Thread: Mages in 5.2?

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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Itsredd View Post
    A class (pretty much all specs) gets nerfed a bit and everyone starts crying and recommending other classes.... -_-

    Try a mage. They're awesome.
    Arcane has a really boring rotation and gets nerfed.
    PVP-Nerfs with every patch.
    Hotfixes that destroy a spec.
    No raidutility (buffs are applied by other classes and even hunter can activate Bloodlust) like Health Stones or Cooldowns.

    If You want to teleport around, yeah it's a cool class.
    If You want to raid You'll feel pretty useless.

  2. #22
    It never seizes to amaze me how apparently every class feel they've gotten the worst share of the cake. Whichever class forum I visit, that class is perceived as boring, poorly designed, underpowered and/or broken, despite empirical data often suggesting otherwise. The subtle differences in performance matters only to the very elite - the rest is just people needing to vent their frustrations about whatever; and forums being the perfect place to do so.

    OP: Base your decision on playstyle, flavor and - most importantly - fun factor, and worry about the rest if/when it becomes relevant.

  3. #23
    There is nothing wrong with mages in 5.2. Upcoming set bonuses dictated MINOR nerfs to help maintain current balance.

  4. #24
    Pandaren Monk Akraen's Avatar
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    A lot of bitching about mages would probably stop if they just scrap and rethink our level 90 talents.

  5. #25
    Somehow I doubt that.
    Every class bitches, 100% of the time. Classes that don't have our 90 talents don't feel any more loved than we do.

  6. #26
    Pandaren Monk Akraen's Avatar
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    It'd stop my bitching then I love mage. Seriously love it. Moving to mage from druid was the best choice I've made, it re-opened WoW to me after 8 years. Thematically this has to be one of the most interesting classes. I have been complaining a lot lately, though. Unfortunately it's for things that aren't quite being received or acknowledged, so I figure I'll just probably stop raiding at some point, but continue to play my mage.

    Last night on Heroic Windlord, I wanted to kill myself. Only once prior in all raiding, which I've raided every tier of every expansion while current, did I ever feel so stressed and pulled apart. On Illidan as a bear tank, I was a Flame of Azzinoth tank with a warrior. We each had one, but he was awful and would always die when my flame was roughly 25%. So for the last quarter of health on mine, I would charge over and try to manage both flames without paths intersecting or people dying. The challenge was fun, but I knew this wasn't Blizzard's fault, it was our awful tank who we just couldn't seem to replace.

    Anyway, last night I was juggling an already GCD intense spec of frost while keeping a target CC'd, with the invocation talent. Invocation is already frustrating on any fight where something can randomly target you and land on the ground (imagine if we had invocation when we were doing Vezax). The timer on Windlord CC is close to the timer of the buff from invocation. Which means you need to evocate before the CC is up so you can time the spear throw to CC your target. Add in his glaive throwy thingy, wind bombs, and the need to click people out of amber traps, and you find yourself at extremely high risk of neglecting something.

    The rest of my raid was wondering why I hit a couple wind bombs, I have many years of not being the guy who stands in things, I'm the guild and raid leader after all, if I suck then it's bad news bears, so I'm held to a very high standard. But I just found it so incredibly hard to juggle invocation and the CC while maintaining DPS and avoiding everything.

    So why would an upkeep talent ever be a good idea? In solo/questing it's just a nuisance, and I mostly ignore the ability all together. In anything I outgear there's not much point in bothering with it.

    Complaint number two is simply our innate damage reduction. I keep trying to explain to my raiders that I am the most OP class ever for self-heals as long as I don't get one-shot and the damage happens every 24+ sec. I'm not aware of any other class with an ability as powerful as temporal shield, that can completely negate Garalon's crush damage, rain of blades, dissonance, etc. And that's great, but for static AoE pulse damage, we're stuck. We require healers to pay extra attention to us because raid-wide AoE damage that will take other people down to 15-30% hp, will kill us. In some cases, the much, much, much inferior talent Ice Barrier is used (i.e. blade lord unseen strikes), just so that we survive-- when in reality we'd much prefer to be using Temporal Shield because it could heal back the damage from it. A flat 15% damage reduction could be added to our armors, and our self-healing could be reduced and we'd find a lot more consistency in encounters.

    Complaint number three is Blazing Speed. It doesn't belong in that tier of talents. I would love to have it for extra insurance on Heroic Lei Shi-- but there's never a raid encounter where I can justify the self-healing or absorption loss of the other two talents. It's a shame, because blazing speed is fun!

    But anyway, I don't wish to be like others who complain and preach it all like it's the end of the world. These are things I notice as my big gripes when doing heroic raid content on my mage. It's not enough to get me to reroll warlock, but it is enough for me to post here, sharing my take on things with the community-- for what it's worth. I am willing to accept some of my complaints are probably down to my stubbornness, as someone else offered to CC the target, but I didn't want to be defeated by a raid encounter or feel like a weak raider, so I did both.

    Oh well, those are my thoughts on mage. I'll continue throwing frostbolts no matter what happens.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Akraen View Post
    Last night on Heroic Windlord, I wanted to kill myself.
    Why would you do that to yourself?
    Just go arcane for windlord heroic with rune of power, stay between cc mobs and boss and yell at anything that stands near you, no pain.

  8. #28
    Pandaren Monk Akraen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    Why would you do that to yourself?
    Just go arcane for windlord heroic with rune of power, stay between cc mobs and boss and yell at anything that stands near you, no pain.
    Responses like this are what hurt the community.

    You can just as easily say 'go warlock'

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Orangetai420 View Post
    In my opinion mages are awesome, don't listen to the cry babies.

    Try one for yourself on the PTR.
    My opinion makes everyone who disagrees a crybaby !
    N

  10. #30
    High Overlord Bopcommander's Avatar
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    Just go arcane for windlord heroic with rune of power, stay between cc mobs and boss and yell at anything that stands near you, no pain.
    This makes me laugh. I yell every raid, all raid for people to not stand on me. I swear RoP is a target for people and they must stand in it. I love RoP for arcane, but I hate it so much as well.

  11. #31
    I've never had problems coping with Wind Lord but if you can't pay attention to that many things at once I can understand it being frustrating
    I was merely responding to your claim that "if we remove the 90 talents all the whining will stop", which is clearly and demonstrably not true

    By all means continue to voice your complaints, it's not my place to tell you to stop
    It never will stop though, discontent is a constant feature of game balance
    If there's ever more than one class, everyone will think the other class is stronger than they are and covet the tools they lack
    If there's only one, there's not enough variety and no choice
    Last edited by Imnick; 2013-01-23 at 04:30 PM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Akraen View Post
    Responses like this are what hurt the community.

    You can just as easily say 'go warlock'
    wat?

    Are you one of those RPers that likes to play stuff that greatly under performs because "MAH FUN, hurp entitled to my 15bucks a month" without thinking bout the others peoples "fun"?

  13. #33
    Pandaren Monk Akraen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    wat?

    Are you one of those RPers that likes to play stuff that greatly under performs because "MAH FUN, hurp entitled to my 15bucks a month" without thinking bout the others peoples "fun"?
    You think it is part of their game design to have people switching classes all the time?

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-23 at 12:31 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    I've never had problems coping with Wind Lord but if you can't pay attention to that many things at once I can understand it being frustrating
    I was merely responding to your claim that "if we remove the 90 talents all the whining will stop", which is clearly and demonstrably not true

    By all means continue to voice your complaints, it's not my place to tell you to stop
    It never will stop though, discontent is a constant feature of game balance
    If there's ever more than one class, everyone will think the other class is stronger than they are and covet the tools they lack
    If there's only one, there's not enough variety and no choice
    I'm sorry, Imnick, but I don't see a rank for you on Heroic Windlord. Mind verifying with some proof that you don't have problems coping with Wind Lord? Despite all my complaints, AND using Nether Tempest instead of Frost Bomb, I still did rank.

  14. #34
    The Patient Arthrun's Avatar
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    I play a frost mage and I love it.
    Happiness!

    {◕ ◡ ◕}

  15. #35
    Wow, so much hearsay. As far as I know mage has always been fun and a good dps spec, both in cata and wotlk its always been one of the top dps classes. So has warlock, but from a pvp perspective i say go play mage, but in pve the rotations do not offer enough variation plus utility in raids is less than for instance an sp or a warlock in my opinion. Mage has always been end tier lolz( dunno if that will be the case again)but dont change classes just cause you wont be top; besides who knows it's just ptr.

    Also ranks don't mean anything in a matter of opinion post, what do you wanna prove? you have less lag and better gear than someone else?
    Last edited by impfernal; 2013-01-23 at 05:40 PM.

  16. #36
    Since when has "cope" been the same as "top 100" ?
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/5...?s=1905&e=2221
    I'm also dubious of your extreme pride in a ranking of World 161st as Frost with 306252 DPS(e) when I'm doing 365221 as Arcane in Frost reforging but you know
    Whatever makes you feel superior

    Even if it's doing 60,000 less damage

    I can rank myself as Frost this week if you want, I'm that for Garalon anyway

  17. #37
    Brewmaster Lora's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hogmanlolz View Post
    Hello I was thinking of making a new class, caster class since I already have a tank, healer RDPS, MDPS, I want a caster class. I was thinking mage cause the utility and nice perks like; time warp, buffs,mage food and drinks, portals, self heals and awesome transmog gear. Wanted to level a lock cause of the green fire quest and the cute felsteed but its hard to keep up two dots with my hunter so a lock would be devastating. How are they 5.2 and beyond meaning 5.2.2 etc? I really want to get into a raiding guild my paladin is in one and soon my hunter would as well. I know there are alot of dps wanting to be in raiding guilds and to stand out really you need strong dps and brains. Are mages good dps not like good as in OP good like I can mess up and still be maybe top 5 maybe 10 ? I know on my hunter I can completely screw up and still manage to be in the top and since pets provide great buffs, ill always be wanted. Im not a fotm I just want to raid as dps sometimes. I always want to be in damand as dps, just like I love being in demand as a healer and tank. Thoughts?
    Personal preference really. I prefer mages to warlocks as they seem a lot more fun to me but thats just my playstyle. Try them out. I think they are pretty fun to play as. You get a bunch of fun spells that can be used deviously.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Gaga View Post
    I have a nuclear bomb. Once I detonate it, I'm shit cause I only got that one.
    Quote Originally Posted by bobo333 View Post
    i'm 6ft2, 30 years old, pretty fit and much stronger than your average 10 year old. even though i totally could, i don't go around punching ten year olds

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by impfernal View Post
    Wow, so much hearsay. As far as I know mage has always been fun and a good dps spec, both in cata and wotlk its always been one of the top dps classes. So has warlock, but from a pvp perspective i say go play mage, but in pve the rotations do not offer enough variation plus utility in raids is less than for instance an sp or a warlock in my opinion. Mage has always been end tier lolz( dunno if that will be the case again)but dont change classes just cause you wont be top; besides who knows it's just ptr.

    Also ranks don't mean anything in a matter of opinion post, what do you wanna prove? you have less lag and better gear than someone else?
    He has a point tho . If lv90 talents are sooooo easy and fun to manage it should be easy to rank, shouldnt?

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Fennixx View Post
    He has a point tho . If lv90 talents are sooooo easy and fun to manage it should be easy to rank, shouldnt?
    It's even easier to rank when you play Frost and nobody else does
    I haven't been Frost on Wind Lord since we did it on Normal but there are a grand total of 0 added mechanics for DPS to worry about on Heroic apart from more frequent target switching.
    If he asks me nicely I'll do it this week and we'll see who ranks what.

  20. #40
    Pandaren Monk Akraen's Avatar
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    Ranks also do in fact matter if someone is going to try to act as though they're King Mage. Imnick rules these forums with a snippy remark to anyone who has a complaint. He thinks I'm struggling to cope with windlord when that wasn't the point of my post at all.

    He holds 4 ranks across all fights, and has roughly the same ilvl and guild progression that I do (he's only slightly behind). I think it does a lot of people a lot of good to research the people who bloviate on these forums-- those who often speak from a position of wisdom and knowledge yet don't really have anything to back it up.

    I encourage the mage community to challenge things, investigate, and formulate a better analysis of the issues at hand rather than hopping on bandwagons and putting down people who share their experiences.

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