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  1. #41
    Herald of the Titans Adramalech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mosotti View Post
    And in the end, a pretty obvious thing: if world PvP was any fun at all, there would be lots and lots and lots of world PvP everywhere. But it's not (except for the dickless gankers)
    In this end, this is what it comes down to, not just for WPvP, but for anything in the game. If it is being left behind no matter how much they change things up, then chances are that it's not happening simply because it's not fun, or else people would be flocking to it as much as they do to other features.

    Quote Originally Posted by Henako View Post
    It's not the same thing at all. Organic PvP out in the world is just so much more fun. World PvP is fun because it isn't structured.
    But if it is that fun, why do the majority of people avoid it? That's the thing here. People want the removal or restriction of something that has been in the game since freaking TBC, and that the majority wants to be left alone. Chances are it isn't as fun as you paint it, and chances are you (not specifically you, but other people who want flying changed/removed) just want to one-shot lowbies, not have any kind of serious PvP. The Dark Portal after CRZ and Stranglethorn back in Classic are perfect examples of this.
    Last edited by Adramalech; 2013-01-14 at 11:47 AM.
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  2. #42
    Elemental Lord Granyala's Avatar
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    I have one god damn suggestion - restrict your ideas to PvP / RPPvP realms. Leave us PvErs alone ffs.
    This. You can do whatever you with on your god awful "lolz me can gank" servers, but leave the rest of us out of it.

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  3. #43
    World pvp is the best pvp. Going out looking for a fight is fun, not something I do in rl so I enjoy to do it in game. Also on my other character who's in a pve realm, everytime I log in there are alliance raiding Orgrimmar.

  4. #44
    No, flying mounts are fine and won't change.

    There are already places in the game where you can't use flying mounts. In MoP you go from 85 - 90 without them and in 5.2 the new islands will be no fly zones.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    Ok so at the moment its much too easy to escape from world pvp by simply flying away. that really sucks. there need to be some restrictions in place to stop people abusing that kind of behavior, to get the war back into warcraft!
    But WoW isn't PvP game. If such changes are to be made - they are only to be made on PvP servers.

    I don't see why such kind of treads must pop up all the time. If you dislike flying mounts - don't use them, but WoW's topology is built around having fly mounts in many areas. Sure it won't bring you people "to PvP" with, but as I wrote above - WoW is formerly PvE game.

    Btw, I heard PvP blooms on PvP servers now, with all that CRZ stuff, which basically goes around nuking lowbies and camping their corpses. If you want non-consensual PvP so much, camp harder and don't miss the moment when lowbie will use his fly mount to fly away. But non-consensual PvP is plain wrong and won't work in the world, where many specs aren't really viable for open grief (synonym for "world PvP"), especially if they wear PvE gear.

  6. #46
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    Ok so at the moment its much too easy to escape from world pvp by simply flying away. that really sucks. there need to be some restrictions in place to stop people abusing that kind of behavior, to get the war back into warcraft!

    I've seen alot of suggestions ranging from flight taxing to complete removal. I really dont think either of those are options, taxing money will just kick poor players in the nads and complete removal will make a large amount of work blizzard has done redundant.

    I have 2 Suggestions,
    Suggestion 1: make it so that you can only mount your flying mount at a flight master (available in every town), or dungeon stone
    this would do alot of things:- one thing it'd do is make it so that players in the world cant run away too easily, it would also give players a reason to protect small towns.
    Of course this would make it really annoying if you got stuck down a well and couldnt get out, so perhaps you could also get a player skill with a long CD that would call your mount to you so that you could fly off from anywhere, but only once every 10 mins or so.

    Suggestion 2: raise the cast time of using your flying mount to 5 seconds +.
    This would stop players from running off in a hurry but still give the freedom of flight.

    For some reason i think that suggestion 2 would feel alot more annoying than the first suggestion, even though it'd give alot more freedom.
    tell me what you think? if you dont like the idea, explain why
    What you truly need to do is quit trying to FUCK reasonable people over, if you want a game without flying go make one. Seriously. Or, you should campaign to have the ruleset for PVP servers changed.


    What I THINK is that you should be honest, you dont want to put the 'war' back in warcraft.. you want to change it into a gankfest.. isn't that the truth.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-14 at 05:53 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ishayu View Post
    Can't believe nobody has mentioned the fact that you can't be knocked out of the sky with an attack yet.

    How about doing something about that? Being CC'd on a flying mount now causes you to dismount instead of getting the immune message.
    Actually, you CAN be knocked out of the sky... just have to know HOW.

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  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    Ok so at the moment its much too easy to escape from world pvp by simply flying away. that really sucks. there need to be some restrictions in place to stop people abusing that kind of behavior, to get the war back into warcraft!
    There's already war in warcraft. Each week we war against mogu, mantid, and soon zandalari. Why you think that only your bloodthirsty murderous obsession with killing decent people is only "real war" is beyond me.

  8. #48
    And then you remembered pvp servers are far from being the majority.

  9. #49
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flalia4 View Post
    I don't understand why these people who want to WPVP so much can't just go queue for a BG what is the honest difference. They're still going to be able to kill people with bad gear who don't know there class and feel l33t?
    because WPVP to them is one shotting folks 30 or more levels lower than they are. they dont WANT to fight folks their own level.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-14 at 06:04 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Jawless Jones View Post
    good idea!

    also lets make it so lowbies have to quest near enemy faction cities because the porr lvl 90s have go so far away to gank

    also lets make it so ground mounts are restricted so if an enemy player is targeting you your speed is decreased by 90% so it easier to gank people

    and lets give conquest points to people who kill lowbies!

    yeah! that'll put the war in warcraft!

    feel free to add to something ive said
    I have one I'd add... lifetime perma-ban for killing someone that is grey to you.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-14 at 06:05 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by The Fiend View Post
    World PvP was dead in vanilla as soon as battlegrounds came out.


    Anyone pining for said World PvP is just wanting to kill people in an unfair advantage.
    You are absolutely right.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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  10. #50
    Leave flying mounts alone. They are good as they are and no restrictions are needed.

    I am on PvE server, I couldn't care less about PvP even if I would really like to and I do not want some PvP gankers' dreams to spoil my fun!

    You want to PvP than use all the possibilities this game gives you - arenas, BGs, RBGs, city raids, whatever - just leave mounts alone!

  11. #51
    After all these years you still don't understand. Your precious so called world PvP is nothing more than ganking and removing flying mounts would not fix it. I mean seriously, how often do u see two willing raid groups fighting? They could add bases that ur faction need to capture but they would always be controlled by the high pop faction and everyone would get mad. BGs gogo gg XD:PPppPPppPP

  12. #52
    The Lightbringer Grym's Avatar
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    Idea 1) won't work. You will get WAY too much QQ from people farming nodes, camping rares, and other things that doesn't have a flight master nearby, then they are screwed, Blizzard will rather screw your wPvP fun than screw millions for convenience. Have you thought about this before you even have this idea?

    Idea 2) won't work. Blizzard even introduce buff at the new dailies to make mount cast near instant, they KNOW people wanna do things as fast as possible, the mount speed used to be 2sec but reduced to 1.5, not likely they reverse it with a 5sec cast time.

    And both of your idea sucks, as much as people like to bash Blizzard for their design, I am glad you are not in the dev team.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    Ok so at the moment its much too easy to escape from world pvp by simply flying away. that really sucks. there need to be some restrictions in place to stop people abusing that kind of behavior, to get the war back into warcraft!

    I've seen alot of suggestions ranging from flight taxing to complete removal. I really dont think either of those are options, taxing money will just kick poor players in the nads and complete removal will make a large amount of work blizzard has done redundant.

    I have 2 Suggestions,
    Suggestion 1: make it so that you can only mount your flying mount at a flight master (available in every town), or dungeon stone
    this would do alot of things:- one thing it'd do is make it so that players in the world cant run away too easily, it would also give players a reason to protect small towns.
    Of course this would make it really annoying if you got stuck down a well and couldnt get out, so perhaps you could also get a player skill with a long CD that would call your mount to you so that you could fly off from anywhere, but only once every 10 mins or so.

    Suggestion 2: raise the cast time of using your flying mount to 5 seconds +.
    This would stop players from running off in a hurry but still give the freedom of flight.

    For some reason i think that suggestion 2 would feel alot more annoying than the first suggestion, even though it'd give alot more freedom.
    tell me what you think? if you dont like the idea, explain why
    You're wrong on so many levels I'm not sure where to start so I'll say this.

    WPVP will happen when players want it to happen. It will not happen by some developer plan or restricting flying mounts. Example: Tarran Mills and Southshore - Those battles happened cause players wanted it to happen. Players made it happen and players made it fun. IT was not designed to happen and maybe you were not around to see it but players made it happen.

    Now, since there is currently little to no WPVP in existence, it means the players (at least the majority of them) do not want WPVP to happen and care so little about WPVP they avoid it. You should learn to live with that cause WPVP cannot be forced by some design or restriction.

    However, if all your wanting to do is gank lowbies then I'm with the guy banning you killing any player that is grey to you. (maybe not permanently but a month per kill)

  14. #54
    I think heightening cast times makes sense, and have flying mounts fly from the clouds would be logical, or ground mounts running from a hidden spot... it would be a cool idea.

  15. #55
    Dreadlord MouseD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishayu View Post
    Can't believe nobody has mentioned the fact that you can't be knocked out of the sky with an attack yet.

    How about doing something about that? Being CC'd on a flying mount now causes you to dismount instead of getting the immune message.
    At one time we could knock someone off a flying mount in the air....but all you cry babies wanted it taken out and it was removed.....all though there was a new item put in game with MoP that can knock you off your mount...its still not as good as it use to be.

  16. #56
    If someone mounts on a flying mount to escape pvp with you that means they don't wish to engage in pvp play with you. If you don't understand this or feel you need to force ppl to pvp with you, well you have some issues. There are plenty of ppl in bgs who like pvp play in a matched balanced manner. World pvp on wow is really non existent. Accept it.

  17. #57
    You can have your flying mounts removed but only if you make faction change and server transfer fee free. Try ganking on your server now punk.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Shennanigans View Post
    If someone mounts on a flying mount to escape pvp with you that means they don't wish to engage in pvp play with you. If you don't understand this or feel you need to force ppl to pvp with you, well you have some issues. There are plenty of ppl in bgs who like pvp play in a matched balanced manner. World pvp on wow is really non existent. Accept it.
    if you are on a pve realm and you are flagged, then you had already engaged in pvp and deserve tp get attacked, if you are on a pvp realm, you already decided that you want to engage in pvp when you chose the realm. So i disagree. The only time i would say that its fair is when you get out of a battle ground and you were in the middle of farming mats, then someone tries to gank you. but i think that the pvp flag from bgs should be removed when you leave the bg. if you hate world pvp, dont roll a pvp realm and dont attack flagged characters. i think those are good rules. otherwise its i want to kill you but i dont want your over geared friend to kill me!
    Last edited by kukulcan13; 2013-01-16 at 01:22 PM. Reason: repeating

  19. #59
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Flying Mounts Feedback
    We pretty firmly believe the questing experience is just wholly better when you can't lift off and set down wherever you like, frog leaping from quest objective to quest objective. Certainly we've supported that with no flying for the leveling content of Wrath and Mists, and only after you hit level cap can you obtain the ability to fly. The new zone coming in 5.2 is not unlike the Isle of Quel'Danas in a few ways, and one of them is that there's no flying. That helps us achieve that desire for progressive questing, it's good for supporting world PvP, as well as lets us make really difficult outdoor encounters, like Oondasta - who is OG Kazzak in difficulty - that you can't just drop on top of from the sky.

    I can't imagine flying mounts ever going away, they're a big part of the game at this point, but certainly they can take a break when it makes sense and we can present content in a more intimate way from time to time. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)


    That is from the blues, within the recent past...

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...587?page=8#142

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  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    You're wrong on so many levels I'm not sure where to start so I'll say this.

    WPVP will happen when players want it to happen. It will not happen by some developer plan or restricting flying mounts. Example: Tarran Mills and Southshore - Those battles happened cause players wanted it to happen. Players made it happen and players made it fun. IT was not designed to happen and maybe you were not around to see it but players made it happen.

    Now, since there is currently little to no WPVP in existence, it means the players (at least the majority of them) do not want WPVP to happen and care so little about WPVP they avoid it. You should learn to live with that cause WPVP cannot be forced by some design or restriction.

    However, if all your wanting to do is gank lowbies then I'm with the guy banning you killing any player that is grey to you. (maybe not permanently but a month per kill)
    they wouldnt have started from nothing. it would have evolved from leveling players getting attacked, counter attacking and having everything escalating from there. those battles evolved from people getting attacked when they might not have wanted to be, it wasn't just decided in a civil discussion from two opposing players with polite ground rules.

    nobody wants to die. but when they do they want revenge, then they get it and their enemy wants revenge, then the cycle starts and things get fun!

    there is no reason world pvp cant happen again, its just that there is very little incentive. you generally dont see opposing faction enemies walking around or you wont be in their presence for very long so it wont matter. flying mounts reduce contact. your not likely to want to kill someone you didnt see. shared questing areas (like southshore and tarren mill had) creates friction, which ignites into combat, which is what a pvp server is about.

    and that IS a design decision. more recent zones didnt create much friction, and flying mounts made contact even more scarce, you cant create any friction when things dont come into contact!

    so what i want to see is max level pvp become more prominent. I'm not complaining that its hard to gank, if i was one of those pricks i'd harass a starter town where people cant fly and flying mounts wouldn't even be a factor. i personally think that killing low level characters should be discouraged by an in game mechanic (such as making them unattackable, invisible or something of the like)

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-17 at 03:02 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Grym View Post
    Idea 1) won't work. You will get WAY too much QQ from people farming nodes, camping rares, and other things that doesn't have a flight master nearby, then they are screwed, Blizzard will rather screw your wPvP fun than screw millions for convenience. Have you thought about this before you even have this idea?

    Idea 2) won't work. Blizzard even introduce buff at the new dailies to make mount cast near instant, they KNOW people wanna do things as fast as possible, the mount speed used to be 2sec but reduced to 1.5, not likely they reverse it with a 5sec cast time.

    And both of your idea sucks, as much as people like to bash Blizzard for their design, I am glad you are not in the dev team.
    idea 1- thats true. i thought farming nodes on ground mounts might be a bit more interesting with more node spawns to balance it out but it would be too much of a change and the net result wouldn't gain much. in my opinion flying from node to node really isnt engaging, and i'd like to see more ground mount useage. thats a personal opinion though, i'm not trying to force it on anyone!

    idea 2- i had another idea recently: your mount up time stays the same, unless you have been attacked by a player equal to or lower level than you, then it increases to 5 sec for 30 seconds, similar to the new healing debuff mechanic. this would leave pretty much everything the same, unless someone attacks you (which if your on a pvp server is meant to happen, or on a pve server you are flagged and attacked someone recently). you would still be able to farm nodes at the same rate, it would just make it so that fights are more likely to break out.

    I'm not bashing blizzard for their design, they made all the right decisions, its just that they all have had unforeseen side affects. flying mount was a good idea, but its easy to use as a get out of jail free card.

    And if i was on the dev team, i'd get other peoples opinions before making any dramatic changes.
    I never said my ideas were flawless, i just asked for opinions and feedback on my ideas.

    your feedback is appreciated, even if its rude, its a bit one sided having an arguement by myself and other peoples perspectives are always refreshing!

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