1. #1

    What encounter type do you prefer, and which is harder?

    Do you prefer to have short but very intense fights, like Vael in BWL, and elegon and Garaj..... or long drawn out fights like Sha or Will?

    Which do you think are harder?

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord Loaf Lord's Avatar
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    Short and intense. I hate long fights.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Abyssion View Post
    Do you prefer to have short but very intense fights, like Vael in BWL, and elegon and Garaj..... or long drawn out fights like Sha or Will?

    Which do you think are harder?
    Both are fine, though Will sucked...at least normal mode did. It's the same as Garalon, just pure zerg bosses are boring.

  4. #4
    I like mix of both, if we had only short, or only long fights it would be boring and predictable.

  5. #5
    how come you find short fights boring? So much yuo have to do to not only survive but put out that burst!

    I wish every fight was garajal short. i dread at 10-15 min fights, too much time and long doesn't mean difficult either

  6. #6
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    I'd say a proper raid should have a mix of each.

    But it's easier to design fun long encounters. There's the risk in short encounters that you end up boiling them down to "stay out of the fire and tank/spank."
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  7. #7
    I liked fights like BWD Nefarian. A mix of things going on, subsets of enrage timers, adds, interesting mechanics requiring coordination and a solid nuke phase. Well rounded, everyone needed to be alert and lots of fun.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-18 at 04:46 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Abyssion View Post
    how come you find short fights boring? So much yuo have to do to not only survive but put out that burst!
    which means class stacking and little else to worry about but burst dps on a meter.

  8. #8
    Dreadlord Choice's Avatar
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    Sha HM was difficult in a fairly arbitrary way. It was a dull end to what could have been a moderately good tier. Long fights run into the issue of limiting mechanics. But soft-enrages are good on short fights and easy to scale, so both were collided for that hard mode. You were left with a bizarre encounter what couldn't really wipe you for the first 14 minutes and realistically wasn't that challenging beyond dps assignments and the rng elements for healers (huddles) and tanks (thrash/naked timers)

    The variety is good, I think end bosses could stand to be >15 minutes long more frequently. But sha wasn't the way to do it.

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  9. #9
    Brewmaster Buxton McGraff's Avatar
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    I love long fights like Lich King and Nefarion, but I hate wiping to them. Too unforgiving.

  10. #10
    Short and intense fights by far. More often than not, the "long, challenging fights" are just identical boss phases repeated multiple times.
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  11. #11
    Herald of the Titans zephid's Avatar
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    Long fights are usually harder since there's more time for someone to f**k up. Staying focused and playing at the top of your ability for 15 minutes is harder than staying focused for 6 minutes.

  12. #12
    BWD Nef was a fun fight yes, enjoyed doing that fight dps'ing, healing and tanking, it had something for all roles. The risk with short burst-encounters is that they either get so tightly tuned that you risk having issues with them if your raid makeup isn't ideal or else easy enough that once you get them down you'll always get them down due to better gear (ie they lack the challenges from personal performance beyond the mere basics). Longer encounters on the other hand offer more chances for people to screw up and as such personal screw ups do happen, making the encounter harder.

    As said above, a good raid will mix both. I do like the Tsulong encounter in the way you alternate dps'ing/healing to complete it, personally speaking.

  13. #13
    Elemental Lord Granyala's Avatar
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    If you do long fight, for christs sake give them different phases!

    I HATE Will normal and Sha normal... it's soo tough to stay awake in these bosses.

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  14. #14
    a raid full of number checks would be boring, same goes if everything was tactic heavy, add infested or "dont stand in bad stuff" encounters. Thereby a mix is prefered.

    Ideally an encounter would have a mix of those.

    Someting like this would make a fun encounter.

    p1 (100%-65%):

    Number check, hits like a truck (lets say 300% dmg 200% attackspeed compared to p2/p3 base) on the tank(s) while doing moderate amounts of "avoid this shit" abilities and spawning low amounts of adds. Burn the boss quickly to reduce the tank/healer pressure. Kill or cc adds to use them later.

    p2 (65%-33%):

    Moderate amount of adds, large amount of nasty(but avoidable) effects, but with a twist the boss takes 99% reduced damage from players and the nasty effects damage adds, every add killed increases the damage the boss takes (firstly removing the dmg reduction and then stacking beyond) by 5%, any stack beyond the removal of the original 99% reduction also increases the damage done by the boss by 5%.

    p3 (33%-0%):

    Adds stop spawning (those present keep their p2 function), small amounts of avoidable effects, the boss starts doing aoe at regular interfals (doing 150k dmg to everyone in the raid, pre p2 add buffs) and sometimes starts to channel a raidmember, while channeling(5sec duration) the bosses other abilities are disabled, but so are the targets, any attack against the boss in that time does 200k dmg to the channeled target and increases the dmg taken by 10% for 20sec, if a target gets killed during the channel, the boss heals for 20% hp.

  15. #15
    Brewmaster xindykawai's Avatar
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    short and intence, i LOVE gara'jal fight !! (healer pov)
    and i love tsu-long too

  16. #16
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Depends.

    If the Long fight has interesting Mechanics that change with each phase (like the Lich King), I love fights like that.

    If it's an extremely long fight with barely any change in Mechanics, aka Madness of Deathwing and Sha of Fear, no.

    I love Empress and the Lich King fights. They define what long fights should be.

    And Lei Shen for next Patch is looking to do the same.
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  17. #17
    Short and intense, especially if the mechanics are compelling, satisfying, and fun. That being said, the LK fight was a blasty-blast, even despite the rather severe debuff on him at the time.

  18. #18
    Fluffy Kitten Rivin's Avatar
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    If it's long just to be long (e.g. Madness of Deathwing), that's not very fun. If it's long because it has a lot of varying phases, that's good. If a fight is too short, though, it doesn't feel like a proper fight. I think the main thing that long fights need is that you have to feel like you're accomplishing something during the fight. If the fight goes on too long for no apparent reason, or if the phases repeat too many times, it loses that feeling.

    For example, the first four phases of Madness went on way too long. The first one or two felt good, but by the third it really lost that feeling of accomplishing something because it just repeats itself too many times. But then, when Deathwing's head comes down, that felt good because suddenly it was like previous phases meant something. If they had cut the last two platforms out, I think it would've been a much better fight.

    Lei Shi is another example. The fight repeats itself far too often. Yes, each add phase spawns more adds, but overall the fight just feels like it's constantly repeating itself and the individual phases lose their sense of accomplishment because you know it's going to happen again really soon. That fight would be more fun if the phases were more spread out or each one lasted longer but didn't repeat as often.

  19. #19
    moderate length.
    high skill required.
    fights like yogg saron, tsulong, elegon, malygos, algalon, all of BWD, chogall, h rag, h baleroc, h anubarak, etc.

    short zerg fights are just boring. patchwerk, garalon, sartharion zerg strat or no drake sarth, etc.

    long fights with lots of perfection are equally as boring. im looking at you h LK. i loved the fight because of lich king, but the actual bossfight in essence was too drawn out and lots of unforgiving mechanics. add those together with a raid of the not so comptetent, and well...hours wasted. usually massive lore charachter fights suffer from this syndrome.
    h rag was an exception because you were literally always doing something. if you didnt do it, you died or raid wiped. but fights like illidan, deathwing, h LK, kaelthas and vashj; all drawn out long fights that didnt need to be long.


    blizzard needs to understand that long boss fight=/='epic encounter'

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