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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Dumbfoundead View Post
    Considering Tiger Palm hits for what BoK does for half the Chi cost you won't be using it single target at all.
    Serpent's Zeal.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by youngosk View Post
    If Serpent' Zeals has nothing to do with eminence shouldn't there be a "Serpent's Zeal" on my recount? The only dps healing is Eminence, which is getting nerfed.

    So my whites will be healing less then they do now (Assuming Serpent's Zeal is effected be Eminence), and my yellows will heal about the same amount with the damage buff/Eminence nerf. That's a healing nerf, only slight but still a nerf.

    I know the wording on Teachings of the Monastery doesn't mention Eminence, but there is no Serpent's Zeal on my recount.
    Largest fail post in this thread.

    Serpent's Zeal is from auto attack damage which adds healing TO eminence, while eminence itself is what your non-white damage heals for. They are two separate abilities but they both add healing to the umbrella ability called "Eminence," as far as recount is concerned.

    How do so many people not understand how eminence works but are super quick to come post on here like they do?

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-28 at 10:11 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by the9tail View Post
    On live I usually add 3% damage to any boss. Like others have said, the mana issue is the biggest issue - but I think a secondary issue is lack of buttons.

    At the moment on live you "have" to spec Chi Wave as it does more damage than any ability, so your rotation circles its cooldown and I think mistweavers need their own version of Rising Tiger Kick to fit into this space.

    Secondly I question the cleaving version of Blackout kick. We lose healing and the increase in damage is for this ability is on the cleave - but most bosses this cleave healing wont happen due to lack of adds so it will be healing nerf.

    Lastly, need a way to heal while running to a boss on the pull. We dont have flying serpent kick which would help that, especially if the aoe at the end was a good healer.
    You do realize that's the entire point of the change to Blackout Kick? It's becoming an AOE-ability. To maximize dps/hps while aoeing, you'll want to use Blackout Kick if 4+ targets are present. If not, Tiger Palm edges out at higher dps/hps.

    But you will ALWAYS use Blackout Kick to gain your two stacks of Serpent's Zeal, even in single target. Past those two stacks, on single target fights, you will be Tiger Palming, which is NO DIFFERENT than what you currently should be doing as a Fistweaver on live anyway.

  3. #43
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    I'd say the actual conversion may need a bit of a buff, but it will never be totally viable as long as it can't AOE.
    Unsubscribed as of 03/10/2014.

    If you dislike where WoW is headed in your mind, quit. Really. Sitting around complaining about "promises" that may or may not have been made isn't doing anything to help your cause. It's just making you look more and more like the constantly complaining and perpetually offended.

  4. #44
    This feels a lot more like it'll fill in the spot healing that we don't really have outside of soothing mists. Even that is a bit off because it still takes time to tick while this is done over GCDs. Its not so much a thing to fill in your aoe rotation (jab, jab, uplift will still probably hold this), but just to continue doing a small amount of spot healing when raid damage isn't bad. This can also translate to tank healing during non burst phases.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by ccKep View Post
    Serpent's Zeal.
    Well yeah, obvious exception.

  6. #46
    honestly did fist weavers need a dps boost lol? i always felt like my dps was insanely high already as a healer ....

    and how come they dont address the mana issues =(

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Divineknight13 View Post
    honestly did fist weavers need a dps boost lol? i always felt like my dps was insanely high already as a healer ....

    and how come they dont address the mana issues =(
    our dps was not even close to what disc priests were pulling, thus the boost.

    i dont see any mana problems, manage it better i guess?

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by todzilla85 View Post
    our dps was not even close to what disc priests were pulling, thus the boost.

    i dont see any mana problems, manage it better i guess?
    What's next, paladins begging for a denounce buff? :P

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by todzilla85 View Post
    our dps was not even close to what disc priests were pulling, thus the boost.

    i dont see any mana problems, manage it better i guess?
    I can quite easily do around 40k dps without Xuen, that's pretty close.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Boem View Post
    What's next, paladins begging for a denounce buff? :P
    I think paladins SHOULD be among the 'dps healers.' A paladin that stands in the back and doesn't swing his weapon is just a priest in plate armor.

  11. #51
    I think pretty much all healers should have damage built into them, the only two that don't have really effective sources of it though are paladins and shamans. Though personally the heal through damage thing should be kept to a minimum imho.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Dumbfoundead View Post
    I think pretty much all healers should have damage built into them, the only two that don't have really effective sources of it though are paladins and shamans. Though personally the heal through damage thing should be kept to a minimum imho.
    To be fair though in the shamans case they've had that in previous expansions and to top it off on occasion it was quite litterally overpowered (madness heroic, infinite mana says hi)

    In paladin's case wasnt denounce and holy shock nerfed cuz of the low level stuff? I just remember how op it was when i multibox lvled paladins through random dungeons, tanking and healing and doing all the damage at the same time, as holy

    I agree though that all healers should be able to put out some sort of dps/damage when there is "no need" to heal. But in other ways I think this is a problem and could be fixed by just tuning the encounters better towards making sure healers always have something to do other than do nothing or "dps". So many times in WoW some class/spec gets something unique may it be a buff they provide or a tool that eventually everyone will cry for it and Blizzard gives in and suddenly that thing is standard and not of interest.

    So in turn I think it's best to leave damage dealing as a niche in expense of utility that's not the case right now however when you look at priests.

  13. #53
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Just did some testing on the PTR and SZ appears to have been nerfed with Eminence, despite the tooltip not being updated.

    Seeing 12k-13k white hits heal for 3k-4k (no statue) with 2 stacks of Serpent's Zeal, which is about what I'd expect for 25% conversion with the +20% healing applied from Serpent Stance.

    Side note: It appears as though cleaving with BoK will immediately apply 2 stacks of Serpent's Zeal.

  14. #54
    Been noticed ages ago, been messaging ghostcrawler about it on twitter but he's being a wanker and not answering

  15. #55
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dumbfoundead View Post
    I think pretty much all healers should have damage built into them, the only two that don't have really effective sources of it though are paladins and shamans. Though personally the heal through damage thing should be kept to a minimum imho.
    If I have to be in melee range in danger I should atleast reap some benefits from it.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  16. #56
    When is melee range ever more dangerous than ranged? Honestly...

  17. #57
    Warchief DirewolfX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dumbfoundead View Post
    I think pretty much all healers should have damage built into them, the only two that don't have really effective sources of it though are paladins and shamans. Though personally the heal through damage thing should be kept to a minimum imho.
    I think they should all have healing through damage built in, but healing through damage should be always be inferior maximum healing throughput to casting pure healing spells.

    This solves a bunch of problems:
    1. Healers can quest easier in heal spec.
    2. Instead of being sat for progression when there's a tight DPS check, healers can transition to more DPS during the easier healing parts of the encounter and still be ready to push out serious healing during spike phases (like the reverse of using a hybrid spec healing cooldown).
    3. Don't get bored on farm content. =D

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-30 at 09:54 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Dumbfoundead View Post
    When is melee range ever more dangerous than ranged? Honestly...
    When that one stupid holy paladin stands in melee range during a Wind Step/<insert ranged targeting aoe mechanic here>...

  18. #58
    So now Tiger Palm will regenerate 1% mana. Interesting.

    Seems Blizzard is trying to enforce people their way the class should work, because nerfing again jab to get a mana back with tiger palm is kind of taking from one side to give by the other.
    Karuzo, mistweaver monk | Macphisto, discipline priest
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  19. #59
    It's not really, it's just further enforcing the whole we want you to be dedicated towards fistweaving thing. It does inadvertantly potentially add 750 MP5 to Power Strikes and 667 MP5 to Chi Brew though.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Spotnick View Post
    So now Tiger Palm will regenerate 1% mana. Interesting.

    Seems Blizzard is trying to enforce people their way the class should work, because nerfing again jab to get a mana back with tiger palm is kind of taking from one side to give by the other.
    It's to punish using Jab for things that aren't Fistweaving. Since the talented Chi abilities no longer cost Chi, the only thing this really hurts is Jab/Jab/Uplift and any time you would use BoK instead of Tiger Palm. It's actually kind of sad when you think about it, the removal of Chi Wave/Burst from the Chi-spending pool actually left us with very few abilities that cost Chi. This is just a way of keeping straight Fistweaving at the same cost it is on live while discouraging its use for Uplift.

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