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  1. #1

    Prayer of Healing in the future

    I'll be really frank here. I don't think the group portion of the heal is long for this world. I personally dig it and I feel smart when I see 5 people in a group all at once who need healing. It makes the spell different from other AEs.

    On the other hand, it's pretty gamey. (I can only heal these five arbitrary people, why?) Priests feel like they have to ask raid leaders to set up groups with their weird AE spell in mind, which is really unlikely to happen in Raid Finder. It doesn't work at all on encounters like the shrines in Sha of Fear.

    We're not going to change it for 5.2. We're probably not going to change it for 5.3. But I sense the writing on the wall here that it won't last much longer. I can imagine a future iteration where Prayer of Healing is the AE equivalent of Gheal and Circle of Healing is the AE equivalent of Flash Heal. (Yes, I know Disc doesn't have CoH - I'm in a really theoretical space here.)

    Sorry. I broke my own rule about simple questions and answers. Sometimes I can't help it.
    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...-bonus-issues/

    Took them 2 expansions to figure this one out. Now they just need to make holy nova the disc aoe heal like they said in Beta and we will be golden.

  2. #2
    You know, I changed from Shaman to Disc Priest. I didn't change because I was just waiting for Blizzard to pigeonhole another healer into AoE-healing well on stacks and badly when spread out. Holy Nova is not the solution.

  3. #3
    PoH group dependancy was great in the past, but now with so many different smart healing spells feels a bit behind in some situations. Still great, dont get me wrong, but there are times when i wish it would simply heal the 5 most needed players

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    Now they just need to make holy nova the disc aoe heal like they said in Beta and we will be golden.
    Completely opposed to Holy Nova being our AoE heal, unless they changed it to be almost completely unrecognizable as Holy Nova. (IE, adding CD and Mana cost, not reducing the heal amount for multiple targets....)

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Venaliter View Post
    Completely opposed to Holy Nova being our AoE heal, unless they changed it to be almost completely unrecognizable as Holy Nova. (IE, adding CD and Mana cost, not reducing the heal amount for multiple targets....)
    I was thinking they change it to aoe "hot spots".

    Ground targeted, pulses aoe healing/damage for like 6 seconds. Sort of like lightspring but with holy nova and you can put mulitples out. And its more noticeable and easier to use (just walk in range) then lightspring and it solves the issue of GC wanting disc to use PWS more and spot heal more.

    Something like that, maybe not exactly but god something other then PoH. Disc and holy feel too similar to me :/

  6. #6
    Really would like to see it become a WG-style smart heal, to be honest. Auto tags 5 or 6 targets in the raid for the current effect instead of group targeting. Given the rest of the 5.2 changes and the stated dev intent for Disc, it would work

    Even given that Holy mastery would be better total healing with the same spell, Disc style would have its own shield benefits
    Last edited by PsyBomb; 2013-01-18 at 02:40 PM.

  7. #7
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    Thank the sweet baby jesus.

  8. #8
    PoH no longer being party based would completely change the feel of priests. Even though it can be inconvenient at times, it gives us so much control over who we heal. I like control as a healer.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalmah View Post
    PoH no longer being party based would completely change the feel of priests. Even though it can be inconvenient at times, it gives us so much control over who we heal. I like control as a healer.
    Yes, it gives us plenty of control over who we want to heal, but that control's effectiveness is subjected to your raids capacity to stand where they're supposed to, and we ALL know ho well that can turn out. Don't get me wrong, there are few things I enjoy more while I'm healing than throwing out a PoH that actually heals the whole group (and shields them besides, which will become moot, as things stand) I want it to, but since I tend to play 10-man raids with 2 other Resto druids (talk about less than ideal heal-comps), I tend to stick with atonement healing mostly, cascade, PoM, PW:Shield and stack SS and DA on predictable damage spikes, leaning heavily on the atonement/PW:Shield side of the spectrum when there's a lot of movement, and evening out more on relatively static fights.

    Well, getting back on track (I apologize for the not-so-slight spin-off), I've always thought of the PoH DA normal proc to be OP. Maybe they could give it a hidden inherent bonus, for example, 25-50% + your critical %chance (for example, say I have 18% raid buffed critical %chance). With this hidden bonus, every time you cast PoH, you'd have a 43%(25+18)-68%(50+18) chance of proccing DA. It might be a solution, because I understand the concerns of other healers, because blanket healing with these shields is BORING, and whilst being a nerf, it wouldn't be as severe as what Blizzard is proposing right now.

    Thoughts?

  10. #10
    Well, getting back on track (I apologize for the not-so-slight spin-off), I've always thought of the PoH DA normal proc to be OP. Maybe they could give it a hidden inherent bonus, for example, 25-50% + your critical %chance (for example, say I have 18% raid buffed critical %chance). With this hidden bonus, every time you cast PoH, you'd have a 43%(25+18)-68%(50+18) chance of proccing DA. It might be a solution, because I understand the concerns of other healers, because blanket healing with these shields is BORING, and whilst being a nerf, it wouldn't be as severe as what Blizzard is proposing right now
    .
    Was thinking about something similar but then it still make our mastery depend on other stat (in lesser degree than it is now).Disc Priest are about prevention of dmg and i think our mastery should be tied to that idea, we wont get % of every heal as absorb because paladins already have that , would be nice to have mastery in this kinda tone:

    Discipline Mastery: Every time you heal or place absorb effect on a friendly target you bless it with Divine Aegis lasting 15s. Divine Aegis reduce damage taken by X % and another Y % for every mastery point.

    Discipline still is about prevention and there is no meter padding with absorbs.
    Abandon hope all ye who post here

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Ksiadz View Post
    Was thinking about something similar but then it still make our mastery depend on other stat (in lesser degree than it is now).Disc Priest are about prevention of dmg and i think our mastery should be tied to that idea, we wont get % of every heal as absorb because paladins already have that , would be nice to have mastery in this kinda tone:

    Discipline Mastery: Every time you heal or place absorb effect on a friendly target you bless it with Divine Aegis lasting 15s. Divine Aegis reduce damage taken by X % and another Y % for every mastery point.

    Discipline still is about prevention and there is no meter padding with absorbs.
    Only way I can see that working is if the DR where a bitch. DMG reduction stacking with mastery would get out of hand way to fast!

    OT:
    I feel a priest overhaul coming next expansion. The past two expansions priest (disc especially) have been have started out super weak, needing a hotfix buff that later needs a nerf.
    honestly I pray for one.
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    I hear people say bring War back to World of Warcraft, well how about bringing World back to World of Warcraft

  12. #12
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    Maybe it they could just use crit% + mastery% as the DA proc rate for PoH? That could possibly solve the issue of scaling, but I'm just throwing that one out there, though I seriously doubt Blizzard will ever go that way. Besides, I'm not good a crunching numbers, at least in this :P.

  13. #13
    Point blank, PoH has to heal for more. I'm not even sure it's a HPS gain unless it hits 5 targets. Disc won't be able to effectively AoE heal. Spirit Shell will probably ensure us a raid spot, but I doubt we'll be able to keep pace with the other healers. I actually like the change of removing DA from PoH, having a spell do both absorbs and healing means we basically SPAM that spell. But I have dire concerns about the state of Disc's AE throughput afterward.

    Very dire.

    Going forward, it'll be interesting if they make CoH(or something like it) available to Disc.
    Last edited by Venaliter; 2013-01-19 at 05:18 AM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalmah View Post
    PoH no longer being party based would completely change the feel of priests. Even though it can be inconvenient at times, it gives us so much control over who we heal. I like control as a healer.
    Yea it gives control like whether you want to heal the one person in group three who took damage, the one person in group four who took damage, or the one person in group five who took damage.

    It's a retarded mechanic that should have been gone two expansions ago, and would have been but for some idiot on the dev team deciding that disc should do all its raid healing through absorbs with DA. Which obviously crashed and burned, and now we get to be barely viable at best for a few patches.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Maleric View Post
    Yea it gives control like whether you want to heal the one person in group three who took damage, the one person in group four who took damage, or the one person in group five who took damage.

    It's a retarded mechanic that should have been gone two expansions ago, and would have been but for some idiot on the dev team deciding that disc should do all its raid healing through absorbs with DA. Which obviously crashed and burned, and now we get to be barely viable at best for a few patches.
    hahahahaha

    Even with the DA nerf disc will still have PLENTY of utility to bring to a raid. You just won't be able to negate boss mechanics. Sorry.
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    I hear people say bring War back to World of Warcraft, well how about bringing World back to World of Warcraft

  16. #16
    Making our mastery a raw damage reduction would make disc priest a must for every raid, and if it stacks with other disc priests, everyone would only bring disc priests, and if it doesn't stack why would you ever need more than one? It's just bad all around xD.

    I actually was excited when I heard about Holy Nova way back when. I would love to see us using something different to make the spec more unique and less like Holy, but obviously it would need a mayor buff from it's current form. Maybe if it would explode on our target instead of on us and heal for 3-4 times more? :P

  17. #17
    If you have healing assignments, or you have priority players in certain groups (healers, tanks) then having a group-based heal has its advantages. A low-health dps may not be the "smart" player to heal if the tank is higher but taking 200% more damage, or you want to put a heal on all the healers, even if some dps in another group is also low. You can deal with that dps separately via a triage heal if you know the damage pattern of the encounter.

    So I would prefer to see a fix for PoH that includes the group-heal aspect but also adds the low-health aspect. They can do this several ways: your PoH heals the target and 4 low-health players within 30 yards of the target preferring the target's group first. That way if 2 of the 3 people in group 1 are at 100% it puts those heals on 2 people in another group. That's really what we want anyway, right? Another way to rule the meters and compete for low-health by making our heals super-smart, super-efficient, always heal a low-health player and automatically win against other healers (sigh, not really but methinks that's what we are actually asking for here).

    Another idea is to have PoH be a smart heal normally, but forced into the traditional group-heal mode while SS, borrowed time, and Serendipity are active. That way if you are PoH spamming (outside of SS) its a smart heal. Want to queue a pre-cast on a high-priority group specifically, cast a PWS (Disc) or a FH (Holy) first.
    Last edited by Darkener; 2013-01-19 at 03:07 PM.

  18. #18
    We already have a smart heal in Atonement (2 if you count Cascade as a semi-smart heal), I don't feel like we need anything more. Disc's playstyle is all about absorbs, controlling who takes damage, and how much damage they take. By removing the group requirement from PoH the players essentially looses control over who they heal. It now becomes a luck of a draw type of heal. Disc will loose it's identity.

    It will also make it near impossible to use spirit shell anymore if you do that as well. As a disc priest I need to control where that shield goes, I need to guarantee that I can cover everyone in the raid. A smart aoe style PoH prevents this.

    Honestly it sounds like you want to turn disc into a ghetto Holy spec with bubbles where you don't need to think about groups, or positioning, you just smash your head on your KB and get results. I'm sorry, I don't want that and I know I'm not alone in that opinion. Absorbs require control, control over who gets healed, how much they get healed, and how much damage they are allowed to take. Remove that control and you remove a core identity of Disc.

    Quote Originally Posted by PlatedPriest View Post
    hahahahaha

    Even with the DA nerf disc will still have PLENTY of utility to bring to a raid. You just won't be able to negate boss mechanics. Sorry.
    I don't think the DA nerf will stick due to how crippling it will be for 25m raiding. Triage healing on a 25m raid encounter depends on those DA procs to mitigate damage. Without it they have nothing other than atonement. Every class has at least 2 forms of triage healing with some kind of hot/proc effect. This change would make Disc the only class without a hot/proc effect.

    The issue has nothing to do with mitigating boss mechanics, it's about class balancing with gear. What they SHOULD do is simply lower the coefficient of mastery with how it effects DA and/or increase raid wide boss damage to compensate with similar tweaks to other classes raid aoe healing.

    Keep in mine this is still the PTR, anything can change over the next several months of testing.
    Last edited by lizon; 2013-01-19 at 03:36 PM.

  19. #19
    I already felt disc and holy were too similar and shields were just an added while holy got HOTs instead.

    I was excited at the start when they said they would change holy nova for disc only aoe. Then they scarped it because it was too hard (lol really?).

    Now GC is stating in the future disc will get a differn't aoe...

    i dont even

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by PlatedPriest View Post
    hahahahaha

    Even with the DA nerf disc will still have PLENTY of utility to bring to a raid. You just won't be able to negate boss mechanics. Sorry.
    Don't think "utility" will overcome an inability to deal with multi-target raid damage. And disc won't be equipped to deal with raid damage unless it's either raid wide (PoH) or hits predictable targets (PW:S). Disc isn't that far beyond other healers in utility.

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