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  1. #21
    Bloodsail Admiral WillFeral's Avatar
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    (They never noticed the healer hiding over in the bushes giggling...)
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  2. #22
    I'm pretty sure there's more to this story than the OP is telling. The only thing I can even think of as to why you can't out-DPS his Second Wind (if, as you say, you're getting around the high 40k range in DPS), is if you're missing him, and that's due to the level difference you two have. Even then, you wouldn't miss enough to cut your DPS down by 30k.

    I was curious, so I decided to test this out myself, wasn't a problem because I just so happen to have a Warrior (specced as prot and arms), and all I have are either quest gear or normal dungeon blues. Guildie has a boomkin he's working on, level is 89, he's in greens and dungeon blues. Results: Boomkin killed me. You aren't revealing something, and it's obvious. The boomkin DID have trouble once Second Wind was working, and yes it gave him a hard time, but even alone, without the help of anybody else, and me just standing there, he was still easily able to kill me.

    -EDIT- I'm going to give you the benefit of a doubt and I"ll try moving around and using defensive tactics like kiting and throw out the occasional CC instead of just standing there, maybe I'll get better results in your favor. But, imo, it's just going to delay my death by a small amount.
    Last edited by Sparky_b; 2013-01-20 at 04:11 AM. Reason: Going to attempt a second test. Just to be thorough.

  3. #23
    Herald of the Titans Bryntrollian's Avatar
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    My level 85 druid was able to smack 90 warriors around but only with all cds and a boat load of mastery otherwise you won't break the second wind.
    Synek - best rogue in the world


  4. #24
    Scarab Lord Raugnaut's Avatar
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    Some ppl seem to be forgetting a few things. 1: This warrior is lvl 90. The Druid/DK in question are 1/2 levels lower then the Warrior, respectively. Gear difference, not to mention the warrior has access to gear they don't. 2: This warrior could be sitting in Def stance. Especially if hes bad- Def stance allows you to easily pull 9 mobs of the same level and not die, while killing them at a slightly slower rate then normal. 2: higher lvl = higher miss chance, less damage going out. I also think Resil is affected by level (I.E a lvl 85 with no power will not do 40% less damage against a lvl 90 target, but like 50% or something. Could be wrong, I know armor, dodge, parry, miss chance works that way, a lvl 70 attacking a target with 20k armor will do 75% less physical damage against them, even though that 20k armor is like 40% less damage taken against lvl 90s)

    Now, with that being said, a warrior in second wind range only has 2 methods to heal above 35%- Victory Rush, if they kill you, and a single potion (You shouldn't be allowing them to get out of combat). Thus, you can both time your CDs, and possible burst him down.
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  5. #25
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryntrollian View Post
    My level 85 druid was able to smack 90 warriors around but only with all cds and a boat load of mastery otherwise you won't break the second wind.
    Was the warrior afk, otherwise I don't see how you'd even manage to get him in second wind range without getting 1-2 shotted...

    Quote Originally Posted by Treelife View Post
    The numbers do not add up. Let's assume he has 340k HP (a LOT more than someone in quest greens would have), that would be 10,200 HPS from Second Wind. Add in Battle Fatigue that's 8,670 HPS. If you want to add base Resi that would be what, 12k HPS?

    If you cannot even do that much damage between you, Second Wind isn't the problem. End of story.
    You forgot warriors also have defensive stance, defensive cooldowns and a whole load of cc.
    And as said above, the warrior has a greater chance to avoid attacks due the level difference.... Not to mention that the difference between lvl 90 blues and sub-90 greens and blues is rather large
    Last edited by Nicola; 2013-01-20 at 05:27 AM.

  6. #26
    Ok, testing finished. I was able to last roughly twice as long thanks to moving around and throwing out some stuns. Even so, I was still killed. I simply can't see how you can just wail on anybody, even with the level difference, using 2 people no less (instead of just my single tester) and you NOT pull out ahead. I can only come to the conclusion there is more to this story than is being revealed. Plain and simple, you are either lying or just don't have the PvP skills. There's nothing wrong with admitting you can't pull off kills, especially since you admitted earlier you're a casual player. But don't throw accusations around when it's obviously nothing wrong game-wise, and just something you need to learn to overcome. This and Second Wind is getting nerfed anyways, so I would assume this is problem solved.

    -EDIT- This guy just might have had your number, happens to even me (I'm no badass, but I'm a glad a few times over, if that helps you). I don't think, even with class hard-counters, there is a single class that can just dominate, haven't met any yet. The TFB procs, while devastating, doesn't even account for most of the W-based teams that make higher rankings, and neither has SW. Those like Swifty are few, rare, and are usually lost by people who don't have much experience with the way that system works, once you learn to keep a particular class/player dealt with, it doesn't become much of a factor anymore.
    Last edited by Sparky_b; 2013-01-20 at 06:31 AM. Reason: Clarify, took out some text and replaced, not trying to be an asshole.

  7. #27
    Herald of the Titans Bryntrollian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Treelife View Post
    The numbers do not add up. Let's assume he has 340k HP (a LOT more than someone in quest greens would have), that would be 10,200 HPS from Second Wind. Add in Battle Fatigue that's 8,670 HPS. If you want to add base Resi that would be what, 12k HPS?

    If you cannot even do that much damage between you, Second Wind isn't the problem. End of story.
    There is no battle fatigue in anywhere 2 89s and a 90 would be involved in...

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-20 at 01:27 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Niberion View Post
    Was the warrior afk, otherwise I don't see how you'd even manage to get him in second wind range without getting 1-2 shotted...



    You forgot warriors also have defensive stance, defensive cooldowns and a whole load of cc.
    And as said above, the warrior has a greater chance to avoid attacks due the level difference.... Not to mention that the difference between lvl 90 blues and sub-90 greens and blues is rather large
    You would be surprised how easy it is to kite clueless warriors who pop oneshot macros and proceed to faceroll...
    Synek - best rogue in the world


  8. #28
    Field Marshal Omniscient's Avatar
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    So many fotm wars in this thread, like I knew there would be. Anyone still playing a warrior is shit, end of story. The real 'warriors' re-rolled because yeah, it's completely retarded to be fotm. Wars currently are as bad, if not worse than shadowfrost DKs in wrath.

  9. #29
    I am Murloc! Charge me Doctor's Avatar
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    i killed 90 warrior as 89 enhancement shaman. Had no problems with bursting through second wind. Also, new second wind interrupts when warrior is stunned, can we just get over all this QQ?
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  10. #30
    Herald of the Titans Bryntrollian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omniscient View Post
    So many fotm wars in this thread, like I knew there would be. Anyone still playing a warrior is shit, end of story. The real 'warriors' re-rolled because yeah, it's completely retarded to be fotm. Wars currently are as bad, if not worse than shadowfrost DKs in wrath.
    Eh i can still remember the good old frost strikes that crit for 86% of your health and couldn't be dodge blocked or parried...
    Synek - best rogue in the world


  11. #31
    Field Marshal Omniscient's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bryntrollian View Post
    Eh i can still remember the good old frost strikes that crit for 86% of your health and couldn't be dodge blocked or parried...
    I still remember the stats of, what was it.. 86 DKs in the top 100 arena teams?

  12. #32
    Mechagnome Sarthan's Avatar
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    OMG second win is OP QQ

    Please everyone makes it out to be so bad when in reality you can easily out dps the healing from it.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Zergin8r View Post
    Recently I was ganked by a level 90 Warrior, while I was on a level 89 Balance Druid. The Warrior in question was really bad, and I guess thought he could get an easy kill. Anyways long story short I managed to kite him around and get him to around 30% health when he got the Second Wind Buff.... at that point I could not lower his health any further even with all CD's. Is this intended or is Second Wind supposed to make a Warrior invincible to anyone below their level?

    EDIT, Tested this with 2 friends, an 89 Balance Druid and 88 Frost DK, cannot do enough DPS to kill a warrior who is in quest greens, we can get his health down 2-3% with Necrotic Strike but he heals back up again before the DK's runes are back up for more, even with the ability to recharge all his runes, we got him down maybe 10% and then he healed right back up.
    My 90 hunter went one on one with a 90 horde warrior in Hellfire who was SW spec and at around 35% I popped my cooldowns and annihilated him - killed him again when he made the mistake of ressing and insta-charging me. So yeah, if you and multiple people can't kill a warrior, what you guys are doing is the greater issue.

  14. #34
    Field Marshal Omniscient's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarthan View Post
    OMG second win is OP QQ

    Please everyone makes it out to be so bad when in reality you can easily out dps the healing from it.
    Actually it's pretty bad, it's even worse when you're not 90 with tons of PvP power. I'm going off of this, since the OP mentioned the war is bad, and badly geared but none the less without PvP power it's a pain. 90? Sure, it isn't as big of a problem but it's still a problem especially vs a war that has warbringer. Anytime you get them low? Stun, and stun some more. Pop last stand later, pop shield wall another time. Sit in defensive stance, too. That's just world PvP, and only ONE issue with wars right now. Their dmg, along with utility and stuns are also currently too much. Blizzard doesn't know how to balance PvP, really.

  15. #35
    Herald of the Titans Bryntrollian's Avatar
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    I remember some fire mages qqing about not being able to solo second wind not too long ago.
    Synek - best rogue in the world


  16. #36
    My level 80 Blood DK killed a level 86 Warrior this morning. So no, its not impossible.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by foxHeart View Post
    Sounds like a case of bad-on-bad violence, tbh.
    I don't even like PVP, but that's so hilarious, )

  18. #38
    lol, should have been playing in vanilla

    there was a video of a 45 mage killing a lvl 60 warrior because the warrior wasnt able to touch him at all, was quite amusing.

  19. #39
    Herald of the Titans Bryntrollian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    My 90 hunter went one on one with a 90 horde warrior in Hellfire who was SW spec and at around 35% I popped my cooldowns and annihilated him - killed him again when he made the mistake of ressing and insta-charging me. So yeah, if you and multiple people can't kill a warrior, what you guys are doing is the greater issue.
    The gap between level 88-90s this expansion is far bigger than you seem to understand with pvp power being one of the main factors.
    Synek - best rogue in the world


  20. #40
    Bloodsail Admiral Jawless Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxHeart View Post
    Sounds like a case of bad-on-bad violence, tbh.
    i second this
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombiebob
    I'm still waiting on someone to tell me where all these people that suddenly care about Warrior balance were during Cataclysm when they were blow up dolls with plate armor on.
    Quote Originally Posted by cutterx2202 View Post
    Stop complaining to solve your lack of ability, and start reading and practicing to gain ability. Stop trying to bring people down to your level instead of striving to raise yours.

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