Page 1 of 4
1
2
3
... LastLast
  1. #1

    MoP Arcane Mage - Extensive Updated Weaving Guide

    Basic Rotation - Priority List:

    1. Rune of Power – There should never be a time that you are not standing in your Rune as an Arcane mage. The only time you should not be in one, is when you need to move from Rune to Rune and so then you should either be using your Mage Bomb or Scorch.

    2. Mage Bomb – For single target fights, Nether Tempest is your best option. If you take Nether Tempest, then only cast it once it fully runs out, otherwise you lose 1 cast of Arcane Blast every 15 seconds and most likely a tick of the dot itself.

    3. Arcane Missiles (2 Stacks) – If you ever find yourself with 2 Arcane Missiles! procs, you should instantly spend one of them. If you do not, you are effectively losing Arcane Missile! procs as you cannot gain anymore when at 2 stacks. (Do not do this if you are peforming the Arcane Power + Alter Time combination)

    4. Arcane Blast > 92% Mana – I will explain later why you will always be at 6 Arcane Charges and why you should only Arcane Blast when at more than or equal to 92% mana.

    5. Arcane Missiles (1 Stack) <92% Mana – After an Arcane Blast, which will drop you ~8% mana, you should cast either Arcane Missiles or Scorch. If you’ve just cast an Arcane Blast and you have an Arcane Missiles! proc, you should straight away cast Arcane Missiles.

    6. Scorch <92% Mana – If you have just cast an Arcane Blast, and you have no Arcane Missile! procs, then you should cast Scorch if you below 92% mana.

    7. Scorch Whilst Moving.

    8. Cast Arcane Explosion Whilst Moving to Maintain Arcane Charge Stacks (Just as they’re about to run out).

    9. NEVER CAST ARCANE BARRAGE – The only exceptions to this rule are: In an Alter Time + Arcane Power combination... Or if a target is about to become immune and you won’t be able to sustain your 6 Arcane Charges with; Arcane Explosion, Arcane Blast or Arcane Missiles.

    Main Idea:

    The aim of perfecting your Arcane Mage is to minimise movement and spend as much time possible in your Rune of Power. Another aim is to maintain as high mana as possible due to our Mastery.

    You can do things during movement phases such as refresh your Rune of Power on a position where you know you will end up.

    Never cast Arcane Blast if you are not on a Rune of Power as your mana will drop and not regenerate fast enough.

    Mastery: Mana Adept: Increases all spell damage done by up to ~% based on the amount of mana the Mage has unspent. (This scales dramatically with mastery, so if you 50% mastery and are at 100% mana, then your spells will do 50% more damage, hence the idea of staying at as high mana as possible).

    Methods to Maintaining 6 Arcane Charge Stacks:

    • Casting Arcane Blast and weaving Arcane Missiles will refresh Arcane Charge stacks.

    • During movement phases, you can as a last ditch effort, cast Arcane Explosion to refresh your Arcane Charge stacks. Only do this if you cannot return to a Rune of Power and cast an Arcane Blast.

    • Never cast Arcane Missiles during movement (As you will not be on your Rune of Power) – UNLESS you have 2 stacks of Arcane Missiles and you have the time to finish the cast (roughly less than 2 seconds).

    • You can also, during phases where there is nothing to attack, cast Arcane Explosion to refresh your Arcane Charge stacks if you do not have roughly 1.8 seconds to cast an Arcane Blast.

    Clarification on Scorch / Arcane Missiles Weaving:

    The idea is to maintain 6 Arcane Charge stacks at all times and ditch the rotation of using Arcane Barrage at 6 stacks as it is inferior.

    How: Casting Arcane Blast will spend roughly 8% mana. So it will drop you to 92% mana, but during this cast, your Rune of Power and Nether Attunement passive will regenerate your mana.

    • So basically you will cast Arcane Blast if at more than 92% mana.

    • If at 92% mana, you will drop to around 84% mana.

    • You will then cast Arcane Missiles if you have a proc or Scorch if you do not.

    • After WEAVING Arcane Missiles or Scorch, your mana should regenerate back to around 92%.

    • After WEAVING either spell, you should then cast Arcane Blast again.

    Summary: Arcane Blast -> Arcane Missiles (Priority) / Scorch -> Arcane Blast -> Arcane Missiles (Priority) / Scorch. If when you cast your WEAVE spell you are at <92% mana, just weave another Scorch.

    Note: If you ever find yourself with 2 Arcane Missile! procs, you should instantly spend one of them otherwise it’s an overall loss.

    Perfect Opener:

    1. Pre-Pull – Use Potion of the Jade Serpent. You can then use another Potion during another Alter Time + Arcane Power combination.

    2. Mirror Images – Cast this just as you pull, the bonus you gain from waiting for Intellect procs is worthless at the start of a fight as it wastes a GCD.

    3. Mage Bomb – Cast your mage bomb (Nether Tempest). Refresh mage bomb either when it runs out or just before you’re about to do the Alter Time + Arcane Power combination.

    4. Arcane Blast x6 – Even if you gain 2 Arcane Missile! procs as you are building up to 6 Arcane Charges, you do not spend these Arcane Missile! procs.
    5. @ 6 Arcane Charges – If luck is on your side, you will have 2 Arcane Missile! procs. If not, then cast Arcane Blast @ > 92% mana and Scorch if it drops below 92%. When you have 2 Arcane Missile! procs you move onto the next step.

    6. Arcane Power -> Alter Time: See below.

    7. Return to Basic Rotation.

    8. Note: Arcane Power will still be up, so it is advised that you try to use as few scorches as possible during this period of time. You can avoid using scorches only once during this phase by: Using mana gem when at 83% mana. Once you’ve used your mana gem, refer to Scorch / Arcane Missiles weaving in and out of Arcane Blast casts to maintain around 92% mana.

    (Do not waste mana gem in this opener as it is useful for when you still have your Arcane Power buff)

    Note for Next Section: Refer to the haste values that I give. Use the relevant rotation depending on the haste buffs you have.

    WITH SUPER HASTE >56% (Achieved through base haste and heroism/bloodlust):
    Cast Arcane Power -> Alter Time – Cast Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Blast -> Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Blast -> Arcane Barrage. Your Alter Time will then automatically return you to what you were 6 seconds ago, meaning that you will again have 6 Arcane Charges and 2 Arcane Missile! procs. At this point you refer back to the basic rotation.

    WITH HASTE BUFF / HIGH HASTE >20% Haste:
    Cast Arcane Power -> Alter Time - Cast Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Blast -> Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Barrage. Your Alter Time will then automatically return you to what you were 6 seconds ago, meaning that you will again have 6 Arcane Charges and 2 Arcane Missile! procs. At this point you refer back to the basic rotation.

    WITHOUT HASTE BUFF / LOW HASTE <19% Haste:
    Cast Arcane Power -> Alter Time – Cast Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Missiles -> Arcane Barrage -> Mage Bomb. Your Alter Time will then automatically return you to what you were 6 seconds ago, meaning that you will again have 6 Arcane Charges and 2 Arcane Missile! procs. At this point you refer back to the basic rotation.

    NOTE: The Mage Bomb cast in the low haste rotation is because you do not have time to fit in an extra Arcane Blast, so instead you may as well at this time cast your mage bomb to refresh it. Never do this with so many seconds left on it in anything else but this rotation.

    Cooldowns Throughout Fight:

    • It is a great DPS boost if you can monitor when your Trinket / Enchant procs etc are going to not be on cooldown and are waiting to be procced. If Alter Time + Arcane Power are ready to be used, and you know that your procs have not been triggered for a while, then it is optimal to wait for these procs (do not delay longer than 6 seconds left on proc buffs). In order to wait for these procs (Because you will be sitting at 2 Arcane Missiles Procs + 6 Arcane Charges), you need to make sure that your AM! Procs do not fall off and that you weave Scorches so that you stay above 92% mana.

    • With the glyph of Arcane Power – Your Alter Time will always line up with Arcane Power. This means that after your opener, 3 minutes later you will have this combination to use again. At his point you follow Steps 6 + 7 and the Note: in the Perfect Opener section.

    • Try to combine your second Potion of the Jade Serpent with this Cooldown combination for increased damage output.

    • Save your mana gem for the period of time after your Alter Time (Roughly 30 seconds) for when you have your Arcane Power buff still and you are trying to avoid casting Scorch. Use the mana gem around 83% mana as it restores 17% mana.

    Useful Macro:

    • Arcane Power + Alter Time Macro.

    #showtooltip Arcane Power
    /cast Arcane Power
    /cast Alter Time
    /cast Arcane Missiles

    Mage Bomb Notes:

    On a single target, use Nether Tempest.
    On 2 targets, use 2 Nether tempest.
    On 3 targets, use Living Bomb - Spread with Fire Blast glyph.
    On 4+ targets, use Living Bomb - Spread with Fire Blast glyph.

    Living Bomb: You can refresh living bomb with less than 3 seconds left on the debuff as this will trigger the explosion and not lose a tick of damage.
    Last edited by Manacake; 2012-12-18 at 01:20 PM.

  2. #2
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    1,922
    This is a very very nice guide, I'll just comment on two things:

    1 - While under the effects of Alter Time, I use Missiles -> Missiles -> Blast -> Barrage. The reason for this is that I prefer using Missiles at 100% mana instead of lowering mana even more by adding a Blast in this. I've seen people who think that camping at 100% mana is a waste, but it's really a dps gain.

    2 - Just an error on your part at the start, the individual ticks of the Bomb spells do not have a chance to proc Missiles, only the application of the spell on the target.

  3. #3
    Can we get this somehow merged into the arcane mage guide? Or open up a new thread for the old arcane mage guide and link to those two guides in the sticky one? I think this is definitely worth a sticky guide

  4. #4
    High Overlord Moltor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Park
    Posts
    119
    is rune of power a must?
    From what ive been reading, the mana-mastery scaling (think i have like 45% mastery buffed) and it came to the conclusion of timing an Evocate when you are at 30% mana. This is so you dont loose too mana damage via mastery and retain the bigger SP buff from evocate. Also if you are approaching the 30% quicker then the buff expiring, you can just scorch and fish for free AM procs.

    Its something that i kind of prefer atm but not sure if its viable damage wise

  5. #5
    Pandaren Monk Evela's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    1,838
    That would be a pretty significant damage loss.

  6. #6
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Quote Originally Posted by Moltor View Post
    is rune of power a must?
    From what ive been reading, the mana-mastery scaling (think i have like 45% mastery buffed) and it came to the conclusion of timing an Evocate when you are at 30% mana. This is so you dont loose too mana damage via mastery and retain the bigger SP buff from evocate. Also if you are approaching the 30% quicker then the buff expiring, you can just scorch and fish for free AM procs.

    Its something that i kind of prefer atm but not sure if its viable damage wise
    Rune of Power is nearly always optimal; IW is an 'OK' replacement if you really have to use it; Invocation is pretty poor in comparison.

  7. #7
    While I did make a personal note to stay out of the discussions pertaining to 'weaving', I have some words of caution for you all.


    This 'scorch weaving' playstyle is an abomination. It will be nerfed/stopped/fixed in the next patch.
    It would be wise to not get too comfy with it, otherwise, you will just end up overdosing on QQ when it gets nerfed.


    Scorch weaving fails as a playstyle for 2 core reasons:

    1) The DPS process of a spec cannot be so intimately tied to a picking a specific talent
    Just the sheer fact that this playstyle only works when you are forced to pick scorch means that it is doomed to be axed. If 'scorch weaving' is the most optimal way to play arcane (a point, mind you, no one in the community has proven to be true yet), then it will need to be broken.


    2) Blizzard specifically mentioned they do not agree with the Arcane playstyle where you don't drop stacks.
    ABr is intended to be a core part of the rotation. The 'build to max charge, dump charge, rinse repeat' is the intended design for MoP Arcane (now, I'm not saying I agree with this design, I'm just saying that it is what it is).



    As a last word of caution, this particular forum seems to be getting swarmed by people posting "guides" containing information that is not only not verified, but no explanation, no theorycraft, no calculation and no optimization computation is displayed. I.e. people are basically coming in here saying "this is how you play X optimally" but do not provide any proof or any kind of support for their arguments.
    This is a terrible idea, since all it does is spread misinformation.

    If you want to make a guide, be prepared to present all your theorycraft that supports your claims. Don't just say "try it yourself". The onus is on you to prove what you are saying when you create a guide, it isn't on the rest of us to try to prove you wrong.

    L2scientificmethod, kkthxbai.


    Infracted.
    Last edited by Shangalar; 2012-12-17 at 11:44 PM.
    "Zom is like that ace in the hole you keep for when shit hits the fan and you need a clutch. Unleash him when the need is most dire and watch how in just a few globals all your problems fade away. Mostly because they all just got melted."
    - High Warlord Daemon, PvP Officer, rBG Lead

  8. #8
    ZOMGdps, why you always come in and rain on every threads parade with you're negativity. Go get some prozac and spare the rest of us.

    Meanwhile, I've spent some time on Simcraft today to answer some questions of my own. Mostly, I've been working on challenge modes and regemming back and forth from haste to mastery is killing me. Also, I've seen good mages using frost armor instead of mage of armor.

    I'm trying to answer the question of what's better, haste or mastery, frost or mage armor?

    My armory:
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...1berg/advanced
    My Reforge priority
    Int= 1
    Haste= <0.5
    Mastery= <Haste

    The following simcraft results have 10,000 iterations, style of fight, frost/mage armor, scorch/barrage
    Patch/Frost/Scorch
    115301 DPS
    Int 4.66
    Haste 2.44
    Mastery 2.63

    Patch/Mage/Scorch
    1150931 DPS
    Int 4.68
    Haste 1.83
    Mastery 2.48

    Helter/frost/scorch
    98806 DPS
    Int 3.93
    Haste 2.09
    Mastery 2.31

    Helter/Mage/Scorch
    97849 DPS
    Int 3.96
    Haste 2.41
    Mastery 2.12

    Light/frost/scorch
    110677 DPS
    Int 4.46
    Haste 2.41
    Mastery 2.60

    Light/Mage/Scorch
    110521 DPS
    int 4.36
    haste 1.68
    mastery 2.37

    Light/frost/barrage
    109873 DPS
    Int 4.35
    Haste 2.10
    Mastery 2.59

    Light/mage/barrage
    109577 DPS
    Int 4.36
    Haste 2.15
    Mastery 2.37

    From looking with my armory, Haste>Mastery, Frost armor outperforms Mage armor marginally, despite simcraft scaling mastery more than haste.
    Also, scorch weaving outperforms arcane barrage, marginally... there you go ZOMGdps.

    Then I thought, better compare the results to someone that gems Mastery>Haste. So I imported Logoz.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Logoz/advanced
    Haste- 11.9%
    Mastery- 45.81%

    Light/Frost/Scorch
    126508 DPS
    Int 4.98
    Haste 2.46
    Mastery 2.47

    Light/Mage/Scorch
    124608 DPS
    int 2.43
    haste 2.79
    mastery 2.39

    Patch/frost/scorch
    130535 DPS
    int 5.11
    haste 2.52
    Mastery 2.60

    Patch/mage/scorch
    128719 DPS
    int 4.99
    haste 2.82
    mastery 2.40

    Again, frost armor gives more dps than mage armor. Even with gemming mastery>haste, despite simcraft having mastery scale higher than haste


    *** Some flaws in my argument. Simcraft is known to over value haste in some situations, which might skew the results to favor haste or mastery. It is hard to determine in "in game" data because of rng***

    ***It is save to assume you will be doing similar dps full haste gemmed/frost armor as you would full mastery gemmed/mage armor. I would expect the former to be even better should scorch weaving be nerfed, since you will want to quickly get back to 6 stacks after dropping stacks with barrage****


    Infracted.
    Last edited by Shangalar; 2012-12-17 at 11:44 PM.

  9. #9
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    1,922
    @zomgDPS - we've already established in another thread that this playstyle won't live long, but for now it seems to be working fine. When they change it, we'll adapt to whatever comes next.

    Also, people are posting their guides in an effort to help the rest of the community, even though none of us have formal evidence and I'll explain why - nobody gives a damn about the theorycrafting. It's as simple as that. If you want to do it, go ahead, prove us wrong in theory and then prove us wrong in practice within the game as well. I'm well aware of the burden of proof, but the proof currently here is in-game performance and in-game testing. Additionally, nobody here has ever said this type of gameplay was optimal (possibly how to optimally perform this, but never that this is by far the best way to play Arcane). I invite you to do the numbers and test them and we can see. Until you or someone comes up with something that performs better, we're happy with what we are doing.

    @Dementor - Simcraft is not the optimal way of testing these things. However, you've done a lot of work so it bears some relevance. The problem with simcraft in this case are it's unusual ideas about the value of Haste based on breakpoints and how far you are from them, so the stat weights can often be very misleading in the case of Arcane.
    Last edited by Shangalar; 2012-12-17 at 11:02 PM.

  10. #10
    If you want to know how I manipulated simcraft to show scorch results (since it currently defaults arcane barrage) here is what I used

    actions=counterspell,if=target.debuff.casting.react
    actions+=/cancel_buff,name=alter_time,moving=1
    actions+=/conjure_mana_gem,if=mana_gem_charges<3&target.debuff.invulnerable.react
    actions+=/time_warp,if=target.health.pct<25|time>5
    actions+=/arcane_power,if=target.time_to_die<18
    actions+=/alter_time,if=buff.alter_time.down&buff.arcane_power.up&buff.arcane_missiles.stack=2&buff. arcane_charge.stack>3&buff.rune_of_power.remains>6,moving=0
    actions+=/arcane_blast,if=buff.alter_time.up&buff.presence_of_mind.up
    actions+=/arcane_missiles,if=buff.alter_time.up|buff.arcane_missiles.stack=2
    actions+=/rune_of_power,if=buff.rune_of_power.down&buff.alter_time.down
    actions+=/jade_serpent_potion,if=buff.arcane_power.up|target.time_to_die<=50
    actions+=/mana_gem,if=mana.pct<84&buff.alter_time.down
    actions+=/mirror_image
    actions+=/arcane_power,if=buff.rune_of_power.remains>15&buff.alter_time.down&buff.arcane_charge.stac k>1
    actions+=/nether_tempest,if=!ticking
    actions+=/arcane_blast,if=mana.pct>86
    actions+=/arcane_missiles,if=buff.arcane_missiles.react&(cooldown.alter_time_activate.remains>4|targ et.time_to_die<10)
    actions+=/arcane_barrage,if=cooldown.alter_time_activate.remains<2
    actions+=/scorch,if=buff.arcane_charge.stack>=6&buff.arcane_missiles.down&mana.pct<86&target.time_to _die>25
    actions+=/arcane_blast
    actions+=/arcane_barrage,moving=1
    actions+=/scorch,moving=1
    actions+=/fire_blast,moving=1
    actions+=/ice_lance,moving=1

    Basically I just added in to arcane barrage at the end of alter time, and to fish for arcane missile procs at full arcane charge stacks. I also changed it to arcane blast until 86% mana, cause that drops me to 80% mana in game as opposed to stopping at 92%.

  11. #11
    So what your saying is to scorch till we have 100% mana after big burst?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Asapvike View Post
    So what your saying is to scorch till we have 100% mana after big burst?
    No, the basic idea is to stay at 6 stacks forever, If you're mastery focused, you don't want to really drop below 90%ish mana, more like 80-85%ish as a haste focused build. If you get to those mana values, you would throw in a scorch or two as needed to ensure that your next AB doesn't drop you below those thresholds.

  13. #13
    Okay. I am mastery focused build as regaurds to gemming and reforging per say. As this said would i want to be using frost armor or mage armor when it comes to this. There are countless arguments regaurding the armors. Most ppl are going to frost armor to get that 15 tick NP. Idk which one i would use. Unbuffed im around 9.61% haste.

  14. #14
    If you're going full mastery I'd stick to mage armor. You could get that extra tick with frost armor, but you will probably do better with the extra mastery.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DreamSpyre View Post
    If you're going full mastery I'd stick to mage armor. You could get that extra tick with frost armor, but you will probably do better with the extra mastery.
    Alright thank you for the help. Much appreciated. Just getting back into arcane and need all the help i can recieve. So whats the difference between the builds? Would u still be 6 stack capping with this build?

  16. #16
    Love this thread, great stuff.

    I was pleasantly surprised by my Simcraft results. All the magi I know go full Mastery, yet Simcraft kept telling me to go haste whether on Patchwerk or Helter Skelter, (and for my gear it was a significant margin, like 1.8 haste value versus 1.3 mastery. At first I was skeptical, but even testing on a level 90 dummy between Sims the difference was obvious after making the switch.

    After full reforge to haste and regemming, I finally got it to where running Simcraft now shows a small difference like .01-.1 between haste value and mastery. It's like I got back to the point where they are evening out. They definitely scale off each other, so the right way to do it is Simcraft yourself for your gear. In my case it's full haste.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Manacake View Post
    Living Bomb: You can refresh living bomb with less than 3 seconds left on the debuff as this will trigger the explosion and not lose a tick of damage.
    Does this also apply to LB on cleave targets when you use Glyph of Fire Blast?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Asapvike View Post
    Alright thank you for the help. Much appreciated. Just getting back into arcane and need all the help i can recieve. So whats the difference between the builds? Would u still be 6 stack capping with this build?
    As of now it looks like 6 stack camping is the way to go no matter whether you're haste or mastery focused.

  19. #19
    Scorch weaving fails as a playstyle for 2 core reasons:

    1) The DPS process of a spec cannot be so intimately tied to a picking a specific talent
    By that same reasoning using RoP is also a broken Arcane gimmick and we should expect Blizzard
    to kill it in the next patch?

  20. #20
    Brewmaster Methusula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    1,296
    Quote Originally Posted by scuac View Post
    By that same reasoning using RoP is also a broken Arcane gimmick and we should expect Blizzard
    to kill it in the next patch?
    While I wouldn't call it a broken gimmick, I fully expect a change that brings RoP down a bit and removes scorch as a rotational ability. I think it's safe to say a movement talent was never meant to be used in this manner.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •