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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by autopsy View Post
    My only issue with the term remodel is that it has a very broad use and because of this it's seen very negatively by a vast majority of the vocal wow community.
    What I mean by the is -
    A raptor ---> A raptor with a feather on it's leg = remodel
    A raptor ---> Raven Lord = remodel

    The difference here is one is a really small and simple modification of the existing raptor model, the other is almost entirely new with the exception of the skeleton.
    I guess it comes down too whether you consider the skeleton as part of the model.
    The raven lord is a whole other model, it just uses the same rig (aka skeleton) as the raptor does. Hence like my first post, the 'skeleton' is only there for animation purposes.

    Also I think you'd be amazed how many models actually use the same 'skeleton' but are animated differently.
    Last edited by Condemner; 2013-01-11 at 01:22 PM.

  2. #42
    Scarab Lord MasterOfKnees's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chonar View Post
    *deep breath*

    The "skin" is the texture that wraps around a model.
    Recoloring is changing the texture colors from one color to another.
    A recolor is always a reskin.
    However, a reskin is not always a recolor, since you could change the texture to, for example, paint a tattoo somewhere.
    I was about to go nuts, but both this post and the picture you have made explains it all very well.

  3. #43
    People make this too complicated. Skins are 2 dimensional flat image files. They are nothing but saved images. Models are 3d rendered objects. If you see something that has form and shape, it's a model. If it's a 2d texture, it's a skin.

    Blizzard doesn't just reuse skeletons to save time. They have to reuse skeletons to keep the game requirements minimized as much as they can for as long as they can keep it that way. Every new skeleton added adds entirely new things for the computer to handle processing where as model edits and skins are small file sizes.

    I personally can't stand most remodels using the same skeletons/rigs, but in WOTLK they started getting a lot better about customizing new models for old skeletons, and they've only gotten better since then.

    Still, visual fatigue is one of the greatest enemies an MMO can have, the human eye recognizes patterns and even if you don't consciously become aware of it, it causes boredom and an ever increasing fatigue that eventually makes you sick and tired of looking at the same thing. To people who are visually oriented it's like you're shoving the same food in their mouth day after day after day for years on end.

    Still, Blizzard's artists have show some very clever ways of completely remodeling a model to hide the skeleton use.

    I think Illidan's new model is the best job they've ever done for making something old look really cool, I would kill for Night Elf males that look like this with brand new facial expressions and modernized versions of their combat animations.

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  4. #44
    Titan Kangodo's Avatar
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    A model basically has thee parts:
    Skeleton
    Model
    Skin

    The skeleton is mostly for moving and stuff, to determine how it acts.
    A model is it's shape.
    A reskin is the colour.

    A nice way to remember it is this: If it looks the same when you paint it all black, it has the same model.

  5. #45
    Amazing how much people are adding to this subject, considering it's pretty simple and obvious.

    Model = model/skeleton/mold

    Skin = texture

    The end. No pictures or lectures necessary. People should start using google when they have a question like this.

  6. #46
    Elemental Lord Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by autopsy View Post
    My only issue with the term remodel is that it has a very broad use and because of this it's seen very negatively by a vast majority of the vocal wow community.
    What I mean by the is -
    A raptor ---> A raptor with a feather on it's leg = remodel
    A raptor ---> Raven Lord = remodel

    The difference here is one is a really small and simple modification of the existing raptor model, the other is almost entirely new with the exception of the skeleton.
    I guess it comes down too whether you consider the skeleton as part of the model.
    A point of interest, but the old vanilla raptor mob models only have one model. The green raptor skin doesn't have feathers on its arms/legs, while the others do. The feathers, however, are 2D extensions of the skin, that are simply left blank on the green one.

    Really just a technicality though
    "Do not look down, my friend. Even in the darkest of times, there is always hope... Hope for a better day, hope for a new dawn... Or just hope for a good breakfast. You start small, then see what you can get." ~ Covetous Shen
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  7. #47
    I am Murloc! Thelxi's Avatar
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    While I do want blizzard to stop being so lazy and cheap, new character models don't excite me very much. I am happy with the way my toons look. When they do change it I hope they just update and modernize what already is there, and I also hope they give us the option of keeping the old models.

  8. #48
    The Patient
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    The confusion usally comes from the term skinning, you skin/weigh mesh/models to rigs/skeleton, then apply a texture map. The same rig usually supports multiple models in WoW, with models supporting alot of different texture maps. Making a new rig with a new animation set is alot of work, wich is why even most new mounts and models use an older rig. For example, both twin emps, and even the DK's DRW weapon uses the Nelf male rig and animation sets.

    Why people don't just say "Re-texture" is beyond me, cause that's exactly what it is. Instead of throw all these other terms around.
    Last edited by Iso; 2013-01-12 at 01:50 AM.

  9. #49
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    I feel this thread should be mandatory to read every time a new model is datamined.

  10. #50
    Elemental Lord Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I feel this thread should be mandatory to read every time a new model is datamined.
    Sadly, it kinda of is...
    Last edited by Kaleredar; 2013-01-12 at 01:54 AM.
    "Do not look down, my friend. Even in the darkest of times, there is always hope... Hope for a better day, hope for a new dawn... Or just hope for a good breakfast. You start small, then see what you can get." ~ Covetous Shen
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  11. #51
    The Unstoppable Force N-aix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I feel this thread should be mandatory to read every time a new model is datamined.
    No no Just get the first pictures on first page save it and all is done.

  12. #52
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Re-model - Same skeleton, marginally different animations, different skin, different model. Example: Mogu <-> Draenei

    Re-skin - Same skeleton, same model (or minor additions like armor), different skin, same animations. Example: Proto Drake <-> Fire Hawk.
    Human Female Gladiator (DPS Prot) Warrior. Wyrmrest Accord - US.

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  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    Re-model - Same skeleton, marginally different animations, different skin, different model. Example: Mogu <-> Draenei

    Re-skin - Same skeleton, same model (or minor additions like armor), different skin, same animations. Example: Proto Drake <-> Fire Hawk.
    Wrong, read the thread.

  14. #54
    I think completely changing it to somethin else counts.

  15. #55
    Sha is just a remodelled ravager
    I think i can give up choose talent in this level?
    because if i am not choose this level。 i can have 20% blood more than choosen..
    GREAT BLZ.
    warlock now became a guy use 5 level talents VS other 6 level.

  16. #56
    Warchief Byniri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    There is only one correct definition

    If the skin (texture) is different then it's a reskin
    The texture is literally the skin of the model, it couldn't possibly mean anything else
    If the model (geometry) is different then it's a remodel


    This x100.

    Glad to see people are understanding the difference.
    PEPE SILVA, PEPE SILVA

  17. #57
    There is a step-by-step I found in google in a few seconds:
    http://udn.epicgames.com/Three/FBXSk...hPipeline.html

    The thing you have to think in the characters on build-up LAYERS.

    There is the Skeleton that is animated to provide movements.


    Over this skeleton is applied a MESH, that is a wireframe defining position of the polygons that define the shape of a model.


    Connecting the SKELETON and the MESH, the modelers create a RIG, that define which polygons are deformed and which keep their form as the skeleton change places:


    Finally over that model is applied a TEXTURE that give the overall details of the shape:



    I hope that help to understand what means


    So, before you call Blizzard lazy, think if they had to alter the wireframe, then adjust the rig, then replace the texture to fit, before releasing a model.

    And why they don't change the skeletons? Well, do the math in interactions with objects and other models.Most of the time it looks like wasted used of resources.
    But again one occasional waste makes things look cooler, as I noticed on one-time stuff CDPR did on Witcher 2. So I too put a challenge to Blizzard, besides defending them.
    Last edited by Buu; 2013-01-12 at 05:24 AM.

    Buu <= WHY I LOVE TO PLAY HUNTERS! => Pendleton

  18. #58
    Elemental Lord Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by squidbear View Post
    Sha is just a remodelled ravager
    the sha is as much a remodeled ravager as a ravager is a remodeled horse
    "Do not look down, my friend. Even in the darkest of times, there is always hope... Hope for a better day, hope for a new dawn... Or just hope for a good breakfast. You start small, then see what you can get." ~ Covetous Shen
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

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