Heroic Will of the Emperor 10 Man Issues

[idiom444]

We had our first night of Heroic Will tonight.

Got the boss to 85% once. Didnt get past 90 after that.

We are using a strat where we kill the first 2 rages and their sparks, then cc the 2nd wave, wait for the 3rd and then burst them down all at the same time with stun and what not to make the soaking from the Ret pally/Hunter/Symbiosis Druid easy. We have me (resto Druid) soaking the Strength Sparks with displacer beast and a mage blinking the curage sparks.

Our problem is the rages dont die at the same time. No matter how many times i repeat myself my raid is not able to understand that they need to go down evenly to help soaking. Well they dont listen and just dps the one target until its dead and the last 1 just kinda gets away and kills someone.

I need help because i dont know what to do as someone new to raid leading.

Our comp was
-Prot Pally
-Prot Warrior
-Ele Shaman
-Ele Shaman
-Ret Pally
-Survival Hunter
-Frost Mage
-Frost DK
-Disc Priest
-Resto Druid

The resto druid (me) was symbiosis-ing the the hunter for deterrence to help with soaking as we have a bad comp for it. The only other player we had available was a WW monk. (not sure if that would help or not)

I just need help on what to do with my comp.

[dubwise]

Prot pally can soak the first 2 rages. Mages can trigger a spark and blink w/o taking dmg. If your mage is a very good player I would have them do this as much as possible. I soak over 30 rages per kill on my rogue through using feint, which doesn't have a cd but blink is pretty short. CCing all the rages is not necessary. On the set you would cc 2, instead rely on dps to get one down ahead of courage. When courage is dead work on that one rage that was cc'd very quickly and soak that as you begin to evenly dps the next 2 down. Have your ele shamans on frog duty. One on left an one on right. Alternatively kill the one thats closer when they are one ahead of the other. Have the 'left' guy always cc back if they land like this. This will require some coordinated cc and dps to pull off but it should leave your ret pally free to almost solo all the courages. Have your hunter multidot as much as he can (with the other stuff dying) and if you can kill a strength before another then you can use this strat. Ele shamans also have an excellent knockback as well, which should be used to aid in double soaking. Tbh though I don't know if your comp has enough soaks even if the mage is going full time.

tldr; soaking 4 sparks effectively isn't that cul and my group doesn't do it

[Spacebot]

We had the same issue in my previous guild. so we changed the tactic to killing every set of rages so there was only 2 and then had 3 people rotating soaking them. perhaps if your priest could go shadow and a shaman go resto that should be possibly for you to do too

[ballong]

When we progressed this fight a while back we also tried CCing 1 set and then killing 2 sets of rages at once but once we swapped tactic to just killing them as they spawned everything got alot easier, although we had a rogue for soaking 1 rage spark at a time (just make sure he's topped and maybe if you have a priest shield him or smthing)

[Warrada]

My group did the same as @ballong... We started with the tactic of keeping a wave of rages in CC to only kill together with the next one. Didnt worked...
So we just killed and soaked wave by wave of rages. We only CC them when the bosses are about 10 % HP, then we can just keep all of them in CC while we finish the bosses...

I would advice you to rely more on the Hunter for the soaking job, since he can soak half of all the wave of rages cause Deterrence talented has 1 min CD... If the mage has also a short CD and have no problems on this function, you could just set they 2 for the rages...

1 wave - Hunter
2 wave - Mage
3 wave - Hunter
4 wave - Mage
5 wave - Hunter


Or you can put other players on this rotation... If the Rages, are stilll beeing a problem, see if you are slowing them enough, stunning/rooting/knockbacking enough...

[idiom444]

Thank you all for your input but i think our comp is just stupid. We have absolutely no room for error with soaking the sparks. I have been reading around and i have found a few 3 tank strategies and i think ill just have my frost dk go blood and do most of the soaking.

[dubwise]

I have also heard that using a 3 tank strat will get the courage going across the room, making it easier to start dps on him. I agree with a previous poster that suggested your priest going shadow. Dispersion could help your comp a lot

[retailgamers]

I have also heard that using a 3 tank strat will get the courage going across the room, making it easier to start dps on him. I agree with a previous poster that suggested your priest going shadow. Dispersion could help your comp a lot

yes but i't depends alot of the 3rd tank positioning, as far as I know the courage goes for the furthest away tank

[idiom444]

If you would like to watch us fail and possibly give us tips heres a link to my stream

Twitch.tv/idiom444

also listen to some groovy music.

[Faylo]

Thank you all for your input but i think our comp is just stupid. We have absolutely no room for error with soaking the sparks. I have been reading around and i have found a few 3 tank strategies and i think ill just have my frost dk go blood and do most of the soaking.

You have a decent combo - we killed it in one night with a similar setup. We had:

1. Our Frost DK going blood.
2. Mage blinking every courage spark, with both your shamans being good as backup for that spark, and ret pala for 2x sparks.

There are 2 sets of timings, pre bosses and after bosses.
Pre bosses:

1. Rages - Prot pala Bubble.
2. Strength - Blood DK AMS+BoneShield
3. Rages - Druid Symbiosis Deterrence
4. Courage - Mage Blink (Temporal + Cauterize if fuckup, also Iceblock is great)
5. Strength - Blood DK AMS+BoneShield
6. Rages - Ret pala Bubble

After bosses (Can be repeated from here)

1. Rages - Hunter Deterrence
2. Strength - Blood DK AMS+BoneShield
3. Rages - Druid Symbiosis Deterrence
4. Courage - Mage Blink (Temporal + Cauterize if fuckup, also Iceblock is great)
5. Strength - Blood DK AMS+BoneShield
6. Rages - Hunter Deterrence

Once you get past the wave where bosses spawn, there are just 4 people taking sparks, making it pretty fine.
Also, we Time Warp @boss spawn to get adds down - and we get it backup @10 % or so.
Its the 2. pair of rages, before the courage that have to go down fast. Remember to keep the rages controlled with roots, stuns, knockbacks etc.
You can have the prot pala soaking the last pair of rages, but that will require you to kill them very very fast (And then your hunter can take the first one instead).
Pain Suppresion + a shaman cd should make it doable for them to soak single sparks without problems.

Also, if your priest goes shadow, your combo is absolutely amazing, and maybe a shaman goes resto. Amazing in the utility depeartment anyway, you lack them multidotters!

[Mersynd]

This fight can seem a little crazy at first, but it's a really easy fight after you down it. Every guild's comp will change their outcome, but you seem to have a decent comp for this. From my perspective (and you can just fill in our comp with your own), you can have the tanks handle the majority of sparks at the start, and then once the bosses come out it's up to everyone else. You will only be on the bosses when there is that small amount of down time between waves of adds, and then it's back onto the adds, so don't focus on anything other than adds. While bosses are out, I (Rogue) tank the Strengths off to the side and soak their sparks with cloak or feint/cheat death. Our hunter handles the Rages, and we don't CC any of the them. The CC strategy was really a way to cheat the fight, but it was meant for 25 man mainly. 10 man is a little bit easier because you can smooth out the damage on all of the adds. We have our Warlock use his immunity to soak the Courage's sparks, and I believe our Moonkin uses Symbiosis on me for cloak so that he can soak extra Rages that the Hunter or Hpally can't.
For your comp, you can Sym the Hunter for Deterrence, so it's similar to getting cloak from a Rogue. The DK can AMS the Strengths and tank them as well. The Hunter can get the Rages, and I can see how you might want to CC one set of them, as the rest of your DPS is not much help. The Ret can soak the Courages, as there aren't many. Having those two Shaman is where it will hurt you, but having the Monk as an optional is really not too viable as you already have so much melee. I haven't raided with a Monk in months so I am not sure what your possibilities are there, but perhaps you can replace the Ret with him and get some more survivability and mobility out of that.

[Nagassh]

Our problem is the rages dont die at the same time. No matter how many times i repeat myself my raid is not able to understand that they need to go down evenly to help soaking. Well they dont listen and just dps the one target until its dead and the last 1 just kinda gets away and kills someone.

Not going to make any progress unless the raid listens, simple as that.

We just downed it on our first night of attempts last night, it was entirely due to working out how to soak things and getting the raid to accommodate that - we started off killing 2 rages at once and soaking them together, but ended up changing it to kill 1 - wait - kill second (because our soaking method allowed it, not saying you can do the same - but in our case killing 2 at the same time would fuck us, so it's the same principle of people needing to listen).

Once you get your soaking strategy down it's rinse and repeat with a bit of a dps race / sustained healing check.

I will say that people really need to know the full extent of their classes ability to soak - don't have your raid just waltzing in with their cookie-cutter talent spec, have them check what glyphs and talents they can take to help soaking - since that's what the major thing going on is.

[Mnevis]

Can a Lock portal away from the explosion?

[Mctriple]

Yes locks can portal away