1. #1281
    Quote Originally Posted by Shila View Post
    It does sound very nice indeed, however the 'use wild swarm now!' icon doesn't seem to show up for me. Imps cd one shows up, can't say about the berserking one since I'm not a troll. I'm not new to WA but I have no clue what is wrong. Has anyone else tried to import it?

    EDIT: NM, it sort of works now, just not exactly the way I expected it to.
    It will only show up if DS is on cooldown and has less than 99 secs left and if your imp swarm is not on cooldown and it has less cooldown if used now than DS. So you will very rarely see it. It would require like bloodlust+metagem proc when you use Imp Swarm it with DS, then when Imp Swarms comes off cooldown you would need to have metagem proc again to Imp swarm have less CD than currently DS has.

    You can see how it works if you go to Dummy and use DS and not use Imp swarm, after DS buff expires it will display the icon because you can get new Imp Swarm before next DS.

    So if you use it with DS everytime, you almost never see it. For trolls it will show up much more, if they line their berserking with DS+impswarm. If you see my math few posts ago in this thread, and you choose to use Imp Swarm with Breath of the Hydra trinket, then this will show up more frequently and you can use this to line up with DS more.

    There is also bug to make the icon to display at pull for no reason, i'll have to fix it and i'll post new one soon.
    Last edited by esatikkane; 2013-05-26 at 04:11 PM.

  2. #1282
    Bloodsail Admiral Chrispotter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkuggz View Post
    Stood in the same problem as you, and you are overthinking it! 8100 is a really neat spot, for multi target, haste does pull slightly ahead like council but it's not by miles. The fact you dont have BIS gear, also means you sack a lot of mastery for it thus might end up hurting you. I beat my old #1 log on Council again by a mastery build, despite playing a heavy haste build the other times. It's really RNG and if you don't want to regem / reforge for every boss, a strong 8100 / mastery build is the best overall ToT spec in my opinion. I wanted to go up in haste really fast too, as soon as i got gear, but it didnt feel amazing. You loose all your damage on Lei Shen and Durumu, while the mastery build still stays strong and live for rest of the encounters. I wouldnt even speculate in haste until you reach the 14900 values, but thats my opinion.

    Low haste builds make you able to play Destruction, Affliction and Demonology without Reforging and spending a ton of gold for each boss, and the most fun bosses scales the best with those stats regardless : )

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-25 at 01:09 AM ----------



    Dont trust simcraft and RPPM system with haste scaling, its 10.000 tries vs the few pulls you do on a boss :< Last reset i had 3% on jinrokh and 4% on mag on my 2/2 HC TF ULVS, despite that it should increase with ilvl. Game is RNG, simc overvalues haste becasue over 10.000 tries it flattens out the RNG you have killing a boss 20 times in your life!
    I agree with sparkuggz, until you can reach the 14800 or whatever haste point it is, you should not worry too much about haste. Just pick a decent amount that your gear will naturally take you too, go for the nearest breakpoint for doom, then just go full mastery.
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  3. #1283
    There isn't a conclusive way to see whether or not (for relatively small value shifts) haste or mastery is ahead for one pull, because on a pull by pull basis, you'll never be able to see the effects - of either. You don't get to do a single pull a second time and find out whether or not you'd have gotten 1 more trinket proc for another 1k haste, or if reforging from haste to mastery would drop 1 or 2 procs during your pull. It might not. On any given pull, it's more likely mastery will increase your damage on a given pull - it always does... but if you get bad RNG on a pull that could be a kill, and you're way past the beginning of bad luck protection before a proc, repeatedly, it's quite possible that extra haste would push you, for that pull, to another proc for significantly more DPS.

    Since we rely so highly on critical doom casts (here in the Demo folder), that one proc does matter. If you have pulls where you see significantly low UVLS uptime on a regular basis (4+ minutes between procs) haste becomes disproportionately valuable - you rely on that proc, and making it more likely to occur at the right time interval is just a good decision. On any given pull, you'll never know whether or not it helped you - hell, I've had 14 procs on N Megaera pulls in a mastery-focused setup - but you also see fewer of the times you're like "OMFG GIVE ME A PROC ALREADY" (they still happen - Durumu, UVLS proc at 100%, 5%, 3%. Thaaaanks)... but if I had less haste, these times would occur more often.

    In short, if you're biting for a top rank, mastery (which gives you bonus damage that scales with good RNG) will be superior to haste (which reduces the odds of really really bad procs). If you want consistent pulls, nothing provides it - procs will be procs - but haste makes it less likely that for any given pull, your procs suck and your DPS is just too low for the encounter.

  4. #1284
    Stood in the Fire Bloodfire's Avatar
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    Concerning UVLS.
    530 2/2 has higher proc rate than 522 or not?
    Just want to know whether it's useful to spend Valor.

  5. #1285
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodfire View Post
    Concerning UVLS.
    530 2/2 has higher proc rate than 522 or not?
    Just want to know whether it's useful to spend Valor.
    I upgraded my TF one, dont have HC yet, I feel it procs the same and I can swear it procs less at start now, or just bad RNG
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  6. #1286
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodfire View Post
    Concerning UVLS.
    530 2/2 has higher proc rate than 522 or not?
    Just want to know whether it's useful to spend Valor.
    It's higher
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  7. #1287
    it is a very minor amount it increases your uptime.

  8. #1288
    Well I'm really considering to just drop demonology. This UVLS RNG is really pissing me off as it ruins dps massively if you're really unlucky. Today I had no proc for almost 3 or 4 min and my dps went to hell. If I get lucky and get proper procs to keep doom rolling and such my dps is okay but nothing stunning. Does this have to do with having no set bonusses and no legendary gem ? Maybe it's my reforging or so..?

    I only have T15 gloves, despite doing LFR every week + Nalak and ToT normal whenever I can make it to the guild raids shit just doesn't drop. I understand my trinkets right now are BiS for me except for Cha-Ye's which beats the Volatile Talisman, however the UVSL RNG really ruins it for me.

    I'm using DS+Wild Imps on cooldown, popping into meta when I have DS up to spam Soul Fire and pretty much everything I should do but my dps just seems crap... Unfortunately I don't have any WoL log at the moment to back this up.

    Forgot to add armory, should I just reforge to 8100 haste and rest mastery and give it another try?

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  9. #1289
    High Overlord lydude's Avatar
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    Just a quick question for fellow locks out there regarding stat weights at my current ilvl..

    So, my warlock is my alt, and I'm sitting at a 508 ilvl. Here's my armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...fekto/advanced

    Right now, I'm reforging to the 4717 haste breakpoint, then reforging into Crit. Should I switch Crit with Mastery? The reason I'm asking, is I raided with another lock tonight. He's around the same ilvl as me but he plays Affliction. He was above my DPS by about 20k on each fight. Is Demonology that much lower than Affliction? I am new to Demonology, having played Affliction during 5.1, so I could be doing something wrong, but I figured I'd ask here and get my stat priorities straight before going any further.

    Thanks in advance for any help

  10. #1290
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodfire View Post
    Concerning UVLS.
    530 2/2 has higher proc rate than 522 or not?
    Just want to know whether it's useful to spend Valor.
    It should increase the proc rate.

    I upgraded mine, purely because VP is easy to come across and it's not like I'm likely to get a heroic version any time soon.

  11. #1291
    I keep getting DCd on Lei Shen when I demonic Leap. Doesn't happen all the time but my god it is annoying. Anyone know what's up with that?

  12. #1292
    Quote Originally Posted by Ericprydz View Post
    I keep getting DCd on Lei Shen when I demonic Leap. Doesn't happen all the time but my god it is annoying. Anyone know what's up with that?
    I vaguely remember some earlier reports mentioning it happened when using Demonic Leap while jumping.

  13. #1293
    i have a question about megaera 25 heroic fight.. going full haste better for this fight OR getting haste 8100 breakpoint then gemming/reforging to mastery better for high aoe burst? also goserv or gosac.. which one is better? got 529 ilvl %31 haste and %16 mastery.

  14. #1294
    Stood in the Fire Aeiri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lydude View Post
    Just a quick question for fellow locks out there regarding stat weights at my current ilvl..

    So, my warlock is my alt, and I'm sitting at a 508 ilvl. Here's my armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...fekto/advanced

    Right now, I'm reforging to the 4717 haste breakpoint, then reforging into Crit. Should I switch Crit with Mastery? The reason I'm asking, is I raided with another lock tonight. He's around the same ilvl as me but he plays Affliction. He was above my DPS by about 20k on each fight. Is Demonology that much lower than Affliction? I am new to Demonology, having played Affliction during 5.1, so I could be doing something wrong, but I figured I'd ask here and get my stat priorities straight before going any further.

    Thanks in advance for any help

    Well for one Demo really steps up in power when you can grab the Lei Shen trinket. You will notice a nice improvement if you can even get the LFR version. And yes, mastery is better than crit.

  15. #1295
    I read as many pages as I could and I have a question. Don't you guys feel... uncomfortable for the dependency of demonology on lei shen's trinket? What will happen to 5.4 and the new gear tier? Will it stay the same and force people to keep teh same trinket even after the ilvl jump? That would be awkward. Nerf it? That would make demo lag behind. Change demo mechanics? I really cannot see a solution here.

  16. #1296
    Quote Originally Posted by Rayaleith View Post
    I read as many pages as I could and I have a question. Don't you guys feel... uncomfortable for the dependency of demonology on lei shen's trinket? What will happen to 5.4 and the new gear tier? Will it stay the same and force people to keep teh same trinket even after the ilvl jump? That would be awkward. Nerf it? That would make demo lag behind. Change demo mechanics? I really cannot see a solution here.
    Enjoy it while it lasts. Either it will stay BiS, or it won't. Wouldn't be the first time a previous-tier item has remained in the mix. With all the additional int, haste, and mastery we'll get in SoO it will scale very well. At worst Demo will be in a "good" instead of amazing place, whether we're still using UVLS or something in SoO is slightly better.
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  17. #1297
    Pretty sure they can't come up with trinket that would be better than UVLS for demo. It's just so perfect trinket for demo, like it was meant for Doom. They would need to nerf Wild Imp damage and buff other damage spells to make other trinkets better.

  18. #1298
    Quote Originally Posted by esatikkane View Post
    Pretty sure they can't come up with trinket that would be better than UVLS for demo. It's just so perfect trinket for demo, like it was meant for Doom. They would need to nerf Wild Imp damage and buff other damage spells to make other trinkets better.
    Exactly. It would require a drastic nerf to not be BiS; if it doesn't cause Demo or other dot classes that like crits (Spriests, boomkins) to become severely OP next tier, I wouldn't expect a change. Grab the highest level you can and ride it out if you like Demo or want to be prepared "just in case" for next tier. Either the trinket or our fundamental mechanics would require some serious changes (or for T15 trinkets to be even more overpowered in comparison) for us to swap trinkets; even discounting the HUGE amount of damage the imps themselves do, the fury gain is massive. There's just no way around it.

  19. #1299
    Doesn't that make UVLS kind of a really stupid trinket aswell?

    I really dislike these items that are mandatory for a spec, I wish they'd never make them really. They should just change DS to make your next doom crit while it's active, so we can move along with trinkets and every destro lock can play the game without having to farm Lei-Shen for this one specific trinket really.

    Quoting myself incase people missed my question earlier:

    Well I'm really considering to just drop demonology. This UVLS RNG is really pissing me off as it ruins dps massively if you're really unlucky. Today I had no proc for almost 3 or 4 min and my dps went to hell. If I get lucky and get proper procs to keep doom rolling and such my dps is okay but nothing stunning. Does this have to do with having no set bonusses and no legendary gem ? Maybe it's my reforging or so..?

    I only have T15 gloves, despite doing LFR every week + Nalak and ToT normal whenever I can make it to the guild raids shit just doesn't drop. I understand my trinkets right now are BiS for me except for Cha-Ye's which beats the Volatile Talisman, however the UVSL RNG really ruins it for me.

    I'm using DS+Wild Imps on cooldown, popping into meta when I have DS up to spam Soul Fire and pretty much everything I should do but my dps just seems crap... Unfortunately I don't have any WoL log at the moment to back this up.

    Forgot to add armory, should I just reforge to 8100 haste and rest mastery and give it another try?

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  20. #1300
    The UVLS situation reminds me of Shard of Woe. I'm pretty sure that Shard remained BiS all through the next tier, and even early into the tier after that. So the situation is not unprecedented.

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