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  1. #61
    Mechagnome
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santti View Post
    I'm not sure if compulsory voting would make anything better. I'm a living example why it could be bad. I have no clue who or what to vote at all, which is why I leave voting to others who hopefully know better than I do. Appearance would be my only clue who to vote for.

    I'm Finnish and not American, but I'm sure there are lots of Americans that think like I do.
    You would have the option to not actually vote for anyone if you didn't know who to vote for. Compulsory voting only means you have to drag your butt down (or send a mail) and is therefor forced to make a conscious decision to vote or not. This way everyone that actually have an opinion will vote (They might as well now they are forced down there) and those that are clueless would just vote blank.

    It will in the end give a better picture of what the entire country wants, and not only the views of those die hard political active, that wouldn't mind standing in ques for 5 hours.

  2. #62
    Sorry if it's already been pointed out, but because of the electoral college, this wouldn't make a difference in the US. Blue states would still elect blue(er) candidates, and red states would still elect reds. I think it would influence the popular election (overwhelmingly left, I'd assume, since voter turn-out in the evangelical areas is already at 80% or so). But because of the electoral college, this idea is pointless.

  3. #63
    A forced democracy? You'd want that? I'm not sure Australians even want it. And I've never bought the attitude that "Well if you didn't vote you can't complain". Actually, we pay for these people , money talks, so yes we do damn well have the right to complain and criticize them.

    Find another way to cure voter apathy, if politics is even capable of doing so these days.

  4. #64
    Immortal Dezerte's Avatar
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    As long as people are allowed to vote blank or protest vote on the The rent is too damn high-party, I see no problem with it.
    To declare that a personal, inner experience gives certainty about the workings of the universe is to assign far too much value to one’s subjective sense of conviction.
    I’m not that arrogant.

    The brain, marvelous instrument though it is, isn’t infallible. It can misfire, seize or hallucinate, and it can do so in a way that’s utterly indistinguishable from reality to the person experiencing it.

  5. #65
    America's political woes stem from too many idiots voting, as compared to too few. If anything, we need to find less ways to create a tyrannical majority.

  6. #66
    Forced voting still wouldn't fix most things with the current problems we have with the system. We need more than 2 parties for one.

    So long as we are stuck voting for only 2 candidates each election and people refuse to vote otherwise cause of our First Past the Post system we would lose either way.

    So which do you choose? Jack Johnson or John Jackson? Doesn't change much.

    So.....
    1) We remove our current voting system and use actual weighted voting,
    2) We remove the electoral college and take it straight to the popular vote,
    3) We add a new option "None of the above" on the ballot and if it wins, we are forced to do a new election with all previous candidates barred from running,
    4) We remove campaign contributions from all Unions and Business and only allow it from individuals and capped at an amount that even the poor can afford,
    5) We change it so after doing even a portion of a single term as congressman, senator or president, they are barred and their spouse from all non-government work, holding stock, or taking donations from an outside entity forcing them to only be able to deal as a government worker from that point on as they already get 100% pay for life with full benefits for the position anyways.
    6) We change it so after an election, all campaign contributions and items bought with said contributions MUST be returned to its contributors and the official is not allowed to profit in anyway with said contributions.

    THEN we can do this and actually have a chance of it working.
    Last edited by Fugus; 2013-01-15 at 02:07 PM.

  7. #67
    I am Murloc! Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zhangfei View Post
    All my civil rights bones are screaming that people are suggesting certain groups (non high-school graduates) shouldn't vote or even worse, there should be a test.

    I don't support enforced voting but I firmly believe votes are eternally equal - what intelligent people may propose today is the idiotic, spastic failed idea of tomorrow etc. All citizens should be able to vote and be encouraged too as equals. A black chick in South Carolina is genuinely and literally worth the same as Donald Trump to me.
    Why should people are so stupid they cant even graduate from high school be allowed to vote on the future of the country? They obviously dont have the intelligence to even do simple math let alone decide who would be able to lead the country

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    Why should people are so stupid they cant even graduate from high school be allowed to vote on the future of the country? They obviously dont have the intelligence to even do simple math let alone decide who would be able to lead the country
    So, who gets to set the bar? Leave it to me and I'll set it at, "anyone that doesn't have sufficient drive and intellectual curiosity to get a Ph.D. just shouldn't be able to vote". Alternatively, we can recognize voting as a basic right in a democracy and let everyone vote, even people that we don't personally think much of.

  9. #69
    Immortal Dezerte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    Why should people are so stupid they cant even graduate from high school be allowed to vote on the future of the country? They obviously dont have the intelligence to even do simple math let alone decide who would be able to lead the country
    You're assuming these people aren't graduating high school because they are not intelligent. And that also begs the question, what intelligence are we talking about? IQ? There's no conclusive evidence that a human's intelligence can only be measured by just an IQ test, the contrary seems to be true. But until we're able to accurately measure the mental capacity of a person we should not try and discriminate people.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligence
    To declare that a personal, inner experience gives certainty about the workings of the universe is to assign far too much value to one’s subjective sense of conviction.
    I’m not that arrogant.

    The brain, marvelous instrument though it is, isn’t infallible. It can misfire, seize or hallucinate, and it can do so in a way that’s utterly indistinguishable from reality to the person experiencing it.

  10. #70
    Epic! schwank05's Avatar
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    IDk, I don't think it really matters I the end you don't have to vote for anyone on the ballot, you can write your dogs name in if you really want to. It all comes down the the Electoral College crap any way. Which they can say give 9 votes to Obama/ Romney and give one out of respect or whatever excuse they give to some guy that died that year or retired.

    And any way the President is just a Face, Congress is the real decision making body.
    Last edited by schwank05; 2013-01-15 at 03:18 PM.

  11. #71
    Scarab Lord Zhangfei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    Why should people are so stupid they cant even graduate from high school be allowed to vote on the future of the country? They obviously dont have the intelligence to even do simple math let alone decide who would be able to lead the country
    Because they are a citizen and contribute to the society that will directly affect them.

    Why do smart people think they always know best?
    In fact as far as I'm aware the UK is the only european nation that outright bans guns for civilians.
    Shotguns I'll give you (provided you're allowed 12 and larger gauges... because I mean... come on...) but not .22s.
    This is why people ban guns. Gun supporters don't know what guns are.

  12. #72
    I am Murloc! Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zhangfei View Post
    Because they are a citizen and contribute to the society that will directly affect them.

    Why do smart people think they always know best?
    Because they do. Thats the very definition of intelligence

  13. #73
    It would perhaps help a little bit, but then again, voters ARE uneducated, and to get a big-party nomination or any marketing you need the money, keeping high-end government offices to mostly the rich. Sometimes they tend to not have the best ideas one bit....

  14. #74
    Making everyone vote doesn't fix, or even address, the actual problem. I think Warren Buffet's idea of an amendment that blocks anyone currently in congress from being reelected if national debt is greater than 3% of GDP would go a long way to fix the US's system. It also doesn't really matter who gets elected as long as they listen to their constituents.

  15. #75
    High Overlord zipzy's Avatar
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    There was a story I saw that they wanted to make voting optional for us (Australian here) and they seemed to be making a big deal of it, personally I think it would be a great change.
    To many times I've talked to people at uni and they've just said things like "I feel really good, I voted greens this time!", asked them why that made them feel good (like any of their policies that they specifically liked) and they said "because they're good for the environment"... eh, they couldn't even say one thing specifically. It ends up with uninformed people voting for something purely because of the party name (or because their friends did, etc.)

  16. #76
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    The problem with this is a lot of people don't do research on the candidates. If people are forced to vote, there are going to be a LOT of people just picking someone at random because they don't know enough about the candidates to make an informed decision. Those who bother to vote know who they want to vote for without a doubt.
    Last edited by caninepawprints; 2013-01-16 at 03:06 AM.

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  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Zhangfei View Post
    All my civil rights bones are screaming that people are suggesting certain groups (non high-school graduates) shouldn't vote or even worse, there should be a test.

    I don't support enforced voting but I firmly believe votes are eternally equal - what intelligent people may propose today is the idiotic, spastic failed idea of tomorrow etc. All citizens should be able to vote and be encouraged too as equals. A black chick in South Carolina is genuinely and literally worth the same as Donald Trump to me.
    Donald Trump is a liability. At least a black chick in South Carolina is close to neutral.

    Honestly, though, people really SHOULD at least be informed before they're allowed to vote. Mitt Romney wanted to expand our Navy (Despite it already making up half of the world's aggregate naval power) as well as axe PBS, call the whole thing budget-neutral and he almost won the popular vote.

  18. #78
    Bloodsail Admiral Eliandal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaetha View Post
    Making everyone vote doesn't fix, or even address, the actual problem. I think Warren Buffet's idea of an amendment that blocks anyone currently in congress from being reelected if national debt is greater than 3% of GDP would go a long way to fix the US's system. It also doesn't really matter who gets elected as long as they listen to their constituents.
    While I like and admire Buffet - this idea is nutball! Since NO one would ever be able to stand for re-election, your congress/senate woukld become even more fractured than it is now. Comparing the current political climate, with the debt/GDP ratio - which currently stands anywhere from 73% to 103% depending on who's figuring - yeah - congress would never go for that

    Back on topic...I'd have no trouble at all with compulsory voting. It is after all, relatively simple to spoil a ballot if one chooses!

  19. #79
    Scarab Lord Zhangfei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    Because they do. Thats the very definition of intelligence
    No it isn't. There's no mutually agreed upon, satisfactory definition of "intelligence" and it doesn't inherently include wisdom.
    In fact as far as I'm aware the UK is the only european nation that outright bans guns for civilians.
    Shotguns I'll give you (provided you're allowed 12 and larger gauges... because I mean... come on...) but not .22s.
    This is why people ban guns. Gun supporters don't know what guns are.

  20. #80
    The one thing I feel that would change the voting system in this country would be to do away with the electoral college. With that in place many people feel as if their vote doesn't count and don't actually do it.
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy." -Alexander Tytler

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