell them that you are to lazy to improve your gear

Do you realy expect upto 9/24 others to work harder or spend evenings wiping because you (and perhaps others like you) cba to actually prepare?
Your guild is totaly right about wanting to replace you for that, there are plenty who want to raid and are willing to gather the gear and consumables for raids.
There is a huge diff between valor gear and BoE epics, valor is gained by activities that give you gold and the extra roll coins= you should do those anyway, BoE epics might not be an option for your budget as you have to spend gold (or get lucky) to aquire them.

Wonder what your collegues would say if you were to lazy to get something of a table 10 meters away and instead tell them that you cba and would rather daydream instead of using the tools you were given to get the job done, effectively telling them to work overtime because you didn't do your share. Or (depending on the task) to not finish it in time due to a deadline. Especially when your superior points out that you could work more effectively if you would install a certain program (found on a dvd an arms length away).

Your choice: shape up or step up.

[Stevegasm]

I carefully skimmed as I got here 4 pages in, but there is one question I didn't see asked:
Was your gear actually the issue? Was your DPS on the low end of the meter? If so, was your rotation optimal? (this can usually be told by uptime of debuffs/DoTs or a percentage of abilities used, and so on. There is so much that can affect performance besides gear. But if everything else was executed perfectly, then yeah, worry about gear.

Having said that on page 3 of this post, parkerlynee, and Fenixdown made great points. If you were ever in any sort of team situation growing up, you'll understand, be it arts, sports, or even just your regular job. I grew up playing sports most of my life. If I wanted to be on the team and help the team, I had to show up to practice during the season, and keep in shape during the off season. None of which I found particularly fun, but I wanted to play on game day, so had to do what it took. I also did musical theatre. That was a few weeks of rehearsal and practice until the big show.

When you play an MMO, you have to go in taking with you the mindset that you will at some point have to work as a team and compromise to do what you enjoy. MMOs are no different than team sports in that way. If you're not into being responsible to a team, then you can just stick to the single player aspect of WoW (in which the game does a great job of compared to other MMOs). I've had athletic friends who stuck to tennis, track & field, golf, and so on simply because they hated having to be relied on or relying on a team.

[Airwaves]

Raids are made to do in heroic blues. If your guild can't do enough dps for normal modes in blues then you shouldn't be in there.

[wow2011]

But 2 items on 10 or 25 players would. That's the point.

20 or 50 items will make a HUGE difference.

This is true if people can put their gear into use. Keep in mind that some people might increase dps by 2000 by upgrading 2 pieces and some people might only increase dps by 500. So it's completely possible that 20 pieces of gears only buys the raid 3.5k dps increase (calculating using 6 dps + 2 tank setup).

The way I see it is that if a raid is pointing problem to gear when everyone only has ~2 blue pieces then the problem is in skill. It will likely help his guild more if OP logged the parse and link some parse and armory instead of saying dailies are forced.

[Banzhe]

Apparently my raid is having trouble with some of the DPS not pulling their weight.

I was questioned about one or two pieces of my gear, and asked why I didn't have Valor gear in those slots.

I responded "because I dislike doing dailies."

They responded by saying if I didn't do them, I could be cut.

Of course there are alternatives..
-Don't raid
-Find another raid

Neither of which appeal to me.

So I dare say that I'm being "forced" to do dailies.

I dare say, you as a human being and a player decide wether or not you want to pursue this type of play style.

A) You decide you want to play with these players, this guild.., then you're not forced to do anything you haven't signed up for.

B) You decide you don't want to do dailies regardless of what is being said within the guild, and as such you accept the possibility of being cut from the group, because you are not pulling your own weight in respect to the guilds demands.

There's no other options, there's nothing being forced.., there's only whiny little babbies trying to skew everything.

Inb4 someone goes; Dooh, it's not a 2nd job, I dislike bla bla..

Your right, it's not a job, it's a game where you do what you sign on to doing.

[DetectiveJohnKimble]

I never said I was the one with DPS issues.

Then you're not in danger of being cut, you don't need to do dailies for the VP gear, and you'll continue to outperform the people in your raid who are doing the extra things for gear.

Basically, you're not facing an issue here where you're being forced to do dailies.

[Deleted]

OP, try this;

"I too am forced to play WoW in order to get WoW stuff. Why can't I get shiny stuff without playing the game?"

Every step of the game encompasses the premise that if you want A, you must perform B. You accept it when you play the game. But like every person that has complained on this subject before you you are complaining that whilst you accept having to do B to get A, you're not happy about doing D to get C.

If you want, you must do. If you don't, you won't.

[Kalcheus]

guilds wont let you use pvp gear for progression and pugs wont let you join with pvp gear either

Then they're stupid.

An i483 PVP gear has the same PVE stat budget as an i483 PVE gear. The only place you may get hurt in comparison is with socket bonuses. But a Malevolent Gladiator's Band of Cruelty has the same stats as the Fragment of Fear Made Flesh (LFR version).

[thunderdragon2]

Then they're stupid.

An i483 PVP gear has the same PVE stat budget as an i483 PVE gear. The only place you may get hurt in comparison is with socket bonuses. But a Malevolent Gladiator's Band of Cruelty has the same stats as the Fragment of Fear Made Flesh (LFR version).

that may be true for slots like rings and neck but it wont hold of a lot for other slots, then you have to go through the argious task of arena and according to some people pvp is harder then pve also some people may dislike arena/rbgs and random bgs are dependent on the randoms you get. hmm interesting without an arena rating the conquest cap is 2200

wonder when that change came in

[Seranthor]

And if upgrades weren't strictly behind gated daily content, I'd actually have alternatives.

Sadly, its still not Blizzard's problem, its between you and your raid group.