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  1. #121
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    I guess if you played a mage you would have read both the patch notes and this thread a bit more closely
    ^

    For the bazillionth time, it's not being removed. It's being replaced only if you pick BS

    Edit: Updated the OP because I'm tired of people saying they don't want it removed.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  2. #122
    Warchief Kuni Zyrekai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragon9870 View Post
    An actual cooldown would be pretty nice. I'm thinking of, say, Shaman's Astral Shift (or w/e it's called), but like a 30% reduction for 10s with a 60s cooldown (to keep it somewhere in line with the other two)
    Yeah, I mean we're also the only caster as of 5.2 without a passive damage reduction going on, I'm fairly sure? I dreaded getting cry of terror on H Shek'zeer because I couldn't survive half as long as anyone else. If I got it 3 times in a short amount of time, I'm fucked. HoP, ice block... gg? It's doable obviously, but it's not as nice as any other class.

  3. #123
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuni Zyrekai View Post
    Yeah, I mean we're also the only caster as of 5.2 without a passive damage reduction going on, I'm fairly sure? I dreaded getting cry of terror on H Shek'zeer because I couldn't survive half as long as anyone else. If I got it 3 times in a short amount of time, I'm fucked. HoP, ice block... gg? It's doable obviously, but it's not as nice as any other class.
    I haven't done heroic yet, but coupled with Ice Barrier on normal, I typically take no damage inside the fields, esp with our Disc priest bubbling (though everyone else seems to take ridiculous damage inside).

    We do have a passive damage reduction, but it's a measly 6% Physical reduc if we use Molten Armor (16% if glyphed).

    In addition, we have the lowest health pool, lowest armor, and just take the most damage out of all the classes, in addition to having the worst self-healing (even Hunters, who have shit for self healing, are light years better than us in PvP. We beat them just barely in PvE with Invocation). Changing speccs doesn't really help one bit either.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  4. #124
    The Lightbringer Grym's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuni Zyrekai View Post
    Yeah, I mean we're also the only caster as of 5.2 without a passive damage reduction going on, I'm fairly sure?
    Elemental Shaman says hi

  5. #125
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grym View Post
    Elemental Shaman says hi
    They at least have a few active ones, as well as a much better QoL and fun-ness.

    Mages only have damage. Nothing else.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  6. #126
    And I'm jealous of their new set bonuses but that's a different topic entirely!

    Blizzard would probably want some theoretical new talent to be something Fire themed and to be honest I don't really want a carbon copy of someone else's spell even if it's really all we're likely to receive halfway through an expansion.
    The other two are fairly low cooldown shields so to differentiate itself this one would have to have a fairly long or fairly short cooldown. Burning Rush tried a short one but to be honest IB and TS are already sort of weak so probably we'd more want at something on a minute or 1.5 minute CD.

    Or could we have something with the same cooldown as the other two spells? Why not just make it the Barrier tier:

    Magma Barrier; Reduces all damage taken by X% for Y seconds (Y would have to be pretty short for my idea I think!)
    if you take damage while under the effects of Magma Barrier, all enemy targets within 5 yards are knocked back 5 yards. This effect cannot occur more than once every Y seconds.

    If you really want a shield wall cooldown you can increase the cooldown and duration. The knockback isn't really necessary either but it's at least slightly similar to what Blazing Speed seems to have been (poorly) designed to do, if you remember it used to activate only when you'd been hit!
    And because everyone seems to miss the old Blast Wave.

  7. #127
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    ^, but 10 yards, as 5 yards doesn't do crap :P

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  8. #128
    Yeah I'm just throwing out random numbers, balancing is someone else's job
    I should have just said "Z"

  9. #129
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    Yeah I'm just throwing out random numbers, balancing is someone else's job
    I should have just said "Z"
    Granted, that talent would still be eh in PvE.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  10. #130
    I am Murloc! Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    They could add a passive defensive talent and remove BS. Something like "while moving in combat, you reduce damage taken by 1-15%, the more you move, less damage you take", if you stop, this bonus will decay over 3 seconds. It is hard to give something useful in a defensive tier (because we already have reactive heal and shield). Or a damage-return, i miss old molten armor
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2013-01-11 at 02:42 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  11. #131
    That would really hurt users of Rune of Power

  12. #132
    Scarab Lord Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    A spell that pretty much enables you to make things like stuns and snares useless against the class for 1,5 seconds with a 15 second CD and you Mages consider it bad just because you can not Blink as well? Really?
    Last edited by Frozen Death Knight; 2013-01-11 at 02:51 AM.

  13. #133
    I am Murloc! Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    That would really hurt users of Rune of Power
    How? If you need to move because of PvE encounter, you get your damage reduction anyways. If it is PvP and you are forced to move (which happens alot) you better move or you will be raped by an angry warrior.

    The only thing that hurts users of the rune, is the rune itself.

    On a side note, they could make some talents depend on last tier talent/glyph. For example, for the rune users, talent suggested above, could stack defensive barrier to protect you from 30% physical damage while standing still, and when you get physical hit, it will explode knocking enemies away and destroy rune, giving you a stack of "move dat gear up", which spawns rune under you after 2 seconds if you stand still (if you are still moving after 2 seconds, buff will refresh itself to 1 second duration until you stop moving).
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2013-01-11 at 03:01 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  14. #134
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    They could add a passive defensive talent and remove BS. Something like "while moving in combat, you reduce damage taken by 1-15%, the more you move, less damage you take", if you stop, this bonus will decay over 3 seconds. It is hard to give something useful in a defensive tier (because we already have reactive heal and shield). Or a damage-return, i miss old molten armor
    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    That would really hurt users of Rune of Power
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    How? If you need to move because of PvE encounter, you get your damage reduction anyways. If it is PvP and you are forced to move (which happens alot) you better move or you will be raped by an angry warrior.

    The only thing that hurts users of the rune, is the rune itself.

    On a side note, they could make some talents depend on last tier talent/glyph. For example, for the rune users, talent suggested above, could stack defensive barrier to protect you from 30% physical damage while standing still, and when you get physical hit, it will explode knocking enemies away and destroy rune, giving you a stack of "move dat gear up", which spawns rune under you when you stand still for 2 seconds.
    You're joking, right? That severely hinders RoP more. Also, if you're moving, you generally don't take damage. It's when you DON'T move that you take the most damage. Though if you think to add an opposite-of-what-you-said, please stop trying because we have enough problems with immobility.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-10 at 10:06 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    On a side note, they could make some talents depend on last tier talent/glyph.
    Please, god, no more.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  15. #135
    I am Murloc! Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragon9870 View Post
    You're joking, right? That severely hinders RoP more. Also, if you're moving, you generally don't take damage. It's when you DON'T move that you take the most damage. Though if you think to add an opposite-of-what-you-said, please stop trying because we have enough problems with immobility.
    How it hinders RoP? explain me please. If you are forced to move - you move out of your RoP anyways. And how do you generally don't take damage while moving? You move when you are taking or about to take damage from melee, and melee, sooner or later, will get you and hit you hard, this talent can make this hit softer. All range damage classes should have problems with mobility otherwise melee will never catch you up.

    All this conversation makes me think that you want something like mage-avatar that will give you 45 seconds of free-cast time with 50% damage increase and 100% of damage dealt also gives you a shield, so you can solo a stormwind
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2013-01-11 at 03:22 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  16. #136
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    How it hinders RoP? explain me please. If you are forced to move - you move out of your RoP anyways. And how do you generally don't take damage while moving? You move when you are taking or about to take damage from melee, and melee, sooner or later, will get you and hit you hard, this talent can make this hit softer. All range damage classes should have problems with mobility otherwise melee will never catch you up.
    "You move when you are taking damage".

    EXACTLY. You take damage because you are not moving. When you are moving, you generally don't take damage. Ergo, not only is this talent proposal 100% pointless but it'll make you want to have the buff fulltime by moving, which hinders RoP.

    The opposite is just as bad because it gives you an even bigger reason not to move out of things, especially during an Invocation (I've wiped my group a few times trying to get off the last second of it).

    Both instances are bad for IW because then the shield is harder to break due to taking less damage. So, overall, this talent proposal is just a horrible idea.

    Essentially, this talent is bad, PURELY because of the L90 talents, something that is already designed bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    All this conversation makes me think that you want something like mage-avatar that will give you 45 seconds of free-cast time with 50% damage increase and 100% of damage dealt also gives you a shield, so you can solo a stormwind
    Not only is Stormwind not an enemy, nor a thing (it's a place, therefore, there's only one of them), but now you just sound foolish. Me pointing out the flaws of your poorly designed talent = me wanting godmode? Thank you for not progressing the thread with your foolishness.

    If you bothered to read more than just what was on the last page, you'd notice I said I'd even take Improved Blink (+70% Speed for 3s after using Blink) over this, and even Ice Barrier, purely because it's extremely fun and helpful. Your talent is just counter-intuitive and it breaks the core mechanics of the L90 talents no matter which way it's designed.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  17. #137
    To reiterate, whether you like them or not the level 90 talents are designed to penalise Mages for moving around too much.
    This displays Blizzard's design intention.

    They are not going to then turn around an add a talent that encourages you to move as much as possible.

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    To reiterate, whether you like them or not the level 90 talents are designed to penalise Mages for moving around too much.
    This displays Blizzard's design intention.

    They are not going to then turn around an add a talent that encourages you to move as much as possible.
    Looking at the last PTR patch, thats exactly whats coming!

  19. #139
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    To reiterate, whether you like them or not the level 90 talents are designed to penalise Mages for moving around too much.
    This displays Blizzard's design intention.

    They are not going to then turn around an add a talent that encourages you to move as much as possible.
    You didn't really read Blazing Speed, huh? >_>;

    That's intended to make you want to move.

    Progression pre-nerfed: [T17] 6/7H; 0/10N

  20. #140
    I think you misunderstand me.

    Blazing speed allows you to move fast... for 1.5 seconds. It only moves you slightly further than Blink, and it replaced Blink. This doesn't actually increase a mage's ability to move in any particular fashion, nor does it give them an incentive to move.
    You have to move sometimes! This ability does somewhat lower the damage loss of moving, but it is a replacement to a spell that we have had since Vanilla which also fills the same role. The talents were designed with the Mage's ability to Blink already in mind, they clearly don't mind if you're able to hop around a bit once every 15 seconds, they just want to make sure we're at least a little more sedentary at other times than most other caster DPS.

    Charge Me Doctor's talent idea gives you a stacking damage reduction buff as long as you are in motion. This rewards players for moving, and encourages them to be doing it at all times in certain encounters (Garalon for instance).
    This is the exact opposite of what the level 90 talents are designed to achieve.

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