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  1. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    The storyline isn't terrible. It's decent. But it's still fillers. 5.2 offers although will seem to change it.
    By your reckoning, all you want is a beginning and an end, no story. Most of a story is the filler. Take Lord of the Rings, Frodo gets sent on a mission, Frodo destroys the ring. Anything else that happens is filler material. So there is no story. Infact that was a bad example, Star Trek, has millions of fans, by your reckoning, most of that shouldn't exist. An episode may not be important to the overall main story, but its another story which become part of the universe and gives you a deeper understanding of that universe, the characters, the politics, sets the tone. - This is what makes it so popular and interesting to those people. So yes, it could be considered "filler" but without that, the story and universe that is huge would be tiny and very uninteresting.

    I don't know a huge amount about the background to the wow lore, because there are other fictional universes that I find are far more indepth and are more too my liking. Pandaria is another story arc, that has clues and new information about existing lore aswell as expanding on some existing lore. You learn more about existing characters and races. Alot of the lore in Pandaland is interesting, new and quite exciting to a lot of people and they aren't just completely rehashing the same stuff they have used previously. There is so much to it that is new and interesting and without it would be a VERY dull and boring experience like many other story's out there, rather than its own thing.


    Also, Lore - The backstory created around a fictional universe.


    anyway, I'm tired and my point may not be clear.

  2. #222
    The Insane Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tikaru View Post
    Kezotar doesn't believe that anything beyond Warcraft 3 is lore or storyline.
    How did it even drift into lore arguments when his main complaint was his alt with which he just hit 90 and finds himself 100k health behind everyone else, and no pvp weap... Which to me sounds that the game works as intended.
    I'd lose every motivation to progress anything, if every new toon is right up there with everyone else...
    And I fail to see how faster content would close that intended gap.

  3. #223
    Gated content lasts longer, non gated content does not. It's not about forcing the same content down your throat, but limiting you just enough so that you feel you progress. Imagine if all 3 raids were made available at the same time, now imagine people finishing those raids within 2 days, now wait 4 months until a new tier comes out.

  4. #224
    The Patient nulir's Avatar
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    All I hear is QQ from you mate...

    You do know that by your logic that Illidan and Arthas aren't lore because they were made in War3 not War1.

    Yes please by all means switch to Rift and goodriddance I feel sorry for their community for gaining someone like you but happy for ours for "losing" you.

  5. #225
    I still believe that they should let the ppl play the way they want, what's the problem if a player want to spend the entire day farming 5k of VP? Maybe he will take a vacation next week, or maybe his raid group are having trouble with some boss and he want to upgrade his gear to help, but no, he must wait the entire week because of the stupid and low cap...

  6. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    This is what doesn't let me turn off the computer, either way, last answer before bed. If you think that the Pantheons aren't releated to WoW and think they were presented in WC3 sure. But Hey, I've read over thousand of articles about the lores, guess what? I probably know almost nothing of it. WoW Universe is HUGE. Either way, goodnight. Stop posting, after op leaves and make silly assumptions.

    Tikaru - http://www.wowpedia.org/Pantheon Read on for each of the titans. Check their history and you'll realise my points It's nothing with Warcraft 3. I played that game but not half as much as the previous games. But that's not where I started to read about the lore. It's interesting and WoWs lore is probably bigger than LOTRS by FAR:

    nighty night.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-03 at 06:27 AM ----------



    Is a video of the happening with censored name enough of proof? If yes, let me know on PM and I can fix that for you.
    Now you're just talking out of your ass. WoW's lore, meaning central, cohesive, unaltered lore, bigger than LotRs? Bwahahahaha.

    You do realize that Tolkien invented two entire languages, actual languages, not pithy little phrases, for his books right?

    As well as write an extensive, annotated history for the entire planet.

    All by himself.

    Whereas WoW has an army of writers, and they can't even agree on whom corrupted who when it comes to Sargeras and the Eredar.
    Last edited by Chrysia; 2013-01-03 at 05:36 AM.

    3DS Friend Code: 0146-9205-4817. Could show as either Chris or Chrysia.

  7. #227
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otiswhitaker View Post
    The gating is necessary for them to keep people paying a monthly fee. That'd be unacceptable in anything but a subscription MMO/something where more than one payment is needed. Artificial gating is horrible, and serves no one but themselves, and MMOs are pretty much the only genre on earth saddled with it.
    I don't feel that they do it to get people to keep paying. People will pay for access per month even if the content was consumed faster...that's what alts are for. They do it for two reasons:

    - Gives them time to develop quality content. Quality, not quantity. Quality, not garbage, though I won't pretend every piece of content has been excellent. They've had their mistakes. But it ensures they can release content and be confident that they have some time to design the next pieces.

    - Keeps people from burning themselves out excessively. Think about what people say about dailies now. Since the 25 daily limit was removed all we hear is about people who talk about how they're forced to do every single daily they can do instead of picking and choosing. Now, granted, adding charms/VP to the dailies did make the more attractive, but it's the limit removal that made people feel they have to do them. If we had no cap on VP per week you can imagine the nightmare of people who would stay up until 5am every day to get as much VP as they can get, and then they'd blame Blizzard for losing their job or their relationship.



  8. #228
    The Insane Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrysia View Post
    Now you're just talking out of your ass. WoW's lore, meaning central, cohesive, unaltered lore, bigger than LotRs? Bwahahahaha.

    You do realize that Tolkien invented two entire languages, actual languages, not pithy little phrases, for his books right?

    As well as right an extensive, annotated history for the entire planet.

    All by himself.

    Whereas WoW has an army of writers, and they can't even agree on who corrupted who when it comes to Sargeras and the Eredar.
    LOTR isn't even everything.
    LOTR is rather a sequel of The Hobbit, and, despite of being released just after tolkiens death, The Silmarillion. That book alone could fill multiple movies, let alone MMOs.
    LOTR was the last in the line of Middle Earth stories.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildtree View Post
    LOTR isn't even everything.
    LOTR is rather a sequel of The Hobbit, and, despite of being released just after tolkiens death, The Silmarillion. That book alone could fill multiple movies, let alone MMOs.
    LOTR was the last in the line of Middle Earth stories.
    Yeah, Silmarillon was what I was referring to when I noted the extensive history. It's a goddamned Bible sized book that is basically "A history of Middle-Earth and it's notables."

    3DS Friend Code: 0146-9205-4817. Could show as either Chris or Chrysia.

  10. #230
    Elemental Lord Chickat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    This is what doesn't let me turn off the computer, either way, last answer before bed. If you think that the Pantheons aren't releated to WoW and think they were presented in WC3 sure. But Hey, I've read over thousand of articles about the lores, guess what? I probably know almost nothing of it. WoW Universe is HUGE. Either way, goodnight. Stop posting, after op leaves and make silly assumptions.

    Tikaru - http://www.wowpedia.org/Pantheon Read on for each of the titans. Check their history and you'll realise my points It's nothing with Warcraft 3. I played that game but not half as much as the previous games. But that's not where I started to read about the lore. It's interesting and WoWs lore is probably bigger than LOTRS by FAR:

    nighty night.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-03 at 06:27 AM ----------



    Is a video of the happening with censored name enough of proof? If yes, let me know on PM and I can fix that for you.
    If wow lore is so big then how do you know pandarens arent important? Point and match.
    Send me a PM and suggest a forum avatar based on my title, Immortal.

  11. #231
    The Insane Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    I don't feel that they do it to get people to keep paying. People will pay for access per month even if the content was consumed faster...that's what alts are for. They do it for two reasons:

    - Gives them time to develop quality content. Quality, not quantity. Quality, not garbage, though I won't pretend every piece of content has been excellent. They've had their mistakes. But it ensures they can release content and be confident that they have some time to design the next pieces.

    - Keeps people from burning themselves out excessively. Think about what people say about dailies now. Since the 25 daily limit was removed all we hear is about people who talk about how they're forced to do every single daily they can do instead of picking and choosing. Now, granted, adding charms/VP to the dailies did make the more attractive, but it's the limit removal that made people feel they have to do them. If we had no cap on VP per week you can imagine the nightmare of people who would stay up until 5am every day to get as much VP as they can get, and then they'd blame Blizzard for losing their job or their relationship.
    I sign this..
    Because the moment the cap gets raised there will be the next 2 groups complaining... One that isn't happy with the 3k cap, and the other that feels pressured about how long it takes to get to 3k...
    Right now I think it's quite a happy medium.

  12. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    I was so focused on my main, had to do dailies, grinds etc raiding pvp that guess what. My alt hit max level now. I was thinking going PvP, but wanna know something? The cap that stops me from getting to the content made me say no. I'm playing with blue gear at 2,4k MMR against people with tier 2 upgraded twice. Fair that they have 100k more HP than me and I'm sitting with a non PvP weapon? ( again, lack of gear, there's no PvP blue weapon. )
    There are no caps for Honor and Justice, and your MMR will balance out eventually.
    #blizzisevilebecausetheyarepreventingmefromenjoyingtheirproductswithapricetag #blizzardisprovidinganadditionalservicethatpeopleaskedforandthepeoplewhodidntaskforitarepi ssedbecausetheywanteverythinghandedtothemlikeentitledassholes #whydoessubwaycharge5bucksforasandwichwhenicouldeatmyneighborsdogshitforfree #mcdonaldsmakesenoughmoneyishouldgettheirfoodforfree

  13. #233
    The Insane Wildtree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrysia View Post
    Yeah, Silmarillon was what I was referring to when I noted the extensive history. It's a goddamned Bible sized book that is basically "A history of Middle-Earth and it's notables."
    It's actually my fav... LOTR sucked me up and spit me out once I was through reading it... The Silmarillion, that one just blew me totally away. I think it's the best fantasy book ever written.

  14. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by Ikkarus View Post
    I still believe that they should let the ppl play the way they want, what's the problem if a player want to spend the entire day farming 5k of VP? Maybe he will take a vacation next week, or maybe his raid group are having trouble with some boss and he want to upgrade his gear to help, but no, he must wait the entire week because of the stupid and low cap...
    - If they allow everyone to gather resources in their own tempo, a lot of players will burn out on the content much faster than Blizzard likes. Possibly even, faster than those players themself like. Few people play in a way that maximises their own needs, since we rarely know our needs.
    - If they allow unlimited resources gathering, Blizzard will get a lot of flack for making it easy to get 'addicted' to WoW, maybe even leading to harsh regulations. If I were them, I rather would keep control of regulations in my own hands.

    I do feel myself that Blizzard slows down in making content. They put a lot of work in lore and srroundings - good for immersion. yet the amount of 5-men instances slows down every expansion, and there is the majority of gameplay found imo. However, it is up to Blizzard to make content, we can only decide to play or not.

  15. #235
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    I have a job, thanks for asking. I've been working since 14.

    I wouldn't. My job is flawless as always. I've had people ask me, if I was searching for a better paid job at them. Something I learned was to not do a half finished job. Either go through with it or not.
    And yet, for some reason, you're requesting- nay, DEMANDING that Blizzard starts doing exactly that? Why I say that? Because, as I'm not sure a newbie conspiracy theorist like yourself would know this, when you create something digitally, there are SEVERAL steps to take. To name a few: conceptualization, adaptation, creation, alpha testing, beta testing. Those are just of the steps that come to mind, since I'm not a programmer (and neither are you, what with the way you're making irrational demands at Blizzard), although I did take some programming classes back in college.

    Anyways. Not ONE is done in a single day. Again, not a SINGLE one of those steps happen in just a day, much less having ALL of those steps I mentioned (and those I didn't) together happen in a single week's time. And yet you want them to deliver content faster than they already do! Ugh... the arrogance and entitlement of spoiled kids...

    Also? Your claim that Blizzard is pulling developers from the WoW team to divert them to other projects, and that gated content is proof of that, is one of the biggest BS pseudo-fact I've ever read. Next time you want to make wild claims, back it up with hard facts, not with fallacies even other hardcore conspiracy theorists would have trouble believing.

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  16. #236
    Bloodsail Admiral Goatfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    It's impossible to supply constant content, but without some sort of gate to the current content people would consume it so fast that they'd be out of anything to do well before it's possible to supply more. The gating is necessary.
    It actually is possible and somewhat reasonable to supply constant content of quality, especially in smaller batches.

    (Longish post, be warned)

    As it is though, I think the big problem is (as far as I know) that they do not hire anyone in the psychological fields of work in order to help streamline their content and make it feel good to the players. As an hypothetical example, they believe the best way to please people who want to farm 500 materials to make 10 objects, and people who want to farm 500 materials to make 500 objects, is to allow you to farm 500 materials to make 50 objects as it is the center of what everyone wants. The problem being that after the fact they add in the clear limitation that you can only farm up 500 materials per week in an attempt to make certain that the people trying to max know what the max is, and the people playing casually know how much there is to do. This has already been shown in many of their design changes, such as only being able to do dailies for rep, the change to PvE and PvP currencies, among other things.

    The problem with having such a clear and visible cap is that it is generally counter-productive to show a clear, middle ground goal for players. Level and gear based RPG's for years have already shown that this sort of premise is a bad one, even Diablo and Diablo 2 compared to Diablo 3 have shown this explicitly. When you have a clear middle ground goal you are going to have a good portion of your player base on both ends unhappy; You have your low end casuals who can now see the cap/goal and feel compelled to reach the goal and play more than they would normally want to otherwise feel unhappy that they didn't reach the goal; Then you have your high end players who reach the goal easily and are stuck feeling as though there is nothing more they can do to further their game. The only ones satisfied are the players who play just enough normally to reach the caps each week, Or those who want to and are available to reach the cap on multiple characters per week. It leads to a short term, only slightly repeatable reward system that soon starts feeling more like a necessity than sandbox. Anyone who has played when there was still badges and it was changed over to points can feel this change the most, and should be able to easily recognize the difference in freedoms in a nearly invisible cap versus a clear and visible one. The only real analogy I could think of at this point would be diving into a pool versus being told you can dive into a pool and how deep it is. You take away some of the thrills of exploration and enlightenment when you tell someone everything about it before the experience.

    As far as making new content specifically though, it boils down to what they create and how they introduce it. As of recently things they have introduced as new content has either been bad remakes of currently in place systems (Trying to make Active World Events like RIFT has and ending up with scenarios) or things players have asked for and been ignored for since WoW started (Transmogrification, Void Storage). While I can give them some props on actually finally implementing some things players wanted (even though some of it is a clear attempt at putting something good in to save some face), It's a little disappointing to see the clear give and take in effort put into content when it wasn't so readily visible before. It has become far more common recently to see things clearly put in half complete or not even.

  17. #237
    Bloodsail Admiral WillFeral's Avatar
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    People like the OP are what is wrong with the WoW community.
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  18. #238
    Epic! Blockygame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    Prove me that, how would you know what's happening at Blizzard? T
    How would you know, prove that to us, don't attack people for being level headed. Yes, you're reading way to much into that tweet, I'm at as much as a loss as GC was with that tweet, tell us, how did you come to the conclusion that his tweet was about "cba making new content"?

    To be honest I don't think you made this thread with an intent at being constructive, in fact, nothing worthwhile is going to come from it, you seem to be beyond reasoning.
    HOOKED ON DIABLOL, GOOD TIMES ARE BEING HAD

  19. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by Kezotar View Post
    I played since final beta which was in 2003 or 2004. (EU player).

    WoW at that time had nothing. But they were adding loads of raids, not to talk about BGs and that was all in just 1 release of the game. TBC offered aswell alot of content, we finally came to outland, following lore-wise was something extremely cool. Many new raids, stuff was harder, it was better balanced. WOTLK came also perfect out, lore and content, of course we had LK for a bit too long and NAXX was reused.. Cata again came out as a perfect lore based expansion - sinestra, deathwing, nefarian, onyxia was uneccesary but okey. MOP Nothing, lore is just orc vs human. Which many might say is the original theme of WoW. But that's generalizing the too much. next patch is going to offer the zandalari isles which is going to be awesome, where obviously rastahkan is going to be present - meaning new content. it seems to have some sheds of light, but the release of the expansion was in my eyes a total dissaster, might be different for you. but it felt like a bad korean game gone wild. i have my hopes for next patch, if it brings a failure with overused content..
    To say that MoP is more grindy then original WoW is nonsense. If you were to hit level 60 day 1 of release (which hitting 60 took 3-4 times longer then currently to get to 90 with heirlooms), please tell me what you could do (as compared to everything you can do now), and no you could not even raid MC yet, which even after it came out, was bugged horribly.

  20. #240
    I was going to take a bunch of quotes and respond to them, until I found this:

    Daily quests isn't content. It's fillers. MoP 5.0/1 is a filler.
    Which was followed by this gem:

    Raids, BGs, Dungeons, Quests, not daily quests.
    Not only can you not substantiate claims, provide any evidence that isn't anecdotal, follow the burden of proof, provide cohesive thought processes and responses, but you can't even recognize when you contradict yourself in the span of less than half a page of posts. Unbelievable; someone get this guy a medal because I've never seen someone shoot himself in the foot so eloquently that he doesn't even notice it himself.

    Is a video of the happening with censored name enough of proof? If yes, let me know on PM and I can fix that for you.
    Why... would you make a video when you could just provide a link? That seems like an awful lot of effort to prove you aren't bullshitting, not to mention that censoring the name absolves you of actually proving you aren't bullshitting, thus bring us back to square one.

    If you think that the Pantheons aren't releated to WoW and think they were presented in WC3 sure.
    That's... not what was said, at all, anywhere in this thread. Have you even been paying attention to what's been said in here?

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