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  1. #21
    Bloodsail Admiral Cryonic's Avatar
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    If they don't make the next expansion "cute and fluffy". More darkness, blood and less cuddly will do it for me.
    ..:: Lvl 90's: 50 ::..

  2. #22
    Immortal Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Because life is dark. And you also failed to read my post; I said WoW strives for a middle-ground, so by definition there will be "dark" things.

    But no, Warhammer lore I tend to like better. If only because Chaos is a far more terrifying enemy than the Burning Legion.
    So because it only strifes for "middleground", it can't be taken seriously? Characters like Johnny Awesome don't make the plot in WoW any less serious. Just because something's darker doesn't mean it's more serious. There are serious movies out there, who don't deal with any dark topics, yet they deal with serious issues.

    Everytime someone praises dark themes I have to think about this.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...ksXm6Zs#t=372s

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockwood View Post
    I think that Mop has done a better job of story telling than Cata so far. Each raid's story has
    transitioned better. Each patch gets ever more interesting. They even listened when players
    wanted more Belf involvement and a Uldar like raid. IMO I think more Horde vs Alliance story
    arcs will continue after Mop, I don't think Horde and Alliance can be friendly like in previous
    expansions.
    'Horde vs Alliance' -concept is what the game is based on; it won't be dissappearing.

  4. #24
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    So because it only strifes for "middleground", it can't be taken seriously? Characters like Johnny Awesome don't make the plot in WoW any less serious. Just because something's darker doesn't mean it's more serious. There are serious movies out there, who don't deal with any dark topics, yet they deal with serious issues.

    Everytime someone praises dark themes I have to think about this.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...ksXm6Zs#t=372s
    Unless it's a black comedy, being darker usually almost always means it is more serious.

    It is entirely feasible to say that if WoW's lore were darker, our achievements as characters would be more meaningful simply because of the odds arrayed against us.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    So because it only strifes for "middleground", it can't be taken seriously? Characters like Johnny Awesome don't make the plot in WoW any less serious. Just because something's darker doesn't mean it's more serious. There are serious movies out there, who don't deal with any dark topics, yet they deal with serious issues.

    Everytime someone praises dark themes I have to think about this.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...ksXm6Zs#t=372s
    The thing is WoW isn't quite serious no matter the darkness in it.

  6. #26
    Immortal Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Unless it's a black comedy, being darker usually almost always means it is more serious.

    It is entirely feasible to say that if WoW's lore were darker, our achievements as characters would be more meaningful simply because of the odds arrayed against us.
    The Mogu trap souls in stone constructs, and the manifestations of emotions like fear and anger, cruel old gods, that drive people insane and spread horror and a legion of demons who burn everything they come across feels pretty "dark" to me. Some things in the game, like the old gods, are inspired by Lovecraft, and I have never read something as weird and disturbing as his books.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-16 at 11:25 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kasami View Post
    The thing is WoW isn't quite serious no matter the darkness in it.
    It's not like someone tells knock-knock jokes. Again I have to ask, what do you mean by serious? Because it has fun elements? Or because it doesn't deal with serious topics? Like.. war. Holocausts. Death and destruction.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Kasami View Post
    'Horde vs Alliance' -concept is what the game is based on; it won't be dissappearing.
    BUt that's the thing, what are they going to do to keep red vs. blue tension up when they seem to be aiming to end MoP with a truce?

    I doubt Jaina is going to kill Aggra, even I'd like to see it happen as I've never liked Aggra's character. Jaina may have lost her diplomatic ways, but I believe her past experiences with Thrall will keep her somewhat in check around his new wife, it's Garrosh's Horde that she hates so much. I can't see that many things adding more tension between the factions after the Siege, unless the two factions clash there, although unlikely if pure n innocent Anduin + Thrall is in the same place. Can't get any more peaceloving than that. However, unless Lor'themar vs. Jaina ends in 5.2 I can see that stretching out into the next expansion.

    What, WoW as a game may not be very serious, but the story itself is.

  8. #28
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    The Mogu trap souls in stone constructs, and the manifestations of emotions like fear and anger, cruel old gods, that drive people insane and spread horror and a legion of demons who burn everything they come across feels pretty "dark" to me. Some things in the game, like the old gods, are inspired by Lovecraft, and I have never read something as weird and disturbing as his books.
    Come back when you actually bother reading my posts, please. I explained this already.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  9. #29
    Immortal Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Come back when you actually bother reading my posts, please. I explained this already.
    You're saying WoW isn't serious even though it deals with serious issues.

  10. #30
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    You're saying WoW isn't serious even though it deals with serious issues.
    I'm saying it's not serious because it plays a middle ground where the tongue-in-cheek and jokey crap often overshadows the more serious stuff.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  11. #31
    nobody needs to, really. war is not limited to alliance and horde war. they were in a sort of unstable peace until WotLK and nobody ever complained about it.

    we've had the war against nefarian and his dark horde, the war against ragnaros and his dark iron dwarves, the war against the gurubashi empire, the war of the shifting sands, the war against the scourge, the war against the burning legion, the war against the amani empire, the war against the illidari, the war against the twilight's hammer, the war against the black and twilight dragonflight, the war against the zandalari, the war against the mantid empire, now the war against the mogu empire, and you still think you need more war?

    warcraft has enough war in it's craft.
    Warlorcs of Draenorc made me quit. You can't have my stuff.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    It's not like someone tells knock-knock jokes. Again I have to ask, what do you mean by serious? Because it has fun elements? Or because it doesn't deal with serious topics? Like.. war. Holocausts. Death and destruction.
    Playing through quest dialogs and cinematics full of humour and cultural references to the point where it's feeling like a Tarantino movie hasn't yet made me impressed about WoW's seriousness. You actually pointed yourself what it's all about: going over the top, just to the other end of the spectrum.

  13. #33
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasami View Post
    Playing through quest dialogs and cinematics full of humour and cultural references to the point where it's feeling like a Tarantino movie hasn't yet made me impressed about WoW's seriousness. You actually pointed yourself what it's all about: going over the top, just to the other end of the spectrum.
    As I said, Chaos is a far more terrifying enemy than the Burning Legion
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  14. #34
    Immortal Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    I'm saying it's not serious because it plays a middle ground where the tongue-in-cheek and jokey crap often overshadows the more serious stuff.
    Where does the comedic stuff ever overshadow anything serious in this game? Did the Lich King fart rainbows after we killed him? Characters like Budd make the game even more realistic, because no matter how serious the plot is, you always have wackos like that.

  15. #35
    Glorious MMO-C, not even a full page before a thread gets derailed. OP didn't ask if WoW is serious or not, and it adds nothing to the topic.

    Rockwood, you still there? I enjoyed your speculations in previous threads, don't disappear!

  16. #36
    The Insane Didactic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Where does the comedic stuff ever overshadow anything serious in this game? Did the Lich King fart rainbows after we killed him? Characters like Budd make the game even more realistic, because no matter how serious the plot is, you always have wackos like that.
    The fact half the quests revolve around doing pointless and stupid shit for one thing.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Badhairday View Post
    Glorious MMO-C, not even a full page before a thread gets derailed. OP didn't ask if WoW is serious or not, and it adds nothing to the topic.

    Rockwood, you still there? I enjoyed your speculations in previous threads, don't disappear!
    I was kicking Alliance ass in Queldanas while supposedly being a part of some all-buddies coalition. Blizzard really never has needed to push the conflict, as has been pointed out in "derail-posts". People still enjoy battling between their toons even with a half-arsed lore.
    Last edited by Kasami; 2013-01-16 at 10:50 AM.

  18. #38
    Immortal Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasami View Post
    Playing through quest dialogs and cinematics full of humour and cultural references to the point where it's feeling like a Tarantino movie hasn't yet made me impressed about WoW's seriousness. You actually pointed yourself what it's all about: going over the top, just to the other end of the spectrum.
    I'm aware there's fun stuff in quests and dialog. But only where it fits. You can have a dragon like Deathwing fly over Badlands and have 3 characters tell a funny story without ruining the moment of Deathwing's death. The dragon aspects weren't standing around joking when Deathwing attacked Wyrmresdt temple. It was still a serious moment. Comedy is as much a part of life as death and tragedy. A fantsy universe totally devoid of that wouldn't feel realistic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    The fact half the quests revolve around doing pointless and stupid shit for one thing.
    No.

  19. #39
    The burning legion in a 2 expansion storyline. Part 1 (90-95) Azeroth and major cities pretty much get nuked and suffer major loses. Pt2 Horde/Alliance travel to where ever the Burning legion are camped and the funtimes begin...
    Many that live deserve death. Some that die deserve life.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Kasami View Post
    I was kicking Alliance ass in Queldanas while supposedly being a part of some all-buddies coalition. Blizzard really never has needed to push the conflict, as has been pointed out in "derail-posts". People still enjoy battling between their toons even with a half-arsed lore.
    Lorewise, you were not. In the story you were cooperating for pretty much the first time in TBC. They do need to push the conflict, otherwise what about BGs? They need a reason behind the battlegrounds. If you're somewhat allied you won't be competing for new land or anything of the sort. Your posts about the seriousness of WoW has nothing to do with this.

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