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  1. #81
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zantos View Post
    Don't pretend it is true. I know four people who bot on a regular basis for mats and such to either sell or use. You see the bots in bg's only get worse. You see tons of hackers hack flying in lowby pandaria areas. They don't ever ban anyone for anything. If they did the bots I reported all through cata for botting in Uldum would have been gone and not seen in the pandaria areas.
    Ancedotal evidence is bad. I reported a bot and it disappeared. /gasp And since your lack of knowledge of how Blizzard handle bots I'm not surprised. I'm not pretending it's true, IT IS TRUE. You just have some jaded view and think Blizzard doesn't care. If you know them then report them instead of sitting idle and doing nothing.


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  2. #82
    Lol...I did something similar back in Wrath. I logged into a second account, and on my main account, I posted an item to sell in trade for 'best offer'. As soon as someone started to bid, I'd use my second account to inflate the price. If my second account ended up winning because nobody else would outbid after a certain point, I'd whisper the last bidder and tell them the winner logged off or something :-) I sold so many things that way.

    Is it scamming? Sure. If nobody finds out, or hell, even if they do, who cares? It isn't anything blizzard is going to cry over. It isn't the sort of scamming they're interested in. You aren't stealing anything from them; they give you gold, you give them the item(s). While they may have paid an inflated price for it, it still isn't considered stealing.
    Last edited by endersblade; 2013-01-05 at 06:45 AM.
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    Politicians put their hand on the BIBLE and swore to uphold the CONSTITUTION. They did not put their hand on the CONSTITUTION and swear to uphold the BIBLE.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Except maybe Morgan Freeman. That man could convince God to be an atheist with that voice of his . . .

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    The person bought an item off the AH for the price it was listed. No scam there.
    You back out of a transaction before anything changes hands. No scam there.
    If I agree to buy an item, for whatever reason, it qualifies as misinformation to acquire another persons possessions. If your example holds up no crafter could ever feel safe if someone wants to buy a finished item, for instance some person says: "WTB Bloodforged gloves 30k" and a BS thinks: "Ok, the mats only cost 20k, I can net a nice profit here" talks to the person, confirms that they are interested, crafts the gloves, and then the person backs out.
    The wording can ofc be interpreted in different ways, and in the case of the crafter, I'm gonna guess a GM would agree with the crafter (regardless of whether or not the buyer actually had any profit), and in the case of the buyer actually making money and thus "acquiring another persons possessions through misinformation, confusion or fraud" it's pretty clear imo. This is not a court of law where you are innocent until proven guilty, you are innocent until Blizzard says you're not.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-05 at 07:47 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by endersblade View Post
    Lol...I did something similar back in Wrath. I logged into a second account, and on my main account, I posted an item to sell in trade for 'best offer'. As soon as someone started to bid, I'd use my second account to inflate the price. If my second account ended up winning because nobody else would outbid after a certain point, I'd whisper the last bidder and tell them the winner logged off or something :-) I sold so many things that way.

    Is it scamming? Sure. If nobody finds out, or hell, even if they do, who cares? It isn't anything blizzard is going to cry over. It isn't the sort of scamming they're interested in. You aren't stealing anything from them; they give you gold, you give them the item(s). While they may have paid an inflated price for it, it still isn't considered stealing.
    I actually disagree, you inflating the price through bidding on your own item does not change the outcome, the buyer still wants the item, and payed a price he found acceptable. In OPs case he wants a person to buy an item (that they don't want) off AH in order to flip it for profit by selling it to his alt, OP makes money and the person who bought the item off AH is stuck with an item he has no need for.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Lillemus View Post
    If I agree to buy an item, for whatever reason, it qualifies as misinformation to acquire another persons possessions. If your example holds up no crafter could ever feel safe if someone wants to buy a finished item, for instance some person says: "WTB Bloodforged gloves 30k" and a BS thinks: "Ok, the mats only cost 20k, I can net a nice profit here" talks to the person, confirms that they are interested, crafts the gloves, and then the person backs out.
    The wording can ofc be interpreted in different ways, and in the case of the crafter, I'm gonna guess a GM would agree with the crafter (regardless of whether or not the buyer actually had any profit), and in the case of the buyer actually making money and thus "acquiring another persons possessions through misinformation, confusion or fraud" it's pretty clear imo. This is not a court of law where you are innocent until proven guilty, you are innocent until Blizzard says you're not.
    The thing is, that crafter still has the item they can sell. They weren't conned out of anything.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

  5. #85
    I remember I did this in another game but instead of using the AH I used a friend... made tons of money from it but never got banned.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    The thing is, that crafter still has the item they can sell. They weren't conned out of anything.
    And what if he is unable to sell it for at least the 20k? He has no guarantee that he can actually make a profit, so if he loses gold he was conned. And no matter what, the crafter now has to spend time and energy trying to sell the item.

    Edit: Also, if verbal agreements would not hold up in WoW, PuG raiding would be horrible, and yes there are rules regarding ninja looting, but if I choose to omit a certain sentence that grants me immunity in a judicial sense, for instance kicking everyone else in the raid just before looting so technically I can't ninja loot anything because I'm the only one in the raid, seeing as the only promise I made was that I wouldn't ninja loot, I never said anything about kicking left and right.
    If this was possible in WoW we'd have a hell of a time with ingame lawyers working out contracts
    Last edited by Lillemus; 2013-01-05 at 06:57 AM.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Lillemus View Post
    And what if he is unable to sell it for at least the 20k? He has no guarantee that he can actually make a profit, so if he loses gold he was conned. And no matter what, the crafter now has to spend time and energy trying to sell the item.
    How is that any different than trying to sell any crafted item? There is never a guarantee of making a profit. If someone says they'll buy from me, then someone whispers them a cheaper price, too bad.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

  8. #88
    Well, people playing the AH have been banned for 'manipulating the economy', so who knows.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    How is that any different than trying to sell any crafted item? There is never a guarantee of making a profit. If someone says they'll buy from me, then someone whispers them a cheaper price, too bad.
    Well, we can argue back and forth from now till the end of time, I guess until we have documentation of GM actions we'll never know what the consequences of such an action would be (Unless you made money from the mats the crafter bought of AH).

  10. #90
    so I think most of you forget that there's two people being dishonest in this scenario.

    the buyer and the seller.
    the buyer being dishonest because he's really trying to get his goods sold through false enticement, and the seller being dishonest because he's trying to make a quick buck by not telling the buyer about the item on the AH and profit on the difference.

    so I guess this is what they call "karma".

  11. #91
    Banned But I Hate You All's Avatar
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    its a old scam. most the time someone will say in /y or /2 its on the ah for X and people will wonder why you are not buying it off there. Second people were banned in bc for the same scam

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by adimaya View Post
    so I think most of you forget that there's two people being dishonest in this scenario.

    the buyer and the seller.
    the buyer being dishonest because he's really trying to get his goods sold through false enticement, and the seller being dishonest because he's trying to make a quick buck by not telling the buyer about the item on the AH and profit on the difference.

    so I guess this is what they call "karma".
    I don't really thinks this holds up, I played the auction house a bit back in the day, and by your logic I should never be allowed to make a profit by swooping up items on AH if they were below market price since that would be "dishonest"?

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lillemus View Post
    I don't really thinks this holds up, I played the auction house a bit back in the day, and by your logic I should never be allowed to make a profit by swooping up items on AH if they were below market price since that would be "dishonest"?

    Well this is how it works

    Get a blue drop and post it on the AH for X amount of gold say 100. Then make an alt and Post in Trade WTB said Blue drop paying 160g.

    Then when someone replies saying that they have it they say OK I gtg COD it to me. Then log off.

    Normally they will have bought it off the ah being yours they bought and cod it to you.

    With this the Scammer gets off with X amount of gold and you have a blue drop in your mail a few days latter.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Lillemus View Post
    I don't really thinks this holds up, I played the auction house a bit back in the day, and by your logic I should never be allowed to make a profit by swooping up items on AH if they were below market price since that would be "dishonest"?
    the first scenario is about being dishonest in securing goods from a source both of you have easy access to and making profit on the margin due to the other person not being aware of the source.

    the second scenario is about you believing you can sell an item at a higher price. what is dishonest about that?

  15. #95
    The Patient Lomppa's Avatar
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    Its the oldest trick in the book. Seen it been done since classic, and i doubt you will get a ban for it. But is sounds like alot of work for little cash, as many other ppl who got the item will whisper you that they will sell it, and its also more or less a one-time-thing as ppl will catch on to you after a few times.

  16. #96
    Epic! Blockygame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    No that's not scamming. Why would that be scamming?
    Tricking someone into buying your overpriced item in the hopes of selling it back to you for 10k is essentially scamming, but alas, not according to Blizzard.
    HOOKED ON DIABLOL, GOOD TIMES ARE BEING HAD

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by adimaya View Post
    the first scenario is about being dishonest in securing goods from a source both of you have easy access to and making profit on the margin due to the other person not being aware of the source.

    the second scenario is about you believing you can sell an item at a higher price. what is dishonest about that?
    AH scans and sites like UndermineJournal aren't scamming me when they tell me items sell for more than I can actually get.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by adimaya View Post
    the first scenario is about being dishonest in securing goods from a source both of you have easy access to and making profit on the margin due to the other person not being aware of the source.

    the second scenario is about you believing you can sell an item at a higher price. what is dishonest about that?
    I see your point, but I just disagree, if a person is so lazy that he can't be bothered checking AH first (I don't think this will ever happen in a non-scam situation though ) does he not in some way deserve to pay extra for having another person run to AH and get it for him, it's a damn expensive delivery service, but non the less, a delivery service .

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-05 at 08:32 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Alastaircrawly View Post
    Well this is how it works

    Get a blue drop and post it on the AH for X amount of gold say 100. Then make an alt and Post in Trade WTB said Blue drop paying 160g.

    Then when someone replies saying that they have it they say OK I gtg COD it to me. Then log off.

    Normally they will have bought it off the ah being yours they bought and cod it to you.

    With this the Scammer gets off with X amount of gold and you have a blue drop in your mail a few days latter.
    You should really start following the thread more closely...

  19. #99
    Banned But I Hate You All's Avatar
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    But to the op

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ox-scam-Beware


    It is reportable, since he is not following through with what was agreed upon in chat he can be suspended or banned, depending on how often/long he or she has been exploiting people.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-04 at 11:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillemus View Post

    You should really start following the thread more closely...
    I was pointing out the old version of the said scam

  20. #100
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    No, not a scam but not something to be proud about either.
    If you have anything to contribute to a thread topic, please do so. Discussing moderation or calling out specific people is against the rules and makes a post liable for an infraction. Please report problem posts. If anyone is unclear about the rules please read our FAQ. Thanks.

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