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  1. #181
    Quote Originally Posted by Kink View Post
    not blow a couple GCDs in the fight :P.

    Sact isn't on the GCD.

    The most recent testing I did with Soul Link lead to a 10~% damage reduction 100% of the time. Its decent on a fight like Garalon where the damage is constant, but Sact seems like it would always be the better option for an short CD 'Oh Shit' button.

  2. #182
    I found Soul Link offered a great means of leeching aoe/smart heals from the melee pack giving me huge self healing. Not sure there is a fight without constant damage, and 200k more effective health (with demon training glyph) will keep you alive through a lot. Only issue is Vizier and Elagon, where the boss is fixed and melees the nearest thing can get you killed.

  3. #183
    Quick question when using hero on the pull, anyone simmed using SF MC procs vs usual toc spam. Started to play around tonight with it and seemed a nice burst increase but our wol broke when I refining it so couldn't tell.

    By this I mean on the only on the 1st drip into meta with int/trinket procs under hero.
    Last edited by Fiddi2biT; 2013-02-18 at 11:53 PM.

  4. #184
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I found Soul Link offered a great means of leeching aoe/smart heals from the melee pack giving me huge self healing. Not sure there is a fight without constant damage, and 200k more effective health (with demon training glyph) will keep you alive through a lot. Only issue is Vizier and Elagon, where the boss is fixed and melees the nearest thing can get you killed.
    Interesting!

    If someone were to heal me though, let's say Greater Heal me for 100k, would I not recieve 50k directly and the other 50k to my minion?
    Making me "harder" to heal?

    Let's say I have 500k health, and my Felguard with the glyph have 500k, does that mean I can take 1 million damage before I die?
    Or that my minion can take just as much before I die? For when the minion take damage I take just as much and vice versa? (excluding Fel Armor and stuff like that)
    Is that why you say the "200k health for the glyph" is effective health?

    There's 600,000 questions for you to answer, please.


    Almost sounds too good!

  5. #185
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemie View Post
    Interesting!

    If someone were to heal me though, let's say Greater Heal me for 100k, would I not recieve 50k directly and the other 50k to my minion?
    Making me "harder" to heal?

    Let's say I have 500k health, and my Felguard with the glyph have 500k, does that mean I can take 1 million damage before I die?
    Or that my minion can take just as much before I die? For when the minion take damage I take just as much and vice versa? (excluding Fel Armor and stuff like that)
    Is that why you say the "200k health for the glyph" is effective health?

    There's 600,000 questions for you to answer, please.


    Almost sounds too good!
    You're still using the same health pool, so you still benefit fully from the 100k heal. The real benefit is with AoE heals where you receive 2 separate heals into the same health pool. I call it effective health because for other intents and purposes such as healthstones which are based on a %age of your own health pool, you will only receive the benefit of your own health pool - although you do get two distinct heals into one pool from Dark Regeneration which is nice.

  6. #186
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Sact isn't on the GCD.
    Shows how much I've used sac as demo :> interesting nonetheless, will have to swap for it.

  7. #187
    Quote Originally Posted by Kink View Post
    Shows how much I've used sac as demo :> interesting nonetheless, will have to swap for it.
    Neither sac or dark bargain is on the GCD anymore. AFAIK bargain used to be but isn't any longer. Both can be used while stunned now as well which I think was a 5.2 change.

  8. #188
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Neither sac or dark bargain is on the GCD anymore. AFAIK bargain used to be but isn't any longer. Both can be used while stunned now as well which I think was a 5.2 change.

    All of the above is correct.

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    You're still using the same health pool, so you still benefit fully from the 100k heal. The real benefit is with AoE heals where you receive 2 separate heals into the same health pool. I call it effective health because for other intents and purposes such as healthstones which are based on a %age of your own health pool, you will only receive the benefit of your own health pool - although you do get two distinct heals into one pool from Dark Regeneration which is nice.
    in addition, your demon has 90% reduced damage from aoe, so it effectively halves the damage you take from aoe as well.

  10. #190
    Moderator Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I found Soul Link offered a great means of leeching aoe/smart heals from the melee pack giving me huge self healing. Not sure there is a fight without constant damage, and 200k more effective health (with demon training glyph) will keep you alive through a lot. Only issue is Vizier and Elagon, where the boss is fixed and melees the nearest thing can get you killed.
    With the new Soul Leech in 5.2 Soul Link + Demonic Training + Soul Leech becomes a very potent combination of abilities. Last I tested your pet is gaining the Soul Leech shield at the same rate as you are, and damage done to your pet through Soul Link can be absorbed by Soul Leech.

    At 509 ilvl on PTR my pets health has 157k so about 680k effective health plus doubling the return from Soul Leech. Our passive defensive options are look pretty strong in 5.2, at least in PvE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Viggers View Post
    in addition, your demon has 90% reduced damage from aoe, so it effectively halves the damage you take from aoe as well.
    This isn't true.

    Lets say there is a big 100k AoE that goes out to the raid. I have 523k health and my pet has 156k. My pet has 23% of our overall pool, so will take 23k damage and I will take 77k damage. My pet will ALSO take the 100k hit, but will be reduced to 10k which will actually hit my pet for 2.3k and me for 7.7k.

    We actually take slightly more damage from AoE attacks using Soul Link, but we also get slightly more healing.
    Last edited by Zinnin; 2013-02-19 at 11:26 AM.

  11. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    This isn't true.

    Lets say there is a big 100k AoE that goes out to the raid. I have 523k health and my pet has 156k. My pet has 23% of our overall pool, so will take 23k damage and I will take 77k damage. My pet will ALSO take the 100k hit, but will be reduced to 10k which will actually hit my pet for 2.3k and me for 7.7k.

    We actually take slightly more damage from AoE attacks using Soul Link, but we also get slightly more healing.

    This is the exact reason why I stick with Sac Pact.

  12. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    This is the exact reason why I stick with Sac Pact.
    Sac Pact wont keep you up through errors that lead to unpredictable damage, Soul Link will - even with 10% more damage from AoE, that wont outweigh the substantial additional EH Soul Link offers.

  13. #193
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    Sac Pact wont keep you up through errors that lead to unpredictable damage, Soul Link will - even with 10% more damage from AoE, that wont outweigh the substantial additional EH Soul Link offers.

    So, you're telling me that a 230k bubble won't save your life, but taking 10% more damage and some extra healing will? I have bad news... If the extra 10% damage or the lack of the bubble kills you, the extra bit of healing is meaningless.

  14. #194
    Most of the damage in PvE that would kill you in that way isn't stuff that can be predicted; it'll happen because of a mistake or RNG for which a pre-emptive cooldown wont save you. Stuff which can be predicted is a part of the fight that's covered by external cooldowns/stacking/spreading or in some other way dealing with the mechanic pro-actively already, making Sac Pact (or Dark Bargain) pretty much just extra insurance; for which we get Unending Resolve baseline anyway.

    With that in mind, there is nothing that wouldn't kill you anyway that could kill you by taking 10% more of it on a ~25% bigger health pool.

    All that said, these talents are purely optional and down to personal preference, and the situations in the fight at hand. I would simply never press Sact Pact often enough under normal circumstances to justify it, same with Dark Regeneration and Glyphing Healthstone - I would however, swear by any or even all three of these on Blade Lord's gauntlet.

  15. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    With the new Soul Leech in 5.2 Soul Link + Demonic Training + Soul Leech becomes a very potent combination of abilities. Last I tested your pet is gaining the Soul Leech shield at the same rate as you are, and damage done to your pet through Soul Link can be absorbed by Soul Leech.

    At 509 ilvl on PTR my pets health has 157k so about 680k effective health plus doubling the return from Soul Leech. Our passive defensive options are look pretty strong in 5.2, at least in PvE.



    This isn't true.

    Lets say there is a big 100k AoE that goes out to the raid. I have 523k health and my pet has 156k. My pet has 23% of our overall pool, so will take 23k damage and I will take 77k damage. My pet will ALSO take the 100k hit, but will be reduced to 10k which will actually hit my pet for 2.3k and me for 7.7k.

    We actually take slightly more damage from AoE attacks using Soul Link, but we also get slightly more healing.
    woops! not thinking things through fail!

    so it looks like soul link will be very strong in 5.2 then. i never take it currently cos i prefer the dark bargain allowing me to fail

  16. #196
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    So, you're telling me that a 230k bubble won't save your life, but taking 10% more damage and some extra healing will? I have bad news... If the extra 10% damage or the lack of the bubble kills you, the extra bit of healing is meaningless.
    Some encounters require a player to take a debuff, which deals damage. In current content Lei Shi H is a good example.
    Basically your pet will never be at 100% HP in such a situation, and therefore receive the healing from Soul Leech. (which will not work in 5.2 because it's changed to a shield mechanic)

    The talent is a situational choice, which may have good results in a situation and bad ones in another fight. The key is to evaluate the fight beforehand, which talent will most likely be needed.

  17. #197
    Moderator Zinnin's Avatar
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    Personally I stuck with SacPact nearly 100% of the fights this tier just because of how amazing the cooldown is. There were a lot of fights where the big AoE mechanic was short duration and you could SacPact every other and fill the blanks with UR or DR+HS. There where very few occasions where I even considered using Soul Leech over Dark Regen and there where zero fights that I considered using Soul Link (a few times Dark Bargain though).

    With the new shield mechanic and the good synergy it has would soul link I think that I will actually consider going the passive route on at least some fights instead of largely ignoring them, good changes IMO.

    (which will not work in 5.2 because it's changed to a shield mechanic)
    It will still work just fine, all it being a shield does is make Soul Leech 100% effective healing until you cap the shield out, which won't happen. Damage given to your pet through Soul Link can be absorbed by the Soul Leech shield you are building up so it will be a very solid talent to get on fights where you might be taking a lot of damage constantly but no real burst that you want to cooldown through.

  18. #198
    Quote Originally Posted by Kink View Post
    Chaos wave hits harder instant damage then that of HoG, so if the targets aren't going to live with shadowflame or need to be slowed, Chaos wave comes into play.
    thanks for this helped me!

  19. #199
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Corruption should never be manually reapplied. You should only be applying it once at the beginning of the fight, and keeping it active with ToC for the rest.

    Sorry for the basic question, but what is ToC?

  20. #200
    Add this to the guide imo.
    Credit to PaulDok for sig!

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