Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1

    Can someone from Asia explain how improving 25man loot affected 10man community?

    There has been lots of speculation on this subject while we already should have real evidence and data from Korea, China, TW servers. I'm really curious to know how improving 25 man loot has impacted 10 man community there? Can someone from Asian servers talk about this? Are 10 man raids dwindling there?

    * Edit:

    Well I took a look myself via wowprogress and I was amazed to see this on two high populated TW, Korea realms:

    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/tw/silverwing-hold
    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/kr/azshara

    There are 16, 10man guilds on top 20 list and only 4 25man guilds in first realm and 17, 10man guilds and only 3, 25man guilds on top in second realm. So maybe after all this huge 25man loot advantage doesn't hurt 10man raiding community at all.

    Still looking for feedback from asian players though!
    Last edited by Marooned; 2013-01-05 at 10:30 PM.
    "Blizzard is not incompetent or stupid and they are not intentionally screwing you over"

  2. #2
    Aren't they also on separate locks?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  3. #3
    They have a different Pay-to-Play model, so right off you are going to reach biased and relatively invalid conclusions because the decisions Blizz made were primarily based on how they subscribe.

  4. #4
    Old God Nerraw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Denmark
    Posts
    10,723
    I honestly think it's too soon to draw a conclusion. It takes some time for things to stabilize into their new order.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Marooned View Post
    There has been lots of speculation on this subject while we already should have real evidence and data from Korea, China, TW servers. I'm really curious to know how improving 25 man loot has impacted 10 man community there? Can someone from Asian servers talk about this? Are 10 man raids dwindling there?
    As far as NA/EU is concerned, the answer to this question is (to a very large degree) meaningless.

    The change was made there in relation to player demands and needs, the very different gaming model in use and the local market conditions.

    Player demands in the NA/EU appear to favor the current model and the economic structure is such that Blizzard would likely make more profit with the current system. And Blizzard already has several years worth of data on how the Korean model would affect 10s.

    EJL

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Marooned View Post
    Well I took a look myself via wowprogress and I was amazed to see this on two high populated TW, Korea realms:

    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/tw/silverwing-hold
    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/kr/azshara

    There are 16, 10man guilds on top 20 list and only 4 25man guilds in first realm and 17, 10man guilds and only 3, 25man guilds on top in second realm. So maybe after all this huge 25man loot advantage doesn't hurt 10man raiding community at all.
    They also scaled Boss HP and Damage with 8% making progression with the items they had before harder. It will start showing when they have had time to farm better items from the 25 mode.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Marooned View Post
    There are 16, 10man guilds on top 20 list and only 4 25man guilds in first realm and 17, 10man guilds and only 3, 25man guilds on top in second realm. So maybe after all this huge 25man loot advantage doesn't hurt 10man raiding community at all.
    Or it could simply be a reflection of the fact that in Asia, 10 mans are considered hardcore and the place to be and 25s are the also rans, the place to be if you are a casual.

    EJL

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    They also scaled Boss HP and Damage with 8% making progression with the items they had before harder. It will start showing when they have had time to farm better items from the 25 mode.
    Well that is something which will happen here also if they decide to upgrade 25man gear, to balance the content.
    "Blizzard is not incompetent or stupid and they are not intentionally screwing you over"

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    Or it could simply be a reflection of the fact that in Asia, 10 mans are considered hardcore and the place to be and 25s are the also rans, the place to be if you are a casual.

    EJL
    There was a quote from some guy saying that but it was disproved later on and some asians players actually replied that it's quite the opposite, 25 man is regarded as hardcore. If you have some different source please quote it.

  10. #10
    The reason why there is so many 10 guilds in the top is because guilds raid both 10 and 25. They get higher item level from 25 making 10 complete faceroll so they get logged as 10 man guilds even though they are 25. Simply because they stomp the easier 10 man content with higher gear.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Marooned View Post
    There has been lots of speculation on this subject while we already should have real evidence and data from Korea, China, TW servers. I'm really curious to know how improving 25 man loot has impacted 10 man community there? Can someone from Asian servers talk about this? Are 10 man raids dwindling there?

    * Edit:

    Well I took a look myself via wowprogress and I was amazed to see this on two high populated TW, Korea realms:

    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/tw/silverwing-hold
    http://www.wowprogress.com/pve/kr/azshara

    There are 16, 10man guilds on top 20 list and only 4 25man guilds in first realm and 17, 10man guilds and only 3, 25man guilds on top in second realm. So maybe after all this huge 25man loot advantage doesn't hurt 10man raiding community at all.

    Still looking for feedback from asian players though!
    I play on Chinese servers. The increased ilevel from 25 mans hasn't broken up a lot of 10 mans (but a few I know recruited and went 25) and a lot of 10's remain. My 25 man has had a LOT of applications however, which has really helped us. So far the change has stopped further degradation of 25 mans.... for now.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    Or it could simply be a reflection of the fact that in Asia, 10 mans are considered hardcore and the place to be and 25s are the also rans, the place to be if you are a casual.

    EJL
    Myth. Some guy from In Extremis said this in an interview a while ago and now it's become the go to argument for every 10vs25 debate. Both Stars (Taiwanese - world first yogg0) and 즐거운공격대 (KIN - Korean - world first heroic Madness) have said that 25 is considered harder and more hardcore in their respective regions.

    It all comes down to whichever format a player plays thinks that's more hardcore than the other.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by aarjun View Post
    Myth. Some guy from In Extremis said this in an interview a while ago and now it's become the go to argument for every 10vs25 debate. Both Stars (Taiwanese - world first yogg0) and 즐거운공격대 (KIN - Korean - world first heroic Madness) have said that 25 is considered harder and more hardcore in their respective regions.

    It all comes down to whichever format a player plays thinks that's more hardcore than the other.
    That was the quote I was looking for, thanks for finding it. So yeah, 25 man is considered hardcore in Asia.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Radalek View Post
    There was a quote from some guy saying that but it was disproved later on and some asians players actually replied that it's quite the opposite, 25 man is regarded as hardcore. If you have some different source please quote it.
    Personal experience from some time living there, contact with some friends I still have there and comments from Blizzard about the gaming culture in SE Asia.

    EJL

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    Personal experience from some time living there, contact with some friends I still have there and comments from Blizzard about the gaming culture in SE Asia.

    EJL
    Yet we have quote from asian gamers just above that says different.

  16. #16
    It's almost like.... Asians are just people with differing opinions like everybody else in the entire world?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Aren't they also on separate locks?
    Yes.

    So I imagine it's exactly like in the ICC days. 10 man was casual, similar to LFR today.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Talen View Post
    Personal experience from some time living there, contact with some friends I still have there and comments from Blizzard about the gaming culture in SE Asia.

    EJL
    What are you talking about? 5 man heroic dungeons are way more hardcore. I heard it straight from a player there myself.


    See how ridiculous you look without proof?

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Blutelf View Post
    It's almost like.... Asians are just people with differing opinions like everybody else in the entire world?
    Umpossible.

    Asia uses the pay per minute/hour model, right? If anything, this was the final drop in the barrel for Blizzard to change the system we've had since Cataclysm. If you raid the same dungeon two or even three times, it means more money for Blizzard.
    Last edited by UcanDoSht; 2013-01-06 at 05:41 PM.
    Most people do not realize the talent and skill it requires to be in a top guild. Many of you think its only about time invested, but that couldn't be further from the truth.

  20. #20
    I am Murloc! Raiju's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    5,893
    To the people saying "Asians say X difficulty is harder" a few pointers:

    1. Opinions of the majority change over time and content changes over time. I remember a blog a long time ago that described the differences between opinion based on balance, and opinion based on current metagaming. There is a huge difference.
    2. The 2 25man top guilds say 25 man is harder and the 10man guild says 10man is hardcore? No, really? You mean like most people on these boards as well.
    3. Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

    The only really agreement you can come to is that it is incomparable to EU due to all reasons described in earlier posts.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •