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  1. #81
    Well, practically going 4717 its the best way, you can switch to aff without much fuzz and as much as I love demo on some fights demo its its crap on others(mainly HC progression) because of certain mechanics and/or aff advantages.
    Last edited by Hellfury; 2013-01-28 at 08:06 PM.
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  2. #82
    Fully upgraded, which would be better: Flashfrozen Resin Globule or Static-Caster's Medallion?

    SCM benifits:
    Better lining up with darksoul
    Small burst inbetween ds uses
    More static stats

    FRG:
    More int during proc
    Longer duration
    Cheaper( valor on other upgrades)

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Monkeyy4 View Post
    Fully upgraded, which would be better: Flashfrozen Resin Globule or Static-Caster's Medallion?

    SCM benifits:
    Better lining up with darksoul
    Small burst inbetween ds uses
    More static stats

    FRG:
    More int during proc
    Longer duration
    Cheaper( valor on other upgrades)
    FRG is the best you'll get until heroics. I've seen some hold onto it longer though.


    Unrelated: How would I approach demo on heroic wind lord in a "safe" manner? The majority of demo AoE is pretty much melee range, and I don't want to risk RNG putting too many wind bombs right next to melee.

    I'd play destro, but not very experienced with it yet and FnB seems to be a bit wonky (cannot activate back to back unless you wait a fraction of a second after the cast is finished)

    As for affliction, I just flat out don't want to play affliction. Spamming seed of corruption for 5 minutes is not my idea of fun I'll play it if I have to, but I'd rather not.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by dot exe View Post
    Unrelated: How would I approach demo on heroic wind lord in a "safe" manner? The majority of demo AoE is pretty much melee range, and I don't want to risk RNG putting too many wind bombs right next to melee.

    I'd play destro, but not very experienced with it yet and FnB seems to be a bit wonky (cannot activate back to back unless you wait a fraction of a second after the cast is finished)

    As for affliction, I just flat out don't want to play affliction. Spamming seed of corruption for 5 minutes is not my idea of fun I'll play it if I have to, but I'd rather not.

    Even on 25 man, I stood in melee as Demo with no problem. Don't use MF, you don't need the extra range at all. Use AV for extra damage during Rain of Blades, and if you get Korthik Strike/Rain of Blade during Recklessness while you're CDs are up, use the AV CD for some huge boss damage. (Rain of Blades with Dark Soul, Meta and AV leads to 226k ticks, as seen here.)

    Aside from that, run Aura of the Elements pre-pull if needed, Corruption every add that isn't CC'd as well as the boss, Doom everything that isn't CC'd, HoG twice and Meta right after for a 2 stack of Shadowflame, and Void Ray spam. After about 12-15 seconds, your Fury is going to start to skyrocket because of the Doom ticks, run Immo Aura at this point. Leave Meta as needed for a single global to HoG, and go right back into Meta. As you get close to Recklessness, refresh Doom on the set of adds that isn't dying, and continue to spam Void Ray. Its possible to cap your Fury even if you're spamming Void Ray, but be careful not to go under 800~ by using Immo Aura too much.

    Right as the adds are dying, drop Meta, HoG, and jump back into Meta. If you time it right, the HoG will be in travel time when the boss gains Recklessness. Pop all your CDs including Glyphed Imps, and spam Soul Fire. Drop Meta to HoG still, as you need the MC procs from Shadowflame. After that, just rinse and repeat, and be sure to Corruption/Doom the new adds when they spawn, and keep Aura of the Elements up if need be.

    Best of luck.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-29 at 12:27 AM ----------

    Oh, one last thing that I forgot. Use Glyphed Carrion Swarm on CD outside of Recklessness.
    Last edited by Teye; 2013-01-29 at 05:27 AM.

  5. #85
    Stood in the Fire Avikur's Avatar
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    If I refresh doom with say 20 seconds to go, with Pandemic it adds to the duration, do I loose that extra tick my 3036 haste gives me? do I only get the extra tick if it goes for the full duration and then drops off?

  6. #86
    Could someone answer how to deal with the following scenarios?:

    Scenario 1
    Near capped fury, DS off CD, 2-3 MC procs, above 25% boss health, singletarget, and Bloodlust/heroism active. What's the plan?

    Scenario 2
    Same as above, but no DS up. What's the plan?

  7. #87
    1: Soul Fire 2-3 times.
    2: Don't Soul Fire unless you're literally going to over cap from a Doom tick.

  8. #88
    1) ds + meta + doom + toc spam
    while still using the mc charges before they expire if they would

    2) meta, toc spam to free some fury, then out of meta spam your soulfire charges to rebuild
    imho, as long as you will have "enough" fury for a full DS, there's no need to be at the max
    Last edited by nipil; 2013-01-29 at 10:25 AM.

  9. #89
    Moderator Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkeyy4 View Post
    Fully upgraded, which would be better: Flashfrozen Resin Globule or Static-Caster's Medallion?

    SCM benifits:
    Better lining up with darksoul
    Small burst inbetween ds uses
    More static stats

    FRG:
    More int during proc
    Longer duration
    Cheaper( valor on other upgrades)
    SCM is going to be slightly better, but for the amount of valor that is (buying it and upgrading) I don't think it is worth the valor. If you do not have 4pc yet, then I think SCM is a better investment because it lines up more smoothly without delaying.

    It really comes down to how much other gear you are getting, if it looks like you will get replacement trinkets eventually your probably better off in the long run using valor upgrading gear.

    On a side note, I really hope we get a good raid on-use trinket next tier....

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    On a side note, I really hope we get a good raid on-use trinket next tier....
    I think PvP burst killed that prospect.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    1: Soul Fire 2-3 times.
    2: Don't Soul Fire unless you're literally going to over cap from a Doom tick.
    Could you be a little more detailed, like over the next 20 seconds? and specify if you mean SF in or out of meta.

    Quote Originally Posted by nipil View Post
    1) ds + meta + doom + toc spam
    while still using the mc charges before they expire if they would

    2) meta, toc spam to free some fury, then out of meta spam your soulfire charges to rebuild
    imho, as long as you will have "enough" fury for a full DS, there's no need to be at the max
    So you're saying bloodlust/heroism does not change your spell priorities at all?

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    On a side note, I really hope we get a good raid on-use trinket next tier....
    I hope that will never happen. Its just too annoying in combination with engineering gloves.

  13. #93
    Moderator Zinnin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apero View Post
    I hope that will never happen. Its just too annoying in combination with engineering gloves.
    That seems to me more of a problem with engi gloves (which is something I sympathize with being an engineer) then trinkets.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Micke View Post
    So you're saying bloodlust/heroism does not change your spell priorities at all?
    It does - its most probably that during heroism/bloodlust your warriors will use their DPS banner - in that case you should cast MC if you have proc. You will get much more benefits from full buffed SF during banner than from extra fury outside meta.



    About trinkets, in my opinion Static-Caster's Medallion is bis for demo locks in both situation - with and without 4p bonus. Situation when you are 100% sure that you will have 1 trinket proc during meta without delay (so without RNG) is to good, situation when almost all the time you would be able to have 2 trinker proc during meta with small delay is just everything that demo locks need. Less RNG and more proc during meta, also better meta controlling = win for this spec.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Even on 25 man, I stood in melee as Demo with no problem. Don't use MF, you don't need the extra range at all. Use AV for extra damage during Rain of Blades, and if you get Korthik Strike/Rain of Blade during Recklessness while you're CDs are up, use the AV CD for some huge boss damage. (Rain of Blades with Dark Soul, Meta and AV leads to 226k ticks, as seen here.)

    Aside from that, run Aura of the Elements pre-pull if needed, Corruption every add that isn't CC'd as well as the boss, Doom everything that isn't CC'd, HoG twice and Meta right after for a 2 stack of Shadowflame, and Void Ray spam. After about 12-15 seconds, your Fury is going to start to skyrocket because of the Doom ticks, run Immo Aura at this point. Leave Meta as needed for a single global to HoG, and go right back into Meta. As you get close to Recklessness, refresh Doom on the set of adds that isn't dying, and continue to spam Void Ray. Its possible to cap your Fury even if you're spamming Void Ray, but be careful not to go under 800~ by using Immo Aura too much.

    Right as the adds are dying, drop Meta, HoG, and jump back into Meta. If you time it right, the HoG will be in travel time when the boss gains Recklessness. Pop all your CDs including Glyphed Imps, and spam Soul Fire. Drop Meta to HoG still, as you need the MC procs from Shadowflame. After that, just rinse and repeat, and be sure to Corruption/Doom the new adds when they spawn, and keep Aura of the Elements up if need be.

    Best of luck.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-29 at 12:27 AM ----------

    Oh, one last thing that I forgot. Use Glyphed Carrion Swarm on CD outside of Recklessness.
    You talking normal, the guy asked HC

    You cant stay melee on HC, anyway becuase of the "bust" phase hellfire its not really important. Still demo is very strong even if you cant hellfire the adds, Demo on that boss is all about maximize cooldowns for the burst phase and keeping dooms and corruptions on the adds and ofc SF thats the bulk of the damage.
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  16. #96
    You can Hellfire the adds on HC before the first wind bomb comes out, then you have to stay at range or you stuff Melee. If you want to use Aoe cast Harvest life at range, it hits all adds, great for fury gains, make sure doom and corruption is up on all adds. with 4 piece, you can pre pot and ds on pull and it's up before the first Reckness. This is where you want to drop your load, Pot/ds/imps/doomgaurd/Service, and if hero, Soulfire your arse off. Make sure you save 2 hog, shadowflame for reckness as well.

    After reckness is over, the next adds are almost dead(some guild do 2 in 1 go) so you have around 20 secs to build fury for another Reckness burn, you should have 10 more soulfires up for it and get the Fury high, by now boss should be at around 35%, just repeat to dead. This fight is all about avoiding Wind Bombs. With Mf on you can Immo Aura at a good range the whole fight. Hope this helps.

  17. #97
    Bloodsail Admiral Liquidsteel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    You talking normal, the guy asked HC.
    Actually he's talking about heroic, hence the reason he mentions putting Corruption and Doom on the "new adds when they spawn".

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    You talking normal, the guy asked HC

    You cant stay melee on HC, anyway becuase of the "bust" phase hellfire its not really important. Still demo is very strong even if you cant hellfire the adds, Demo on that boss is all about maximize cooldowns for the burst phase and keeping dooms and corruptions on the adds and ofc SF thats the bulk of the damage.

    Was talking about Heroic, and you need to be in melee for Void Ray, not for Hellfire. The question was "can I AoE safely from Melee". The answer is yes, I just gave him some extra advice regarding the fight.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-29 at 08:24 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by lichanator View Post
    with 4 piece, you can pre pot and ds on pull and it's up before the first Reckness.

    Your group's dps must be REALLY low if that's the case. Make sure the players with low AoE (Arcane Mages) are single targeting Menders.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-29 at 08:30 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Micke View Post
    Could you be a little more detailed, like over the next 20 seconds? and specify if you mean SF in or out of meta.

    If you're near Fury cap, DS is up, Bloodlust is up and you have any MC charges, use them in Meta. After that, just ToC spam and leave Meta for HoG, and go back into Meta during HoG travel time for extra Shadowflame damage. That Shadowflame will give an MC proc or two 99% of the time, so if you're still on high (80%+) Fury, DS and Lust are still up, use those in Meta as well.

    If DS and Bloodlust aren't up, just ToC spam and save the Fury for later in the fight when you can line it up with CDs. Int procs are a great time to use Soul Fire out of Meta, the extra Crit from the Int leads to a bunch of extra damag and you'll generate Fury for your next CD burn phase. Building up a bunch of extra fury whenever you can is important with the 4 set. If you're wasting Fury on anything other than 1-2 ToCs every HoG cast, you're not going to have enough Fury for a proper burn each time DS is up.

  19. #99
    I'm a bit confused... every time I run simcraft after reforging something the stat priorities change drastically. I'm having a really hard time figuring out how I should set myself up.

    I was originally using a full Mastery build but then I ran a sim and it said Haste was far superior, so I reforged to loads of Haste. The next sim said Crit was much better, so I replaced some of that Haste with Crit. Next sim said Mastery was much better, so I reforged into a little Mastery. Now the most recent sim is again saying Haste is far superior to both..

    I'm currently ilv 493, at 3050 haste, 16% crit and 16% mastery and afraid to touch anything

    Testing on training dummies at least they all seem to give pretty much the same DPS, but the highest was using Haste > Crit > Mastery. Should I just stick with that?
    Last edited by Netherspark; 2013-01-30 at 04:32 AM.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Netherspark View Post
    I'm a bit confused... every time I run simcraft after reforging something the stat priorities change drastically. I'm having a really hard time figuring out how I should set myself up.

    I was originally using a full Mastery build but then I ran a sim and it said Haste was far superior, so I reforged to loads of Haste. The next sim said Crit was much better, so I replaced some of that Haste with Crit. Next sim said Mastery was much better, so I reforged into a little Mastery. Now the most recent sim is again saying Haste is far superior to both..

    I'm currently ilv 493, at 3050 haste, 16% crit and 16% mastery and afraid to touch anything

    Testing on training dummies at least they all seem to give pretty much the same DPS, but the highest was using Haste > Crit > Mastery. Should I just stick with that?
    All in all correct reforges make up something like 1-2k dps(Yes they are important but will you see a noticeable difference on a dummy? most likely not). It fluctuates a lot because for example:

    If I hit 4717 haste (Corruption breakpoint) it's going to tell me to start going the opposite direction then it originally told me to go before I hit 4717, because haste is no longer favored anymore.
    If I go for all mastery then crit, so much so that it starts to get unbalanced, crit will start edging above mastery.

    This is why SimC's reforge plots are so useful, it finds the medium for the selected stats that you choose. Check out Evrelia's SimC guide, it's helpful regardless of class/spec. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=v8HqF-0egDY
    Last edited by Kink; 2013-01-30 at 04:53 AM.

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