1. #1

    CLC DK or DKOne?

    I have used CLC DK for a while but it seem to be a very simple addon when it comes to raids. It dont recommend ghouls, Soulreaper and so on. Just the basics. I have aprox 70-80k DPS on lfg (no flask/pots) Kràken Darkspear.
    I did try out DKOne yesterday and in raids its awesome (at least i think so). I will do more checks today and see if my DPS will be a little better.
    Witch one would you recommend, and why?

  2. #2
    If you look in the options of CLC DK you can enable stuff like ourbreak and soul reaper in rotation.

  3. #3
    Moderator Fnx-'s Avatar
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    Wouldn't ever recommend using any addon(s) that tells you how to play tbh. You'll never improve your skill level if you stick to stuff like that, nothing works better than the human brain and eyes to judge what's best depending on the situation.

    Envy - Kazzak EU (www.envy.si)
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  4. #4
    Yes ofc the human brain is better, but CLC DK works realy nice (use to do better dps than other DKs with better gear in LFRs) but now i will try to enable outbreak and soulreaper in CLC DK.

    EDIT: CLC DK cant inlude Soul Reaper in rotation to bad.
    Last edited by Casco; 2013-01-20 at 12:16 PM.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire
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    If you want to know when to use soul reaper, I believe Italiandk has a nice string for weakauras on here that shows when trinkets proc as well as when the target is below 35%.

  6. #6
    Bloodsail Admiral Devorawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fnx- View Post
    Wouldn't ever recommend using any addon(s) that tells you how to play tbh. You'll never improve your skill level if you stick to stuff like that, nothing works better than the human brain and eyes to judge what's best depending on the situation.
    This.

    Although CLC and addons of a similar nature might be helpful short term, you may end up having to rely on such an addon to play the game for you which can severely harm your ability to think for yourself in certain situations.

    I'm not saying it will happen, I've just seen it happen with a couple people before.

    Also, as a former recruitment officer for a high end guild, if I see an addon on somebodies UI screen shots or even mentioned in their application that serves to do their rotation for them in some degree I'll immediately decline. To me it shows the player either doesn't know their rotation/priorities or that they can't actively think for themselves, both of which are nono's for someone looking to do high-end raiding.

    I haven't tried DKOne, but CLC does have some useful functionality outside of rotation help such as disease and CD tracking. For a time, I had it enabled simply with the rotation aspect disabled because it was lightweight and fairly flexible in other regards.
    If you spend your entire life getting senpai to notice you, you'll never notice anyone else.

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  7. #7
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    lamper from exploding labrats, who was one of the best 3 dks in terms of rankings on wowprogress during cata would disagree with you guys, it's good to have there as a back up, if you're doing something on a fight and it requires a high amount of attention then it's handy to have something there to keep you on the straight and narrow, im not saying to follow it blindly, I'm saying that don't give it such a bad name, especially as it can help many new DKs come in and play the class at a higher level then just mindlessly pressing buttons
    doin deeps killin' peeps, DK 4 LIFE y0
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  8. #8
    Bloodsail Admiral Devorawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by federline View Post
    lamper from exploding labrats, who was one of the best 3 dks in terms of rankings on wowprogress during cata would disagree with you guys, it's good to have there as a back up, if you're doing something on a fight and it requires a high amount of attention then it's handy to have something there to keep you on the straight and narrow, im not saying to follow it blindly, I'm saying that don't give it such a bad name, especially as it can help many new DKs come in and play the class at a higher level then just mindlessly pressing buttons
    You're right, It's just a case of making sure you're learning from it and not just relying on it to tell you how to play.
    If you spend your entire life getting senpai to notice you, you'll never notice anyone else.

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  9. #9
    Herald of the Titans Darkfriend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by federline View Post
    lamper from exploding labrats, who was one of the best 3 dks in terms of rankings on wowprogress during cata would disagree with you guys, it's good to have there as a back up, if you're doing something on a fight and it requires a high amount of attention then it's handy to have something there to keep you on the straight and narrow, im not saying to follow it blindly, I'm saying that don't give it such a bad name, especially as it can help many new DKs come in and play the class at a higher level then just mindlessly pressing buttons
    The point is that someone that skilled uses the addon as a tool, not as a crutch.

  10. #10
    I personally use DKOne with the entire rotational bit turned off.

    It's a pretty nice rune/RP monitor with timers for my ghoul, Unholy Might and all the various procs built in I can tailor to my leisure. So it's kinda silly to write it off just because of the rotation functionality.
    Vampire Zombie Werewolf

  11. #11
    Hmm... I was curious once again. And a quick test at the dummy showed that DKOne is about 10k below my brain. I wouldn't use it unless in very specific situations. As was mentioned above, a tool to support me while I'm busy with something else.

    Having said that, I can't think of a fight where I'd lose sight of my priorities. Not in this content, at least.

  12. #12
    Hi, this the author of DKOne. I don't really understand the addon hate, but I have always enjoyed the ability to customize the game. When I started playing DK, I just used DDR and it seemed more than enough. As I got better, I realized I had to start tracking cooldowns, proccs, auras, etc. I started writing personal PowerAuras (and later WeakAuras). Much later, in mid-Cata, I tried out CLCDK (via CLCRet from playing a pally alt) and also Zombie. I thought it was a cool idea, but of course the priorities were never quite right.

    So I decided to write my own addon based on my experience going in and modifying existing addons. I decided to grab all my favorite features and make a very customizable DK specific addon. I added lots of small features that I liked, such as Time to Die, Adds Count, Purgatory announce, Melee range indicator, and made it modular so you could turn all the features on and off. One thing I found is that people are very attached to their current setup. I myself still prefer the DDR format for rune displays, probably because that's what I learned on.

    The feature that causes the most controversy is the priority suggestion. My philosophy is that unless it is suggesting the correct action 99% of the time it's going to be useless. Even if it is suggesting an incorrect action just 5% time, you are going to end up second guessing it and it will be a distraction rather than a help. To be that good it needs to be customizable and it needs to detect things like when you are out of melee range, or AOEing. Over time I have developed a huge list of actions like Obliterate when X, Y, and Z are true. The actions codes are then listed in order much like the simcraft action lists. Whenever I play and I find it suggesting something that I wouldn't do I go back through and sort out why I disagreed with it and adjust the priority list accordingly.

    If you are a progression minded raider, its important to know your priorities and also to understand why they are in that order, but I don't feel having an addon tracking everything hurts your game in anyway. Every raider has a maximum bandwidth of things they can track and react to and if you are making mistakes mid-fight that means that you are exceeding your bandwidth. Since every raider makes mistakes, reducing the number of things you need to track is almost always going to improve your play. For what it's worth I had a number of early progression Rank 1s in this tier, although there are plenty of more naturally talented DKs out there.

    Anyway, I have plenty more thoughts on UI design, but that is probably enough for now. Feel free to ask any specific question.

  13. #13
    Actually I do have a request; is it possible to engage the priority frame JUST for soul reaper? So it tracks when a boss is at a adjustable percentage, say 36% to start with so you can line up runes to go off at 35% exactly, or 45% for the upcoming 4-set?

    I've been looking for a more elegant solution to making Soul Reaper easier to use and get used to with the 35% range as opposed to the 20% range i'm used to with Execute.
    Vampire Zombie Werewolf

  14. #14
    Herald of the Titans Darkfriend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorben View Post
    Hi, this the author of DKOne. I don't really understand the addon hate, but I have always enjoyed the ability to customize the game. When I started playing DK, I just used DDR and it seemed more than enough. As I got better, I realized I had to start tracking cooldowns, proccs, auras, etc. I started writing personal PowerAuras (and later WeakAuras). Much later, in mid-Cata, I tried out CLCDK (via CLCRet from playing a pally alt) and also Zombie. I thought it was a cool idea, but of course the priorities were never quite right.

    So I decided to write my own addon based on my experience going in and modifying existing addons. I decided to grab all my favorite features and make a very customizable DK specific addon. I added lots of small features that I liked, such as Time to Die, Adds Count, Purgatory announce, Melee range indicator, and made it modular so you could turn all the features on and off. One thing I found is that people are very attached to their current setup. I myself still prefer the DDR format for rune displays, probably because that's what I learned on.

    The feature that causes the most controversy is the priority suggestion. My philosophy is that unless it is suggesting the correct action 99% of the time it's going to be useless. Even if it is suggesting an incorrect action just 5% time, you are going to end up second guessing it and it will be a distraction rather than a help. To be that good it needs to be customizable and it needs to detect things like when you are out of melee range, or AOEing. Over time I have developed a huge list of actions like Obliterate when X, Y, and Z are true. The actions codes are then listed in order much like the simcraft action lists. Whenever I play and I find it suggesting something that I wouldn't do I go back through and sort out why I disagreed with it and adjust the priority list accordingly.

    If you are a progression minded raider, its important to know your priorities and also to understand why they are in that order, but I don't feel having an addon tracking everything hurts your game in anyway. Every raider has a maximum bandwidth of things they can track and react to and if you are making mistakes mid-fight that means that you are exceeding your bandwidth. Since every raider makes mistakes, reducing the number of things you need to track is almost always going to improve your play. For what it's worth I had a number of early progression Rank 1s in this tier, although there are plenty of more naturally talented DKs out there.

    Anyway, I have plenty more thoughts on UI design, but that is probably enough for now. Feel free to ask any specific question.
    Personally, given equal skill of a person without an addon and a person skilled using an addon, the person without the addon will perform better, because they will have a better grasp of their class. On my warrior, I use slamandawe and Enrage, but I don't follow either priority list, because although it's good, it's not perfect. I do use it for tracking rage/CDs/enrage uptime etc. An addon should be a tool, not a "hit x next"

    Basically, a person good enough to configure an addon to work to perfection will be a person who doesn't need that addon to begin with.

  15. #15
    High Overlord Jarg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slant View Post
    Hmm... I was curious once again. And a quick test at the dummy showed that DKOne is about 10k below my brain. I wouldn't use it unless in very specific situations. As was mentioned above, a tool to support me while I'm busy with something else.

    Having said that, I can't think of a fight where I'd lose sight of my priorities. Not in this content, at least.
    So you are judging the content with what experience? I would keep in mind that there are people who are playing normal and hc too, which requires a bit more attention than LFR, while i agree: in LFR you dont need anything to worry about.

  16. #16
    I like dkone even if you do not like the rotation suggestions you can turn them off all the other functionality that the addon provides are pretty good. You can also edit the rotation suggestions to make it work for you better if you want. I have turned it into mainly a soul reaper reminder.
    tl;dr Is just another way of saying I am about to troll

  17. #17
    Hi, based on these suggestions I was thinking it would make sense to make one of the procc/buff options a soul reaper button specifically, especially with the t15 4pc bonus. Then you could turn off the priority buttons completely, even though that makes me sad :'(

    I'm not making changes as frequently as early in the expansion, but I am continuing to make updates to my working copy and I will upload a new version soon. So keep the suggestions coming and if you ever get a bug let me know. Someone recently reported one that must have been there quite a while.

  18. #18
    Spellflash and Spellflash DK really help you learn your rotation.
    I'd suggest not using it for end-game.. just use it until you learn your rotation and then turn it off.

    It taught me I was doing my DW rotation completely wrong. :P boosted me up a couple of k.

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