1. #2541
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    I am aware that it was nerfed 20% the first week, I'm saying that IA is doing 15-16% less on live then it should be after the 20% nerf.
    Yay stealth nerfs. Probably some issue then with their database when it comes to them making patchnotes when it comes to meta abilities due to the way they're changed from the basic spell. Void Ray nerf was probably intended too then.

  2. #2542
    I was kinda suspecting that since mannoroth fury isn't as strong as it sounds
    Last edited by Xephyria; 2013-10-19 at 08:47 AM.

  3. #2543
    Void ray's cost went up 100% along with fel flame's cost but I never noticed its damage....probably because its awkward to use at best when it did let you maintain a DF income from multiple corruptions. Now its just a fast way to flush DF for aoe damage that is pathetic in terms of what ele/warrior/etc get. TLDR haven't used it much in 5.4 as its cons stack rapidly.

  4. #2544
    Anyone got a Simc list that compares demo, affli and destro in BiS gear? can't seem to find it anywhere...

  5. #2545
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by protput View Post
    Anyone got a Simc list that compares demo, affli and destro in BiS gear? can't seem to find it anywhere...
    The only one I've seen so far was posted by Sparkuggz on his website, here.

  6. #2546
    Quote Originally Posted by Werst View Post
    Void ray's cost went up 100% along with fel flame's cost but I never noticed its damage....probably because its awkward to use at best when it did let you maintain a DF income from multiple corruptions. Now its just a fast way to flush DF for aoe damage that is pathetic in terms of what ele/warrior/etc get. TLDR haven't used it much in 5.4 as its cons stack rapidly.
    Yeah, Void ray was going to be obsolete in its use due to our 4Pt16 as it was, so they put a double DF cost on it to seal the deal! lol

  7. #2547
    I need some help.

    Valefar's Armory

    For some reason I feel like my DPS took a step back after some upgrades I obtained. I opt to go for the 13K break point for the shadow flame tick and I'm certain I didn't sacrifice too much mastery. Unbuffed, I'm sitting on 12178 mastery and 13794 haste. I don't have logs at the moment, but I definitely feel a little off. Maybe I sacrifice too much primary stat to obtain the extra tick?

  8. #2548
    Next Shadowflame tick is at 14873 haste. Something we should probably only consider in close to full heroic BiS.

  9. #2549
    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    Next Shadowflame tick is at 14873 haste. Something we should probably only consider in close to full heroic BiS.
    I'm under the impression an upgraded PBI means you aim for a 13772 number assuming raid buff. Am I misreading that?

  10. #2550
    Messed with 15K haste for the shadowflame tick BP and it definitely helps DF generation. Plus you get shadowbolt casts off between hazards much easier. Though now you are generating DF faster than you typically have trinket procs to spend it on or enough MC charges. This is at 572ilvl. Sims say its a gain (vs 8100 haste > mast > crit > haste) where my mast was around 16K and crit around 9K. To hit that point I had to gem haste vs mastery which is 9x orange, 4x yellow, 3x green.

  11. #2551
    Deleted
    15k shadowfury breakpoint is ~14k dps increase over that 8100 breakpoint for me in single in simc. Tried both in our Paragon HC progress and 15k definitely felt much better and did more damage with that. And in that fight you swim in fury and gain more molten core procs you can spend.

  12. #2552
    Quote Originally Posted by WildcatTM View Post
    I'm under the impression an upgraded PBI means you aim for a 13772 number assuming raid buff. Am I misreading that?
    The character screen still has to say the exact number of the cap or above (can't remember what it is, but you need 15k haste for 15k cap even if you have the PBI equipped), the character screen is updated if you equip / unequip the trinket.

    Therefore you'll need 13772 haste in your character screen WITHOUT the trinket equipped for that to be true.

  13. #2553
    Is Demo still viable at 560ilvl gear for heroics progression?

  14. #2554
    There are not very many people playing it, as evidenced by my world 9 H Malorok kill. I like it on Malkorok for the increased mobility and splash damage on the adds.

    http://worldoflogs.com/reports/gmxo1...rd/?s=84&e=422

  15. #2555
    Quote Originally Posted by Numiro View Post
    The character screen still has to say the exact number of the cap or above (can't remember what it is, but you need 15k haste for 15k cap even if you have the PBI equipped), the character screen is updated if you equip / unequip the trinket.

    Therefore you'll need 13772 haste in your character screen WITHOUT the trinket equipped for that to be true.
    So that's how it works?

  16. #2556
    Quote Originally Posted by WildcatTM View Post
    So that's how it works?
    I'd recommend AskMrRobot.com. They'll help you figure out stuff like that.

  17. #2557
    Hi everyone, new 90 warlock here. 5.4 brought me back into the game, I haven't done any serious raiding since BC, and I just have some questions I've got conflicting answers from:
    It says in the op that Mastery isn't snapshotted, so does dark soul affect Doom and Corruption if they are refreshed during it?
    And how does ToC refreshing interact with corruption's caster damage bonus?
    Is it better to refresh a DS'd Doom with a heavy procs one w/o DS? I've been using Affdots but I'm still confused about the whole DS interaction.
    Going off of that, in order to benefit from the meta mastery do you need to stay in meta form for the whole duration of the 2 stack DoT? Is it worth doing so before switching into meta with DS?
    And how important is refreshing corruption with a huge strong of procs attached? Since it doesn't hit too hard and gets overridden a lot with ToC.
    MC stacks, I was messing around with a crit heavy build, and found that using them in Meta form, particularly in DS, they hit like trucks. However simc has been producing better results with a 8097haste>mastery>haste=crit. With those stat weights, would it be better spent to still save my mc procs for meta dump, or use them more in caster?

    I've only done 1 run through of ToT so far, looking to do better in the DPS charts before I head to SoO

  18. #2558
    Quote Originally Posted by WildcatTM View Post
    So that's how it works?
    Just equip the trinket, the haste on your character screen is your real haste. You don't need to do any fancy math. If you have your trinket equipped and your character screen shows you at your desired haste BP, then congratulations, you hit it.

  19. #2559
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    Imp Swarm is dead, pretty much that is the end of it for now.

    Again with trying to say using Soul Fires in meta means your generating less fury, this isn't true.

    For the purposes of this I'm going to pretend that the only spells in our rotation are filler spells.


    27% raid Haste

    Shadow Bolt
    Cast time: 1.968
    Fury Gain /s: 12.698

    Soul Fire: Caster Form
    Cast time: 1.574
    Fury Gain /s: 19.048

    Soul Fire: Meta Form
    Cast time: 1.574
    Fury Loss /s: 50.79

    Touch of Chaos
    Cast time: 1
    Fury Loss /s: 40

    Scenario 1:
    60s DPS time, 5 stacks of Molten Core used in caster form.

    5 Soul Fires:
    7.87s Casting time
    150 fury gained

    19 Shadow bolts:
    37.392 Casting time
    475 Fury Gained

    15 Touch of Chaos
    15s Casting time
    600 Fury Spent
    Scenario 2:
    60s DPS time, 5 stack of Molten Core used in meta form.

    26 Shadow Bolts:
    51.168s Casting time
    650 Fury Gain

    5 Meta Soul Fires
    7.87s Casting time
    560 Fury Spent

    1 ToC cast
    1s Casting time
    40 Fury Spent
    Total Fury Gained: 625 Total Fury Gained: 650
    Total Fury Spent: 600 Total Fury Spent: 600
    Total Time Spent: 60.262s Total Time Spent: 60.038
    Meta Uptime: 15s Meta Uptime: 8.87

    This is what I've been trying to say for awhile now. As our haste goes up, spending Soul fire in META form actually generates MORE fury because the time spend in Meta goes down. The damage per fury spent for Soul Fire and Touch of Chaos is nearly identical, with Soul Fire having the lead. So not only is it the same slightly more damage per fury spent, you are gaining more fury to spend, and you can fit more fury into cooldowns which is increasing the worth of each point of fury.

    The only Wild Card to this debate was how t16 2pc would effect spending Molten Core procs because dumping them at one time means losing potential uptime of the 2pc. However, I have found that having more reliable 2pc uptime during procs (plus the fact soul fire is just so much more damage) outweighs trying to bait extra 2pc procs when you don't have fury to spend on them anyways.
    Could some kind person put actual damage numbers to this sort of analysis? Or is it obvious which scenario results in more overall damage?

  20. #2560
    Quote Originally Posted by Brolo View Post
    Could some kind person put actual damage numbers to this sort of analysis? Or is it obvious which scenario results in more overall damage?
    Its better to save up your mc procs for trinket procs + dark soul and dump them in meta form

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