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  1. #1
    Mechagnome
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    5.2 Disc - go Mastery, Crit, ...?

    So after the SS + Mastery nerf, will Mastery still be the best stat? Probably not...
    Should I plan on going for Crit?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by TaurenNinja View Post
    So after the SS + Mastery nerf, will Mastery still be the best stat? Probably not...
    Should I plan on going for Crit?
    Spirit Shell no longer benefits from Mastery, and now properly includes the benefits of Divine Aegis and critical effect chance.

    Ok so correct me if am wrong. Spirit shell doesn't benefit from mastery = nerf. BUT, Spirit shell now benefits from divine aegis and critical effect chance = a buff? Now considering divine aegis will now count towards spirit shell and divine aegis scales from our mastery, mastery still should be our best stat.

    Plus divine aegis now shields for 50% of the amount healed, use to be 30%.
    Last edited by Sintea; 2012-12-22 at 07:57 AM.

  3. #3
    I posted this in another thread.

    It's not such a large nerf with PoH, some numbers.
    My mastery: 38.56%, crit 11.02%.
    Tooltip value for GH: 77,993. Spirit Shell GH: 124409. With the nerf: 86588
    Tooltip value for PoH: 29,813. Spirit Shell PoH: 59891 (~tooltip*1.3*mastery*crit). With the nerf and DA/crit fix: 49647 (~tooltip*1.5*crit)
    So SS stacking with PoH is still WAY more than viable. Just a tiny nerf IMO.

    Some are saying since Mastery has an effect on DA that it will in return affect SS, but I don't think that's the case I think it was a fix from the 1.3 to the 1.5 multiplier. We'll just have to see when the PTR is released.

    But to others saying DA has a better proc (50 up from 30), it's already in game. It's just a tooltip fix.

  4. #4
    I'm already going crit. I use archangel an obscene amount, even 2 healing 10 man heroics.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorfie View Post
    I'm already going crit. I use archangel an obscene amount, even 2 healing 10 man heroics.
    I still believe mastery would be better. If ur doing dungeons, lfr and normal's then go ahead with crit u can make due. But the dmg avoided due to mastery is so overpowered that u would definitely still want to go mastery.[COLOR="red"]

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-22 at 03:55 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Clebane View Post
    I posted this in another thread.

    It's not such a large nerf with PoH, some numbers.
    My mastery: 38.56%, crit 11.02%.
    Tooltip value for GH: 77,993. Spirit Shell GH: 124409. With the nerf: 86588
    Tooltip value for PoH: 29,813. Spirit Shell PoH: 59891 (~tooltip*1.3*mastery*crit). With the nerf and DA/crit fix: 49647 (~tooltip*1.5*crit)
    So SS stacking with PoH is still WAY more than viable. Just a tiny nerf IMO.

    Some are saying since Mastery has an effect on DA that it will in return affect SS, but I don't think that's the case I think it was a fix from the 1.3 to the 1.5 multiplier. We'll just have to see when the PTR is released.

    But to others saying DA has a better proc (50 up from 30), it's already in game. It's just a tooltip fix.
    Mind showing me ur math on how u calculate that 30% is in game and not 50%
    Last edited by Sintea; 2012-12-22 at 08:52 AM.

  6. #6
    Keyboard Turner
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sintea View Post
    DA= 30% 29224 x (.4443 + .30) = 21,751
    DA= 50% 29224 x (.4443 + .50) = 27,956

    Seems like da 30% is closer to what i am getting for my da's. I would double check that and then check out what spirit shell is doing with ur fix.
    Order of operations bro. It doesn't work how you said. It works like the following:
    DA = 50% 29224 x .5 * 1.4443
    = 14612 * 1.4443
    = 21104

    Which should be almost exactly what you are getting correct?

  7. #7
    My PoH hit me for 28440 and gave me an absorb of 20822. I have 46.43 mastery.

    28440 x 0.5 x 1.4643 = 20822.346

    Confirmation that the 50% buff is live, and has been live for several weeks:
    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...-505-hotfixes/

    November 20th:
    The shield generated by Divine Aegis now absorbs 50% of the amount healed (was 30%).

  8. #8
    DA for PoH is definitely 50%, but it is 30% for SS PoH.

    So they nerf it by 33% by removing straight mastery multiplier but change 1.3 DA coefficient for SS to 1.5 DA coefficient and somehow change SS interaction with crit.
    It definitely not a huge nerf if it is at all.

    But it is really life improvement because crit reforge should be more viable and that makes Attonement much more stronger.

    TLDR. Not a nerf, maybe even slightly buff.

    Added. Btw, I think we should gem Spi/Int and reforge to Crit in 5.2
    Last edited by Szer; 2012-12-22 at 10:38 AM.

  9. #9
    Well we all knew some sort of SS nerf was comming, I thought it would be more major than this though.



    "Power Word: Solace now has a shorter range, cooldown, no cast time, less direct damage, a DoT component, and replaces Holy Fire."

    I assume it also heals through attonement then? Can someone confirm?
    Last edited by Heap; 2012-12-22 at 11:10 AM.

  10. #10
    I assume it also heals through attonement then? Can someone confirm?
    Do you know PTR doesnt up yet?..

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Heap View Post
    "Power Word: Solace now has a shorter range, cooldown, no cast time, less direct damage, a DoT component, and replaces Holy Fire."

    I assume it also heals through attonement then? Can someone confirm?
    Confirmed if you read the official notes instead of the datamined ones.

    Power Word: Solace has been redesigned.
    Power Word: Solace replaces Holy Fire. It deals the same damage and interacts with other spells and abilities in the same manner, but is instant, costs no mana, and restores 1% of maximum mana on each cast.

    It might be misleading, but it seems to me that it replaces holy fire and will act like holy fire with the additional effects.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Urumii View Post
    Confirmed if you read the official notes instead of the datamined ones.

    Power Word: Solace has been redesigned.
    Power Word: Solace replaces Holy Fire. It deals the same damage and interacts with other spells and abilities in the same manner, but is instant, costs no mana, and restores 1% of maximum mana on each cast.

    It might be misleading, but it seems to me that it replaces holy fire and will act like holy fire with the additional effects.
    Should be better than mind bender too, assuming at least 3 casts per minute (max would be 6 if you used it on cooldown). Not counting the mana you save as Holy fire does cost a little bit of mana.

  13. #13
    The Patient Arainie's Avatar
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    You kind of have to take into account the mastery buff you have during encounters as well. I land at roughly 58% mastery raidbuffed, which is quite a lot more absorption on Spirit Shell than the 38-40% you're calculating with. My prayer of healing heals for rougly 30k only buffed with inner fire, which would be around 33k raidbuffed? Assume that at least, and also assume 16% crit raidbuffed as I'm just below 10% crit unbuffed.

    Current Spirit Shell PoH self buffed: 30233 * 1,4554mastery * 1,3DA * 1,0971crit = 62756 (verified in-game)
    Current Spirit Shell PoH raid buffed: 33000 * 1,58mastery * 1,3DA * 1,16crit = 78627

    Now, assume that Divine Aegis scales with our mastery on Prayer of Healing, but mastery doesn't directly affect Spirit Shell. Divine Aegis would in my case absorb 50%*1,58mastery = 79% radibuffed, hence the calculation will be:

    5.2 Spirit Shell self buffed: 30000 * 1,728DA* 1,0971crit = 56874
    5.2 Spirit Shell raid buffed: 33000 * 1,79DA* 1,16crit = 68521

    The nerf given equal stats, on Spirit Shell spamming PoH (the normal use of it):
    Self Buffed: 56874/62756 = 0,91
    Raid Buffed: 68521/78627 = 0,87

    Hence, the more mastery you currently have, the greater the nerf. It's still not more than a 15% nerf on Spirit Shell, which is probably justified considering that a disc priest who knows how to play should top the meters on pretty much every fight nowdays. Considering Crit requires more points per percentage I wouldn't consider it viable to reforge for crit in a 25 man enviroment, perhaps in a 10 man guild.

  14. #14
    Good theorycrafting there, I completely agree. Though I hate how blizz makes crit like a 600 combat rating and only 340 for mastery. I have no idea what they were thinking, it turns crit off completely for most classes.

  15. #15
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clebane View Post
    Good theorycrafting there, I completely agree. Though I hate how blizz makes crit like a 600 combat rating and only 340 for mastery. I have no idea what they were thinking, it turns crit off completely for most classes.
    If mastery didn't get 2.5% per 600 rating (aka 1 mastery) you wouldn't want to gear for the stat at all as discipline as absorbs do not contribute to all of your healing and crit scales extremely well for everything that is not power word: shield or prayer of healing or under spirit shell (until 5.2 based on current patch notes).

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Arainie View Post
    You kind of have to take into account the mastery buff you have during encounters as well. I land at roughly 58% mastery raidbuffed, which is quite a lot more absorption on Spirit Shell than the 38-40% you're calculating with. My prayer of healing heals for rougly 30k only buffed with inner fire, which would be around 33k raidbuffed? Assume that at least, and also assume 16% crit raidbuffed as I'm just below 10% crit unbuffed.

    Current Spirit Shell PoH self buffed: 30233 * 1,4554mastery * 1,3DA * 1,0971crit = 62756 (verified in-game)
    Current Spirit Shell PoH raid buffed: 33000 * 1,58mastery * 1,3DA * 1,16crit = 78627

    Now, assume that Divine Aegis scales with our mastery on Prayer of Healing, but mastery doesn't directly affect Spirit Shell. Divine Aegis would in my case absorb 50%*1,58mastery = 79% radibuffed, hence the calculation will be:

    5.2 Spirit Shell self buffed: 30000 * 1,728DA* 1,0971crit = 56874
    5.2 Spirit Shell raid buffed: 33000 * 1,79DA* 1,16crit = 68521

    The nerf given equal stats, on Spirit Shell spamming PoH (the normal use of it):
    Self Buffed: 56874/62756 = 0,91
    Raid Buffed: 68521/78627 = 0,87

    Hence, the more mastery you currently have, the greater the nerf. It's still not more than a 15% nerf on Spirit Shell, which is probably justified considering that a disc priest who knows how to play should top the meters on pretty much every fight nowdays. Considering Crit requires more points per percentage I wouldn't consider it viable to reforge for crit in a 25 man enviroment, perhaps in a 10 man guild.
    Thats not right calcultations. in 5.2 SS calculations you should assume that you will reforge from mastery to crit, so SS amount wont hurt even by 10%.

  17. #17
    I just posted some math at elitistjerks.com/f77 analyzing these changes. The upshot is that Crit will be more valuable than Mastery approximately until you're getting something like 35% of your heals from PoH and 30% from PW:S (leaving only 35% to Spirit Shell, Atonement, Cascade/whatever, Prayer of Mending, and everything else). Depending on your spell choice and overheal %, Mastery *can* be better, but for the way I heal Crit is much better.

  18. #18
    Remember that in light of this stat priorities will probably be haste > crit > mastery. Remember that the lower your mastery the less this will affect you. Remember higher haste numbers next tier will result in more PoH fitting into the 15 second spirit shell window. It's really not much of a nerf, and we got another buff to Rapture. We should be happy for now, but I would expect further nerfs before the patch is out.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Halaberiel View Post
    Remember that in light of this stat priorities will probably be haste > crit > mastery. Remember that the lower your mastery the less this will affect you. Remember higher haste numbers next tier will result in more PoH fitting into the 15 second spirit shell window. It's really not much of a nerf, and we got another buff to Rapture. We should be happy for now, but I would expect further nerfs before the patch is out.
    Crit is currently better than haste for disco, if they're nerfing mastery, haste won't magically be better than crit.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Thehealbus View Post
    Crit is currently better than haste for disco, if they're nerfing mastery, haste won't magically be better than crit.
    That is partly correct. Single target heals scale slightly better with crit, but haste is still better for PoH. We might be stacking haste until we can fit an extra PoH into SS in the next tier at least.

    It will still depend on the fights though. On the current tier with the current spirit levels, haste stacking isn't a very promising option...

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