1. #1

    How is the SWTOR raid system?

    Hi,
    So I was playing WOW around year as healer,tank and dps on raids but my main was tank, then i quit because of irl things, i was GM and Raid Leader , we normally cleared everything on normal on first lockout of new patch like firelands,dragon soul etc , then next week we were starting heroics in which we killed always first boss on hc and sometimes second, then next weeks depending on patch and difficulty,ppl attendance etc. We were raiding 3-4 days a week. But we always cleared all on hc mostly with last boss before next patch.
    Anyway how are operations in swtor? If u compare them with difficulty of wow raids? In which of 3 modes (n,hm,nm) i would fit there?
    Cheers!

  2. #2
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    I understand what you are doing here, but there are other threads where you could have possibly put this, and the thread definitely needs to be renamed.

    To answer your question, the newest raids of nightmare mode are fairly challenging I hear and you would enjoy their difficulty.

  3. #3
    The raids or ops in SWTOR are a different beast in several ways. No macro's, mouse overs, add ons and a few keybinding changes are some of the easiest to notice. Targeting is different in SWTOR also as well as the types of mobs and how you worry about threat, mixed in with a much different guard and taunt mechanic. The difficulty lvls are like Wraths version of 10/25 with a LFR version being story mode. From my own experiences in some ways ops are much easier with different challenges then I faced in raids. Luckily on pretty much any server you should be able to jump in and get going in ops and gear up somewhat quickly so you can see first hand.
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  4. #4
    Being in a top world guild in SWTOR (though there really aren't many 16mans...), I can say that TOR raiding is 100% different. I am currently 14/16 25man Heroic in WoW with a 12 hour/week raiding schedule... in SWTOR we were 3/4 Nightmare 16 for months.

    As someone stated, the lack of (nonexistent) addons and the ability to not macro abilities make it much more difficult. In WoW, we have the ability to watch and call out when certain things are going to hit. In SWTOR, you develop a sense of when stuff will happen. Also, with lack of people progressing through content- there are no strategies readily available. Being a top SWTOR guild, we have to literally go in blind and develop our own strats in order to down content. In WoW, we have dozens of guilds clearing things within the first couple weeks so getting that heads up is pretty easy.

    Again, its a whole different beast. Aggro is weird. Taunting is weird. 16man vs 8man is really weird, as 8man is extremely undertuned in comparison. SWTOR is just different. Try it out yourself.

  5. #5
    Grunt BlueBolt's Avatar
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    Here's a detailed answer:

    Tier 1: EV/KP is a joke, experienced raiders only had problems with the bugs (the last EV boss kept going invisible and unforgettable).

    Tier 2: EV/TFB

    HM EC was the first non-faceroll Operation in the game. That being said it was cleared fairly fast by anyone who had done WotLK or Cata Heroics so clearly it wasn't on par.

    HM TFB was slightly harder (3rd and 5th boss mostly, boss 1-2 are faceroll) but everyone who did Heroic LK, Rag and stuff like that agreed it was still relatively easy.

    NiM EC 8 man is fun - getting the Warstalker title is the first time I've been challenged in game (<2hr timed run). I've been told that SWTOR Operations are shorter than WoW Raids by a decent amount so at least there's that.

    The big issue right now is that 8 man Nightmare is undertuned and 16 man is tuned just right. 16 Man NiM EC Kephess was apparently as hard as some of the tougher WoW bosses. Took over a month to kill. Still, hopefully they correct this in the future.

  6. #6
    Most things have been said already, but I would like to add that the third/fourth boss in every operation there is a puzzle boss. That makes the fight a bit different than your usual WoW bossfights. For example tier 1 operation: Kaggara's Palace has a boss encounter where you will need 1 or 2 ops member(s) to do the "Tower of Hanoi" puzzle. The puzzles themselves aren't that difficult at all, it's part of the boss encounter. Solving the puzzles is the key to down the boss/encounter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Forsedar View Post
    Being in a top world guild in SWTOR (though there really aren't many 16mans...), I can say that TOR raiding is 100% different. I am currently 14/16 25man Heroic in WoW with a 12 hour/week raiding schedule... in SWTOR we were 3/4 Nightmare 16 for months.

    As someone stated, the lack of (nonexistent) addons and the ability to not macro abilities make it much more difficult. In WoW, we have the ability to watch and call out when certain things are going to hit. In SWTOR, you develop a sense of when stuff will happen. Also, with lack of people progressing through content- there are no strategies readily available. Being a top SWTOR guild, we have to literally go in blind and develop our own strats in order to down content. In WoW, we have dozens of guilds clearing things within the first couple weeks so getting that heads up is pretty easy.

    Again, its a whole different beast. Aggro is weird. Taunting is weird. 16man vs 8man is really weird, as 8man is extremely undertuned in comparison. SWTOR is just different. Try it out yourself.
    Sorry if it's off-topic, but I felt I wanted to give my opinion about the lack of addons and macros in SWTOR. I hope it stays that way. In WoW you are looking at timer bars or the raid leader tells you on TS/Vent/Mumble/Skype/etc. when certain stuff is going to happen in a few seconds. I have raided in such an environment for many years and I have seen how it has made ppl very dull/less sharp. Over time ppl are depending on it too much and don't watch what's under their feet or don't have a sense of incoming danger that might happen or just stand on the same spot and doing nothing else then healing/dps.

    And about strategies, that is how it should go in my opinion. Developing your own strats and not using a top/another guild's strategy that they have tested out during the beta/live and just adjust a bit depending on your raid composition. And again I raided in such a manner for many years.
    Last edited by DarkEmperor; 2013-01-14 at 02:48 AM.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkEmperor View Post
    Sorry if it's off-topic, but I felt I wanted to give my opinion about the lack of addons and macros in SWTOR. I hope it stays that way. In WoW you are looking at timer bars or the raid leader tells you on TS/Vent/Mumble/Skype/etc. when certain stuff is going to happen in a few seconds. I have raided in such an environment for many years and I have seen how it has made ppl very dull/less sharp. Over time ppl are depending on it too much and don't watch what's under their feet or don't have a sense of incoming danger that might happen or just stand on the same spot and doing nothing else then healing/dps.

    And about strategies, that is how it should go in my opinion. Developing your own strats and not using a top/another guild's strategy that they have tested out during the beta/live and just adjust a bit depending on your raid composition. And again I raided in such a manner for many years.
    Everyone who was raiding in EQ2 until (I believe TSO) knows what you are talking about. No big fat on-screen message to move your butt in 10 etc., you had to watch your debuff window/ animation. That's a part I enjoy in TOR. As for addons... it just ends up being nothing more than, the more addons you use, the "harder" the encounters are being designed. It doesn't really make them harder, it just makes them harder opposed to other games where you don't have all the tools to make them beatable.

    As for strategies, it gave me a chuckle to read your part as I remember back in the days, people would be "harrased" for giving out strats, not to speak of youtube links with instructions. That was one of the "mysteries" kept in your guild which is completely missing nowadays. Surprisingly there are still a lot of people which can't follow these instructions.

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