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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSageCorban View Post
    Can anyone find the exact wording of the executive order, and not the summary list. Most of what's being publicized doesn't sound like an executive order, and more like a 'to do list'.

    ....
    11. "Nominate an ATF director."
    12. "Pickup Groceries for Grandma."
    13. "Watch reruns of I love Lucy."

    The President can't really make new laws on his own, and so Executive Orders tend to look like "to-do's".

  2. #22
    Scarab Lord Buckwald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorensen View Post
    Obama doesn't want kids to die, I am enraged by this.

    Wait no I'm not that makes sense.
    IF he really cared, he'd get to the root of the problem. Reactive legislation (or executive orders) are terrible. He and congress need to be proactive. Neither of them are.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoweye View Post
    Nothing like having our civil liberties tramped on.
    Turn of the fear mongering of Fauxnews and get with the program of FACTS, NONE of this tramples on your civil liberties unless you think it is a right to be able to buy guns without having to prove that you arent a criminal

    Really what so bad about making sure we keep guns out of the hands of TERRORISTS and violent FELONS? I know so far none on the far right have explained why we should allow them to arm at gunshows and private sales is a good thing. Waiting on your good quality reason on why you want a convicted murder to have a bushmaster .223 caliber AR-15. I am waiting why should a convicted MURDER have legal access to AR-15 ( which is the case today when you have those loopholes in background checks) Heck we could even arm 1000 MUSLIM terrorists thru those loopholes and do a Mumbai terrorist attack in New York or Chicago or some other major city and kill 25,000.. all by LEGALLY purchased firearms due to the loopholes you think are a civil liberty.

    So explain why do you want to keep arming MURDERS and TERRORISTS. I am waiting for a good answer that isnt the usual right wing nonsense

  4. #24
    Maybe it is a person who teaches kids how to keep away from street gangs and stuff like that?
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  5. #25
    The Lightbringer Lenonis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    Go actually read the Executive Orders. They do no infringe on any of your civil liberties as per the Bill of Rights or the Constitution, nor do they infringe on your human rights as per the UN treaty.
    You have to realize that there are quite a few people out there who think this, and many of the other recent mass shootings were actually orchestrated by the government for the sole purpose of building public opinion to banning guns.

    There is zero way you will be able to convince them that this is anything other than a full on assault against the second amendment.

  6. #26
    Mechagnome select20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    Go actually read the Executive Orders. They do no infringe on any of your civil liberties as per the Bill of Rights or the Constitution, nor do they infringe on your human rights as per the UN treaty.
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.
    "A wise man fears and departs from evil, But a fool rages and is self-confident."

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.
    But read them none of them have anything to do with rights they are mostly setting up agencies to study why school shootings happen.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Aran View Post
    instead of assaulting his intelligence, can you prove him wrong with a valid counter arguement backed with proof?
    Right wing gun nuts dont like facts and such. they live by the mantra more guns better more safe. If that dogma of idiocy was true we would be the SAFEST country in the world already since gun ownership is extremely high. And it can only be called idiocy when you deny the facts so blatantly as the NRA does.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.

    And all of those had support from Congress or were initiated by Congress, your elected representatives in Government. Don't like it, don't elect them.
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  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by ptwonline View Post
    Here's the list according to the White House (taken from CNN):

    *list snipped*
    Wow there's some massive trampling going on right there *eyeroll* lol @ people who went all tinfoil hat before even reading this list.

    I'm ambivalent on gun control. I see other countries with lots of guns and none of the US's problems. It does seem to be a cultural problem, but not OMG GAEMS AND MOOVEES, more 1) lack of mental health services and related gun restrictions and 2) the NRA-backed patriot/cowboy mythology that guns are tools for solving problems. That is, if it weren't for the NRA, there'd be less reason to take guns away. I think that's irony, I'm never sure. Thanks Alanis.

    Anyway, these executive orders just do what little Obama can, particularly on that first mental health point, within the laws that exist. Good for him, now let's see if Congress does anything meaningfBAHAHAHA couldn't finish the sentence.

  11. #31
    Legendary! Reg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.
    His whole presidency? You do know that in his term as president, there were only two gun laws he signed, and they were to EXPAND gun rights. So please ... tell me what he has done to take your guns?

  12. #32
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    None of the Executive Orders affect you in the slightest (unless you are one of the people given a new job). The actual gun legislation is in the hands of Congress, not the President.
    It's how they reinforce their preconceptions. They had two possible reactions they could resort to, which cover every possible announcement the President could have made today.

    The first, which is what we're seeing is "This won't change anything, because the President stayed within the limited authority of his Executive powers and is allowing Congress to develop further legislation!" They choose to be outraged because he didn't wave a magic wand and fix gun crime forever.

    The second was "He's exceeded his authority as President, and Congress must overthrow those orders! Impeach! Impeach!" No matter what he'd proposed, if he'd exceeded his powers, this would have been the talking about.


    The two points cover every possible outcome. They can sustain their outrage regardless of what the President actually says. This is the same attitude that leads to Obama being considered both an empty suit and the most dangerous Marxo-socialist the Presidency has ever seen, both at the same time. It has nothing to do with the President's actual statements or policies, and everything to do with an irrational hatred of the man filling the position, for either reasons of blind political affiliation, or worse reasons, such as flat-out racism.

    This isn't true of most Republican voters, or even Conservatives in general, but there's definitely a vocal minority who follow this trend. It's no different than "liberal" types who'll make fun of, say, Governor Christie, even when the man is complimenting President Obama on his leadership during and after the hurricane that hit the East Coast. Reasonable people of either side are perfectly able and willing to discuss points of policy and accept shades of grey on either side, rather than a flat-out condemnation at all costs, regardless of the actual points in question.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    Ignorance is bliss I guess.
    you must be in a very blissful state , nothing that was listed would classify as "takin away yer guns!!!"
    "lol uh oh , spelling correction, the sure sign someone is losing an argument "

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    And pretty much all of those had support from Congress or were initiated by Congress, your elected representatives in Government. Don't like it, don't elect them.
    I'm still waiting for his valid arguements backed up with facts, not the "YOU go read them"/"He started it"-quality.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3010461094

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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.
    Or in this case, no civil liberties. If you cannot listen to reason then there is no helping you.
    Quote Originally Posted by lakers01 View Post
    Those damn liberal colleges! Can you believe they brainwash people into thinking murder is wrong! And don't get me started with all that critical thinking bullshit!
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells
    You don't get to troll, lie, and treat government like a game for your own purposes and then expect to be treated like a statesmen. Fuck that.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.

    OH noes i cant buy a gun if i am a convicted terrorist oh the horrors. I am sure the victims in Newtown feels your support for the terrorists and convicted murder's since you value there right to buying AR-15's HIGHER than the right of 20 kids to be allowed to safely go to school.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatSageCorban View Post
    Can anyone find the exact wording of the executive order, and not the summary list. Most of what's being publicized doesn't sound like an executive order, and more like a 'to do list'.

    ....
    11. "Nominate an ATF director."
    12. "Pickup Groceries for Grandma."
    13. "Watch reruns of I love Lucy."
    I don't have a copy of the exact executive order he signed, but here is the press release that does have some more explanations of the various points.

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa..._time_full.pdf

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    If he was really concerned about Child deaths, he should be fixing other things. Don't be so blind.
    Huh? What other things need fixing that involve child deaths that most of the nation is already behind? I guess religious texts for one.

  19. #39
    Mechagnome select20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lenonis View Post
    You have to realize that there are quite a few people out there who think this, and many of the other recent mass shootings were actually orchestrated by the government for the sole purpose of building public opinion to banning guns.

    There is zero way you will be able to convince them that this is anything other than a full on assault against the second amendment.
    Take a look at history and see for yourself hat happens when Guns are banned? Things always get worse, every single time. You cannot argue against that unless you choose to remain ignorant. In extreme cases like Hitler, Stalin, etc. Things got really bad. All these gun proposals and laws like this only serve to push it in that direction, this is what is pissing people off and scaring many. People who know history know to be concerned.
    "A wise man fears and departs from evil, But a fool rages and is self-confident."

  20. #40
    Old God Grizzly Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by select20 View Post
    No, you go read them. I understand what the agenda is, you do not. Look at all his years as president, if you don't see it there is no helping you. Liberties are never taken away all at once, "Little by Little" is the key term here.

    Again, ignorance is bliss. Enjoy it.
    Did you read the list? I did. Nothing there is infringing on rights.
    Is it a rule that you have to be rude and sarcastic in every conversation here?

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