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  1. #241
    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    Yet they say nothing, the lack of beta experiences beyond Skeleton King forces us to assume Blizzard knew how to balance drop rates, crafting results compared to drops and stats in general, not to mention skills. I'm not talking about a huge open beta here either, a few thousand players would have been more than enough to highlight the issues and provide a balanced information about the game, in retrospect I can see why it wasn't in Blizzard's interest to provide that though.


    From what you are saying it seems like Blizzard weren't acting in good faith.
    Forums tend to vilify companies more than necessary.

    If you feel you have been misled into buying something you didn't want by all means present your case to them and ask for a refund. Then take that money and use it for some Kickstarter or indie.

    As far as I'm concerned you I think they are pretty transparent with their products, you just have to learn to sift through the corporate lingo.

  2. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by Diocassius View Post
    From what you are saying it seems like Blizzard weren't acting in good faith.
    Forums tend to vilify companies more than necessary.
    Does it matter if there where or not? The failed to accurately describe the product nor live up to reasonable expectations regarding loot system and balance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diocassius View Post
    As far as I'm concerned you I think they are pretty transparent with their products, you just have to learn to sift through the corporate lingo.
    They are if you look at WoW and it's expansions for example, this come from good information provided by Blizzard them selfs and beta players combined, this tells us that they know how to get the information across and how to test a product, yet they did neither well for D3, what conclusions you draw from that it up to the individual, it does however not change the fact how limited the information and testing was though.
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  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    Does it matter if there where or not? The failed to accurately describe the product nor live up to reasonable expectations regarding loot system and balance.
    Can you provide anything to back this up? What didn't they live up too?


    Where did you get those "expectations"? Why were you expecting what you expected?

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    Can you provide anything to back this up? What didn't they live up too?


    Where did you get those "expectations"? Why were you expecting what you expected?
    Diablo 2

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  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    Diablo 2

    /10char

    .... and you want to blame blizzard because you decided you thought it was going to be just like D2?

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    .... and you want to blame blizzard because you decided you thought it was going to be just like D2?
    Who said just like? One could expect them to be able to make a satisfying ARPG with a similarly rewarding loot system, considering they pioneered the genre and had a decade of experience to draw from, at least when they didn't say otherwise or showed you enough in beta to tell you otherwise through experience.
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  7. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    Who said just like? One could expect them to be able to make a satisfying ARPG with a similarly rewarding loot system, considering they pioneered the genre and had a decade of experience to draw from, at least when they didn't say otherwise or showed you enough in beta to tell you otherwise through experience.
    Unfortunately, most of the current D3 team had little to nothing to do with the genre or the prequels of D3. Those of us who had been waiting for this game for years were very skeptical about a new team with a new idea. Personally, I expected D3 to be a flop once I found out their beta was going to take 6 months to test 1/3 of 1/4 acts. They made it obvious in the months leading up to release that they had no idea what they were doing. Where I give Blizzard credit is actively attempting to salvage this game. Whether or not they are motivated by RMAH profits matters less than us hopefully getting the game we really wanted, eventually.
    Last edited by Lysah; 2013-01-17 at 06:02 PM.
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  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    Unfortunately, most of the current D3 team had little to nothing to do with the genre or the prequels of D3.
    As a customer that doesn't concern me much though, if they didn't document their development enough to create an experience good enough to follow the prequel then perhaps they should have said so or called it something else than Diablo 3, just sayin'.
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  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by Alyssa View Post
    As a customer that doesn't concern me much though, if they didn't document their development enough to create an experience good enough to follow the prequel then perhaps they should have said so or called it something else than Diablo 3, just sayin'.
    I agree, completely. What pissed me off most about this game was the overall secrecy of the development process. The game ended up being pushed back over a year from its original target release date for no strong reason. And, during all of that extra time for "fine tuning," they gave us relatively zero insight into the game itself. A beta that was more of a teaser than a test and little to zero Blue comments outside of Bashiok arguing with users now and then.

    They used their prestige and the Diablo name itself to make a fortune, whether or not the game was good never mattered. It is up to us, as customers, to decide if this is "too far" or if Blizzard can repair the situation with content updates. Of course, 1.07 is not that promising, but they are still slowly copying D2 and turning the game into what it should have been originally, so there is hope. We do have forever to wait with an unsubbed game.
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  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by Lysah View Post
    We do have forever to wait with an unsubbed game.
    This is the only upside, one that I think will be negated with an eventual expansion.
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  11. #251
    I'm still waiting for organized arena PvP to be the selling point of D3x1, when they flat out promised it would be delivered to us via a free patch.
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  12. #252
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    This game is totally lost. No patch can save it.

  13. #253
    I read some discussion in this thread about playtesting d3 beyond skeleton king. Its a dirty little industry secret that blizzard in fact never playtested d2 endgame before release. They never playtested endgame in any of their games. Actually, im pretty sure no video game company does. They playtest the early game because that is most important to sales. If people have a positive experience early on, they will immediately spread positive word of mouth in the first few days.

    Blizzard is special in that they actually bother to continue to earnestly polish a game after release. A lot of game companies just dont care.

    They still supported d2 for years after the last xpac with patches and they even migrated to new servers in 2012. (altho useast is horribly buggy now with ftj failed to join and most play on uswest). Its pretty amazing they continue to support it 11 years later.

    Its awful they seemed to have no expertise on board to show them why d2 was so successful, as clearly evidenced by d3. Blizz may get d3 right, but probably not for 4-5 years if ever. And the biggest problem is the lack of a community which they refuse to recognize as a problem by limiting communication with no chatrooms, limited global channels, no clan support, and no ability to name custom games.

    D3 is in beta. Nufced.
    Last edited by Grummgug; 2013-01-17 at 06:51 PM.

  14. #254
    I don't understand much the complain about the loot system difference between now and then. That's genuine curiosity. I may be a lil bit unlucky in general with drops but I never ever ever ever never ever dropped anything much meaningful in D2 even though I played it for at least two years. That may be the reason why I'm unable to understand the issue

    Is it a problem with the rate of drops themselves or with the stat system?
    Last edited by Brazorf; 2013-01-17 at 07:24 PM.

  15. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brazorf View Post
    I don't understand much the complain about the loot system difference between now and then. That's genuine curiosity. I may be a lil bit unlucky in general with drops but I never ever ever ever never ever dropped anything much meaningful in D2 even though I played it for at least two years. That may be the reason why I'm unable to understand the issue

    Is it a problem with the rate of drops themselves or with the stat system?
    The g'dam STATS It's horrible alright like when I play for 12 hours a g-dam day I expect to get decent drops okay alright instead I get this here a typical normal run


    3 legendaries all CRAP brimstoned cool
    30 yellows ALL Vendored
    9 hours later
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    RE-F'ING PEAT
    1 month later
    Oh 1 good yellow SWEEEEEEEEEEEEET
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat

    BAD ITEMS ARE BAD Like ~breaks monitor

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by -Apathy- View Post
    The g'dam STATS It's horrible alright like when I play for 12 hours a g-dam day I expect to get decent drops okay alright instead I get this here a typical normal run


    3 legendaries all CRAP brimstoned cool
    30 yellows ALL Vendored
    9 hours later
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    RE-F'ING PEAT
    1 month later
    Oh 1 good yellow SWEEEEEEEEEEEEET
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat
    Repeat

    BAD ITEMS ARE BAD Like ~breaks monitor
    ahahah ok point taken
    yeah I do agree that there should be a lower roof on rolled stats the more high the item level goes up

    FUrther EDIT: had a look at Arreat summit for items, have a more clear idea of the problems now. My memory suck.
    Last edited by Brazorf; 2013-01-17 at 07:37 PM.

  17. #257
    D2 also offered many different paths to gear up. You could run hell baal. do hellforge rushes to get runes and make runewords. run around in hell lower kurast and pop chests (pretty much a guarantee you will get at least a quality charm or rune every run). Or hunt dclone. Or run countess for runes. Or run uber tristram. Or craft.

    There was a lot of variety. If you got bored with one, switch to another. D3 has alkaizer runs and more alkaizer runs.

  18. #258
    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    .... and you want to blame blizzard because you decided you thought it was going to be just like D2?
    Many who are disappointed with the game expected them to live up to what they showed in the couple years before launch, going back to the some of the earliest videos showing off the game. Using skills to get past obstacles, special kill animations by bosses, enhancements for items, charms, the entire Mystic artisan (which, by the way, would have allowed players to work on improving stats on their gear at the potential cost of great personal wealth, if what the old interviews suggest is any indication). Everything streamlined until you have little more than a loot chase of farming the same map over and over that is further neutered by easy access to items with the exact stats you want.

    They didn't live up to the vision they gave for their own version of the game, much less it being a successor to D2.

  19. #259
    Quote Originally Posted by Grummgug View Post
    D2 also offered many different paths to gear up. You could run hell baal. do hellforge rushes to get runes and make runewords. run around in hell lower kurast and pop chests (pretty much a guarantee you will get at least a quality charm or rune every run). Or hunt dclone. Or run countess for runes. Or run uber tristram. Or craft.

    There was a lot of variety. If you got bored with one, switch to another. D3 has alkaizer runs and more alkaizer runs.
    Dunno all I remember were baal run, baal run, baal run. Never found any game that was different from that, so for me not much has changed in that sense

  20. #260
    The fact is that legendaries were really strong and the base stats weren't so meaningful as they are now.

    A lvl 30 legendary in D2 could have been useful for a lot of time, until you found a yellow or another legendary; also you could have used pretty much any iem and it would have been some kind of upgrade depending on the affixes/suffixes (anyway, everyone seems o have forgotten that all players were aiming to the 85% reduction for melee and the +12 or +16 o all abilities for casters, which was the real endgear). Also, there was no AH so items weren't traded as much as now, since there was literally no way to make it covered from risks.


    In D3 we have the stat system. When you drop an item, if i hasn't the stat for you, it's useless. I mean not even an alt would use it since while you level you can get thousands of bad items. Also AH has made for everyon SUPEREASY to gear up (let's avoid the inflation of prices etc) so everyone who has played at least 50 hours can easily farm MP1 or more, depending on luck and money spent.
    Then people complain that they cannot farm upgrades since BLOODY HELL YOU HAVE BOUGH END GEAR FROM AH WHAT DO YOU PLAN TO FARM (sorry for rant).

    I'm not saying that the D3 system is good, D2 itemization was vastly superior in a lot of points. D2 has made history, and unfortu nately D3 cannot keep the pace. Anyway, it's all about pesonal tastes, i'm still having fun with it - i don't expect the greates changes, but only QoL improvements and someadditions just to keep the game new.

    They have already made the money out from D3.
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