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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Xayton View Post
    They both use Demonic Calling.
    There was also an extensive discussion in the old thread about not pre-casting, since you want to put up DS/get procs first.

    Here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post18966351
    and
    here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post18949052
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  2. #22
    Keyboard Turner Xayton's Avatar
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    Thank you.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Xayton View Post
    They both use Demonic Calling.
    True, yet shadow bolt is still more interesting to pre-cast, without molten core, soul fire's mana cost is just too much for it to be interesting.

    Concerning stat weights now, I would strongly advise to not use simcraft (if you're not totally confident with it at least) since :

    1)The current Demo action list is not optimised at all
    2)Most people tend to take simcraft results and not interpret them, and honestly, this is worse than not using simcraft
    3)Seeing how close secondary stats are for Demo, encounters mechanics are (in most cases) more important than gear to decide which stat to go for.

    The only stat-related thing that is a definite (for people who don't have a really high ilvl) is the 3036 Doom breakpoint.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Never pre-cast Soul Fire over Shadow Bolt. Shadow Bolt will use Demonic Calling, which is otherwise wasted when you pop Imp Swarm.
    Both Soul Fire and Shadow Bolt (and Touch of Chaos for that matter) proc a Wild Imp from Demonic Calling. Demonic Calling itself is not wiped by casting Imp Swarm.

  5. #25
    Hm, I should probably pay more attention to little changes like that. In Beta, it was the way I described.

  6. #26
    I always precast. From what I understood in this post http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post18949052

    zinnin didnt mentioned that even thou DPS is a wash, precasting means that extra "free" Fury aswell.

    My personal tests I found that blowing everything at start even without a good fury pool means more DPS because you can get he CDs right away and put that super Doom up asap with all the trinket pots and the prepoting from the start.

    I tried serveral times the pool fury then DS strat, but for me going all out at start gave me more, ofc this isnt true for some fights.
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  7. #27
    Fluffy Kitten Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by luckydevours View Post
    Maybe you can add to your "Grimoire"-section that GoServ synchronizes well with Dark Soul as long as you dont run with 4p T14. Otherwise GoSup could be worth another thought.
    GoServ still lines up with DS until you are doing a longer fight for the most part, depending on your trinket choice delaying it even on a longer fight can still be just as good as GoSup.

    For instance, with FRG \ Yulon every single GoServ gets buffed by double trinkets and DS and is worth delaying 30s even when you miss a use. However if you aren't doing anything to buff GoServ, GoSup does become better when you get the 4 piece.

    But still in all cases I find that the dps difference between the two is still very minimal and is more of a play-style choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by kandalanu View Post
    About topic - very nice basic information about demo. Just wondering why you didn't write anything about entering meta after casting second HoG for double ticks - we can also put it as and basic information.
    I did put something about entering meta for shadow-flame under the mechanics section. I tried to make the rotation pretty basic because a lot of the little tricks are something that a newer player would try to do, but lower their dps if they are still learning.

  8. #28
    What bothers me about Demo is haste and touch of chaos, if BL (or a haste proc) is popped when your DS is ready and fury bar almost full, should you just spam meta soul fires instead? (while keeping corr up ofc)

    Also what is the best opener for AoE like on wind lord? Pop cds right away and then corr/doom or wait until everything is corr'd and normal doomed? (so you can get extended super doom on all targets?)

    And void ray vs harvest life (when no dots are present) ?

  9. #29
    @Zinnin - but Meta is actually the only one thing they should really focus playing Demo Locks. Faster they will be able to handle it properly, faster they will do more dmg. Actually its better to screw a bit rotation, than screw a bit Meta.


    @Micke - Void Ray > Harves Life in each situation when Void Ray can hit all mobs - even without corruption on targets. So for example Wind Lord, Feng = void ray but Amber Shaper, Empress = Harves Life.

  10. #30
    Fluffy Kitten Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kandalanu View Post
    @Zinnin - but Meta is actually the only one thing they should really focus playing Demo Locks. Faster they will be able to handle it properly, faster they will do more dmg. Actually its better to screw a bit rotation, than screw a bit Meta.
    That may be true, but like I said it's already in the guide. If they choose to not read all of it then there isn't much I can do to help them.

  11. #31
    Nice guide. Been playing a lock for ages, but not as demo since WOLK.
    A few questions: other than 'you will spend most of your fury refreshing corruption' there is little, to no information on what you should be doing when in Meta and HOW you should actually spend your fury.
    Do we refresh corruption with Touch of Chaos or Void Ray?
    Does extending the duration with ToC or VR overwrite the existing power of corruption with your new stats?
    Should we use Chaos Wave?
    When should we enter Meta?
    How long should we stay in meta? Until you run out of fury? or should we be 'stance dancing' to maximise the power of doom and corruption?
    Due to the lack of this information, the guide seems to be aimed at people who already know Demo, and excluding those new to Demo.
    In order to make it more complete, I would recommend a 'Spell priority when in Demo' (both AoE and single target - yes, you already cover AoE meta abilities, but not single target)

  12. #32
    Fluffy Kitten Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boradan View Post
    I would recommend a 'Spell priority when in Demo' (both AoE and single target - yes, you already cover AoE meta abilities, but not single target)
    Most of your questions were already answered in the 'Single Target & Cleave' and 'Mechanics' sections of the guide. However, I did try to make it a little more clear.

  13. #33
    When should we enter Meta?
    How long should we stay in meta? Until you run out of fury? or should we be 'stance dancing' to maximise the power of doom and corruption?
    This is all in the guide = /

    Do we refresh corruption with Touch of Chaos or Void Ray?
    This was answered too, if we are using ToC as a fury dump then there is no reason to use void ray outside of aoe.
    Credit to PaulDok for sig!

  14. #34
    Anyone know what the range of Hellfire is? I seem to either be a) blind or b) retarded right now and can't find it.

    Edit: tested it myself; 20 yd radius w/ MF which means non MF hellfire should be 4 yd radius (so basically melee, which is already known).
    Last edited by Woz; 2013-01-12 at 08:52 PM.

  15. #35
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    Just wanted to make a comment about stat priority for Haste with lower level gear. For my lock Scathbais, with 4-pc and 492 ilvl gear, simcraft shows that it is a considerable dps loss to go under the 3036 breakpoint. Under 3k haste, simcraft showed hate>crit>mastery. Once I reforged enough haste to his the extra doom tick, the priority switched to crit>mastery>haste.
    A living Warlock = a dead everyone else

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Woz View Post
    Anyone know what the range of Hellfire is? I seem to either be a) blind or b) retarded right now and can't find it.

    Edit: tested it myself; 20 yd radius w/ MF which means non MF hellfire should be 4 yd radius (so basically melee, which is already known).
    20y w/ MF is 9y without MF, FWIW.
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    20y w/ MF is 9y without MF, FWIW.
    9*500% = 45 - unless Blizzard uses an odd calculation for MF there's no way that without MF Hellfire can be 9 yards.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Woz View Post
    9*500% = 45 - unless Blizzard uses an odd calculation for MF there's no way that without MF Hellfire can be 9 yards.
    MF is 500% area, not 500% radius.

    Edit: The radius on Hellfire is actually 8 yards. It is a shade under 20y (19.6) w/ MF.
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    MF is 500% area, not 500% radius.

    Edit: The radius on Hellfire is actually 8 yards. It is a shade under 20y (19.6) w/ MF.
    Hm. That is true. Area =/= Radius.

  20. #40
    Can you do fight specific guides for Tsulong and Lei Shi? On most fights I'm towards the top of the meters in my raid but for some reason I struggle with these. Especially Lei Shi.

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