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  1. #21
    Actually I realized something I had forgotten. I said crusader was better for dps because that was true when those things were current. Agi did not originally give 2 ap per and the crit from it did not originally work on poisons (which didn't really do much damage anyway). I'm kind of unsure now, I mean 100ap on a proc versus 30 ap all the time with a reasonable amount of crit at lower levels. Depends on the uptime on crusader.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutions View Post
    Unless if they changed it. At the start of Cata blizzard they took away strength to ap for all agility classes and took away agi to crit for plate. This was to prevent plate wearers from using leather and agi melee from rolling on str stuff.
    The strength part is 100% false. I don't believe the crit part is true either, but I can't confirm. The real way they stopped plate from rolling on leather was that if you are wearing even 1 piece of non plate gear you lose 5% strength. Kinda took the lazy way out. I don't recall rogues actually wanting strength gear ever (unless you count way way back when they put strength on rogue leather). Now maybe the DS strength proc trinket for pvp or something.
    Last edited by Sesshou; 2013-01-22 at 09:08 PM.

  2. #22
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    I'd say 2x15 agility is better, especially for sub where you got a 30% agility bonus.
    As a rogue pre-60 when soloing and PvPing, you should get kills in the opener. Because of this, you'll either get kills before crusader has procced, or crusader procs just before the kill.
    On the other hand, you'll have a 100% uptime on the agility enchant, granting you extra damage in the opener as well as extra crit and dodge.

  3. #23
    Stood in the Fire aarro's Avatar
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    Just to clarify, I went with the crusader enchants on both and im lvl 7 as i type this. Crusader procs 70% of the time so far giving me +100 attack power

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by arkadeus View Post
    cheers everyone

    One more question - Which item combination would be best?

    2x Balanced Heartseeker --> http://www.wowhead.com/item=42944/balanced-heartseeker

    or 1x each Balanced Heartseeker & Sharpened Scarlet Kris --> http://www.wowhead.com/item=44091/sh...d-scarlet-kris

    cheers
    kris mh, heartseeker oh

    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutions View Post
    Unless if they changed it. At the start of Cata blizzard they took away strength to ap for all agility classes and took away agi to crit for plate. This was to prevent plate wearers from using leather and agi melee from rolling on str stuff.
    Wrong on both parts. Agi classes still get 1 AP per point of strength and plate classes still get crit from agility. For starters, plate classes can't roll need on leather ANYWAY, and because of the 5% to str for wearing all plate, they won't want to either. They DID remove agi-to-dodge for plate classes so they don't use agi accessories to tank with. Getting 2 AP per agi instead of 1 AP per agi (as it was prior to cata) is reason enough to never use strength accessories for agi classes.
    Last edited by shadowboy; 2013-01-23 at 01:28 AM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutions View Post
    Cool so they undid the change then. Fiery still kicks the crap out of both and doesn't look like shit.
    There was no change. At no point in WoW has strength not given rogues ap.

  6. #26
    The Lightbringer Whitey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Revolutions View Post
    Cool so they undid the change then. Fiery still kicks the crap out of both and doesn't look like shit.
    They didn't undo anything, because there was nothing to undo.
    WBMA - Leave our beards alone

    Skype, PS3 & Steam - Whiteington

    Family reroll project on Defias Brotherhood, poke me

  7. #27
    if your going to pvp at low levels crusaders heal will save your life ocasionaly,
    agi won't do that.
    pvp is about burst: crusader is a burst damg proc, agi is a passive increase

    pve fights at low levels -> not long enough for a proc of crusader to be beaten by agi as due to breaks in combat it will have a higher than proc rate uptime.
    eg fight starts 5 secs in proc -> proc ends -> fight a little bit longer -> second proc -> boss dies after second proc runs out , time crusader up = 2x proc duration, time down = only one "cd" length = crusader wins
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelodalix View Post
    What the fuck did you just say.

  8. #28
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    I would say just throw crusader on them, I have agi on mine only because I used them for my hunter first, but now since hunters don't have melee weapons I will put crusader on them if I ever decide to lvl another rogue.

    Also, will crusader proc for monks since they really don't attack with them? or is that just a cosmetic thing? I haven't really tried a monk yet :P
    Why is there no "Demonhunter" hero class yet? He was only the coolest hero in WC3. Get busy Blizzard.

  9. #29
    It's a cosmetic thing. I mean weapon enchants proc for druids in forms too.

  10. #30
    http://www.wowhead.com/spell=86104/l...specialization and the other specs were added in the pre-cata patch. WotLK warriors and paladins make no sense to mention in this context... it's unrelated to the post you quoted, which was talking about agility wearers using strength gear post-wrath and tanks wearing agility for dodge.

    The second part you mention is also misappropriated. Bears did have a 1->2 strength->AP conversion, but they, like rogues still get 1 AP per strength... which leaves me wondering what you could possibly be talking about, or why you brought that up.

    Please make sure you're referencing things properly and check enough of your facts not to derail a thread when posting.

    On topic: between the three mentioned enchants, each has an advantage. I'm not sure how fiery/agi/crusader match up either in predictable burst or long-term DPS, but I can outline a few reasons not mentioned: at low levels, 30 gear-based agility can have a large impact on crit/dodge, if getting attacked back is a concern. Count in the 30% boost from sub, and 39 agility is a static 78 AP (unbuffed) and variable dodge/crit by level (HUGE <10, lower as it increases). Fiery should be the most "stable", and crusader, stocking in at a 75 heal and 100 AP when active, would be the most "surprise burst" if my recollections are accurate. Against crusader and pvp: it won't be active when you first ambush.
    Last edited by Kael; 2013-01-23 at 11:13 PM.

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