Page 13 of 16 FirstFirst ...
3
11
12
13
14
15
... LastLast
  1. #241
    Pit Lord Ravenblade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Germany - Thuringia
    Posts
    2,395
    In my opinion Diablo series does not cater any longer to the same crowd as Diablo 2 did which is why it earned the scorn of many - it's a Diablo for WoW fans and it seems to have been designed that way to the point that these both games actually are sharing design paradigms. PoE is the whole opposite of D3 in that its audience is that one which played Diablo 2 for competitive and - as has been said: for hardcore reasons. TL2 is really in the middle. People should be happy that there is a choice and no definitive best game. I backed PoE up to Gold level and also contributed at maximum level for upcoming Grim Dawn.
    I personally - in retrospect anyway and despite me trying to play down its issues initially as well - do not count D3 as a milestone in gaming history in its current condition. Whatever technologies it promoted they didn't undo its game design pitfalls. For that matter technologies never really saved a game and using these as proof in the same way as sales shows that some people don't understand that games are not gadgets. You can't solely advertise used technologies in a game in order to promote its qualities!

    Also in my opinion the game tried to cure too many evils at once but without adding many good gameplay-related things as compensation. They created a corset which they can hardly break out of so they are left thumping at their sales numbers (basically that D3 sold as much units as Assassin's Creed III) and botox'ing up their game until they fix it all in one expansion. Which would be within Blizzard's traditional canon anyway: Release the original game, fix the core issues which people were disappointed about in an expansion.
    Last edited by Ravenblade; 2013-02-08 at 10:52 AM.
    WoW: Crowcloak (Druid) @ Sylvanas EU (retired)
    GW2: Siqqa (Asura Engineer) @ Piken Square EU - When I'm playing WvW I'm really playing LSD.

    My Deus Ex:HR soundtrack mixes [FLAC version (3.5 GB)]

  2. #242
    if only the stuff they have release in all the patches so far and the upcoming 1.0.7 were in at live.. it would be the best game out

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by Redblade View Post
    Sadly due to Blizzard's player base overall a lot of their designs and arguments for them are being treated as gospel and carried over to other games, in the end affecting the whole market.
    If something works, why change it? From a business pov it's a bad move. If i have to be really REALLY honest, the best game i have played recently is darksiders/darksiders2. Maybe not much innovative and very simple in design, but the story and characters are just awesome (Madureira just rules). A pearl lost in the ocean of vastly publicized games. And now Vigil games is dead with THQ (and it seems no one is going after the project even if it's REALLY a good one).

    Now it's all about bestsellers and big numbers - no one makes games for small niches, making the market more various; it's all about taking the working formula and rehash it in a new dress so people is lured to buy the game and then when they see it's the same of the old ones leave.

    A someway good thing wwith Blizzard is that make long-term plans, their games are made to last (at least).


    Quote Originally Posted by Redblade View Post
    Fair enough, don't mind me much I just sized the opportunity to rant a bit. :P
    Everyone wants to rant I'm just trying to be as much objective as possible (but the AH crap just drives me mad - to me it's thw worst thing ever happned for diablo)

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post

    Everyone wants to rant I'm just trying to be as much objective as possible (but the AH crap just drives me mad - to me it's thw worst thing ever happned for diablo)
    Many people felt the same and migrated from D3 to PoE with one of the reasons being the AH. Guess what? ... numerous threads are emerging asking for some type of AH
    Its ironic .. one values something only when it is missing.
    by Aurust :
    Although i havent played it, there is I believe enough info to form a valid opinion.
    To give my opinion on the new WOW xpac..... Ive played enough wow to know MOP is a complete disaster..... I visualized playing it in my head and it was bad.

  5. #245
    It's fun to bitch about popular things. It makes you look like your standards are higher than your lowly fellow man.

    Being happy with what you have in general is seen increasingly as a sign of weakness. It's pretty disgusting how bitter our society is becoming.

  6. #246
    Moderator Pendulous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Treno
    Posts
    12,325
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    If something works, why change it?
    Diablo 2 wasn't 100% holy grail of video games. It had its issues, and other games aren't smart enough apparently to leave that bad stuff out. You should never see an ARPG ever again that has you competing to click on gear with your party members, but you do. In that regard, Diablo 3 did do some things right. That, and not making certain classes/specs useless at 60. Now, don't get me wrong, you're still pigeonholed into a couple specs for each class, but what I'm meaning is how, in Diablo 2, every creature was immune to a certain element (or physical damage), so a, say, fire sorceress would be screwed. Auto-gold pickup, but even then when they do something right they do it wrong. Pickup radius is terrible, and without any on my gear I find myself doubling back over gold stacks multiples times to pick it up. Tha main boss fights are hard enough to feel like bosses, but not ungodly hard enough to make you not want to kill them ever again after you do it the first time. In that regard, I think it's one thing they "took" from WoW that they got right. The mechanics of bosses (notably Belial) seem to stem from MMO-style boss fights, and it works ok.

    All that said though, the rest of the major stuff is terribly implemented, and the staff has decided that community communication is something they choose not to give a crap about. It took two weeks for them to acknowledge the auction house issues, and after their scheduled "auction house fix maintenance" that didn't do anything, there has been no "oops" post anywhere either. Making the game nigh unplayable for a lot of people does not make for very good reputation.

    General Off-topic/Fun Stuff/Diablo 3/Sports & Fitness mod(rules)------KUPO --------Sig by Elyssia------- Say hello to a world of marigolds

  7. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by Letsbefair View Post
    Many people felt the same and migrated from D3 to PoE with one of the reasons being the AH. Guess what? ... numerous threads are emerging asking for some type of AH
    Its ironic .. one values something only when it is missing.
    I'm not using ah and ejoyng D3 as it is - though it could have been a much better game. I am in PoE beta for a long time but still it doesn't give me "that" feeling, don't think i would be playing it anytime extensively. It's a very solid game anyway, i suggest to try it at least.

  8. #248
    Fluffy Kitten Azuri's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    4,489
    Quote Originally Posted by Letsbefair View Post
    Many people felt the same and migrated from D3 to PoE with one of the reasons being the AH. Guess what? ... numerous threads are emerging asking for some type of AH
    Its ironic .. one values something only when it is missing.
    I hope PoE never gets an AH they've done a great job with the core design of crafting gear etc. AH is one of the key reason's D3 had little longevity for me. Staring at the AH for gear upgrades to progress in a ARPG is so wrong.

    Most people asking for an AH in PoE from what I read have only played D3 and most likely will quit the game and migrate back to D3 I doubt these Indie devs will cave they made their vision clear on their game design. They made no plans for an AH and doubt they will. You either like their system or go back to D3.

    They have a clear path they wanted for the game which was closer to D2. If they mirrored D3 then you would hear people scream "D3 clone"

    PoE and D3 are of the same genere but are built for different type of gamers and should be viewed as such. Play the one you enjoy most and stay away from trying to force one or the other to mimic each other. I'd say the people that were bitching about D3 are slowly disappearing from this D3 sub-forum and we know who they are, why you ask? They found what they were looking for in PoE. It's win/win for both camps now.
    Last edited by Azuri; 2013-02-08 at 01:56 PM. Reason: typo
    • PSN ID: Azuri118 •

  9. #249
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Tír na nÓg
    Posts
    12,850
    Quote Originally Posted by Azuri View Post
    Most people asking for an AH in PoE from what I read have only played D3 and most likely will quit the game and migrate back to D3 I doubt these Indie devs will cave they made their vision clear on their game design. They made no plans for an AH and doubt they will. You either like their system or go back to D3
    Exactly. It's people who didn't play D2, haven't played other ARPGs, or really just want a different style of MMO out of a game that isn't one. They have heard about PoE because it's buzzing and it's free.

    I wouldn't put any major stock in people who were looking at PoE as their alternative being the same people asking for an AH.
    BAD WOLF

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    snip
    My point wasn't about D2 being perfect (actually i agree with what you've said) it was mostly about the totality of new games which basically are carbon copies of each other and people keep buying them because they are in fact the same game over and over, leaving a very small space for innovation.

    Back on topic, and on D3, imho AH was just something players craved for because they just looked for the fast way out (like in D2 was duping and biying items). Making it a core part of the game was the worst choice.

    It has taken out a lot of time and efforts from the real game developement. And i agree that while D3 it's not a complete garbage, there have been some core choices that cannot be solved with any patch. Example, itemization based on a few core stats making the great majority of items trash.

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    If something works, why change it? From a business pov it's a bad move. If i have to be really REALLY honest, the best game i have played recently is darksiders/darksiders2. Maybe not much innovative and very simple in design, but the story and characters are just awesome (Madureira just rules). A pearl lost in the ocean of vastly publicized games. And now Vigil games is dead with THQ (and it seems no one is going after the project even if it's REALLY a good one).

    Now it's all about bestsellers and big numbers - no one makes games for small niches, making the market more various; it's all about taking the working formula and rehash it in a new dress so people is lured to buy the game and then when they see it's the same of the old ones leave.

    A someway good thing wwith Blizzard is that make long-term plans, their games are made to last (at least).
    I'd say that's a part of the problem here though, they did try to change the working concept of D2 to cater to the general masses. While that works from a business perspective now, I see Blizzard as a company distancing them self more and more from the dedicated/hardcore/oldschool gamer, in the end shafting that group to a point where they never will go back to their games. Perhaps that's fine from their perspective but from mine as a gamer it's horrible not just to me but the the industry as a whole due to the impact they have through the popularity within the casual masses.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    Everyone wants to rant I'm just trying to be as much objective as possible (but the AH crap just drives me mad - to me it's thw worst thing ever happned for diablo)
    Don't get me wrong, I know how the reality of it is but I prefer to see and discuss things from the users end over the business end, a mindset I wish more game consumers would adapt to instead of defending big developers making bad products with "but they are a business and need to make money". Don't think most people know how lucrative the gaming industry really is, something that contributes to that mindset, but still the mind boggles as the very same people wouldn't give a rats ass if any other company they interact with makes a profit or not.
    Active PoE: @MajorAsshole EvE: Redblade (Reikoku)
    Inactive D3: Armory Rift: Alyssaa @ Icewatch SWTOR: Redblade @ ToFN WoW: My graveyard of characters.
    People just do the strangest things when they believe they're entitled. But they do even stranger things when they just plain believe. - Kevin Smith

  12. #252
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Tír na nÓg
    Posts
    12,850
    Quote Originally Posted by Redblade View Post
    IDon't get me wrong, I know how the reality of it is but I prefer to see and discuss things from the users end over the business end, a mindset I wish more game consumers would adapt to instead of defending big developers making bad products with "but they are a business and need to make money". Don't think most people know how lucrative the gaming industry really is, something that contributes to that mindset, but still the mind boggles as the very same people wouldn't give a rats ass if any other company they interact with makes a profit or not.
    I don't get this mentality either. We certainly don't applaud tire makers for using cheaper materials to save costs and make more money...or any other business outside of video games. Oh hey, my internet is really slow b/c they used cables from the stone age, but that's ok b/c they are making more money! Sure I pay the same as everyone else, but I'm supporting such a swell company.

    It's literally mind boggling and makes no sense. It's like these people are brainwashed. SWTOR White knights are a perfect example of just how thoroughly someone will defend a company that is blatantly bending them over, curb stomping them after they're finished, and then takes their wallet before walking away.
    BAD WOLF

  13. #253
    Quote Originally Posted by Redblade View Post
    I'd say that's a part of the problem here though, they did try to change the working concept of D2 to cater to the general masses. While that works from a business perspective now, I see Blizzard as a company distancing them self more and more from the dedicated/hardcore/oldschool gamer, in the end shafting that group to a point where they never will go back to their games. Perhaps that's fine from their perspective but from mine as a gamer it's horrible not just to me but the the industry as a whole due to the impact they have through the popularity within the casual masses.
    I know, and it's a problem for sure. When games were something for "nerds" and generically "losers", the contact with the playerbase was much easier - like it would be an university course for a professor with a class of 15 students instead with a class of 300.

    I was about to write more abouth this, but i ended with a so long wall of text it isn't even fun. So TL;DR: they could make a game aimed to the most hardcore part but it's simply not worth the effort (for them). It's kinda sad.

    D2 concept was good and i think they have made a good work innovating the game. The graphics are cool in D3, i like the "painting atmosphere". there are a lot of good things in the game (for me), otherwise i wouldn't return and play it again every some time.

    As an old-time gamer, i see how this is bad for our "category".

    EDIT: i'm saying that the "we need to make money part" is becoming more and more important, impacting the quality of the products we receive. While i recognize that Blizzard is first a company and they need to make money to survive, i also understand how this is becoming the synonim of more mediocre games for the mediocre player.
    Last edited by Coldkil; 2013-02-08 at 02:44 PM.

  14. #254
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldkil View Post
    EDIT: i'm saying that the "we need to make money part" is becoming more and more important, impacting the quality of the products we receive. While i recognize that Blizzard is first a company and they need to make money to survive, i also understand how this is becoming the synonim of more mediocre games for the mediocre player.
    Yeah I think we agree for the most part, sadly in todays society making money to survive has a whole new meaning compared to the literal one, that's whole other discussion though. :P
    Active PoE: @MajorAsshole EvE: Redblade (Reikoku)
    Inactive D3: Armory Rift: Alyssaa @ Icewatch SWTOR: Redblade @ ToFN WoW: My graveyard of characters.
    People just do the strangest things when they believe they're entitled. But they do even stranger things when they just plain believe. - Kevin Smith

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    Diablo 2 wasn't 100% holy grail of video games.
    It's definitely not but it came pretty close.

  16. #256
    See here's the thing I honestly don't think they changed the basic game play all that much. The biggest innovation in the game is arguably the AH but that's not really a core game play innovation. It's still pretty much you click click click and press 1 or 2 occasionally. Other games are trying to add more to it. That lineage game is adding some neat stuff. D3 felt dated without having at least the charm of being true retro. I actually think that's the root of the problem with Diablo and Blizzard and really gaming overall in general. They're still making games based on like 10-15 year old models. In some cases like direct sequels that aren't really brought up to snuff. I get that people want the classics, and I think alot of the hate comes from the fact that it wasn't classic enough but by the same token if I had to say why the majority of people left the game I would put money on it being because the game play is really dated at this point.
    Last edited by Leonard McCoy; 2013-02-08 at 04:23 PM.

  17. #257
    I was thinking about the very tittle of this thread and what D3 means to me.

    I was totally sold about the idea of it being really hard and idd it was.
    I completed the game at around week 3 with a DH and i can not forget what i felt after killing some of the bosses in Inferno. I was shacking when i beated them and the enjoyment was great after that. I only had similar experiences with WoW when we killed bosses like Vash, Kael , Muru. KJ , Yogg +0, Mimiron , Rag etc..

    At this point the experience i had with the D3 and the money i paid for was right on pair.

    The game didnt finished for me there. The farming started to get the top gear and for it one had to enter the AH market : sell what u dont need to buy what u want.

    Playing the AH market was also a great fun for me since i loved it too on WoW. Who from you doesnt like to see the stuff u find getting sold when u log into the game? Specially the expensive stuff. Its also a good feeling and an extra incentive besides the gear farming.

    Then the RMAH was online... and this was the best experience and the most fun i had with a game. Seeing stuff getting sold for the very max and even for low amounts was an enjoyment i never think i could get from a game.
    I bought so many thing with that money and it all came from a game. I was simultaneously supporting a game with my trades and also getting money. The best of both worlds.

    I dont dare to say the hours i have played on D3.
    I played the game the way it was given to me, with its rules and adapted to every change it took. I didnt played it with my ideals and expectations.
    Yes the itemization is still bad. Still not PvP modes that are atractive and a series of other issues.
    The one im most concerned is that the game made so much money and i have the feeling that much isnt being thrown back to the game and D3 could be much better then it is since its obvious the potencial it has. But still looking back and balancing all the stuff D3 is still the best gaming experience in my recent gaming history.

    To understand why all the hate it has i would have to know what was everyones expectations. Maybe they didnt found what they were looking for or didnt wanted to play by the games rules. Some things werent also to my likeing but i still chose to play it and after so many hours on it and with many great experiences i dont have the right to hate it. That would be selfish.
    Last edited by Letsbefair; 2013-02-08 at 05:10 PM.
    by Aurust :
    Although i havent played it, there is I believe enough info to form a valid opinion.
    To give my opinion on the new WOW xpac..... Ive played enough wow to know MOP is a complete disaster..... I visualized playing it in my head and it was bad.

  18. #258
    Pit Lord philefluxx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Silicon Highway
    Posts
    2,303
    What I dont get is Blizzard boasts numbers on a game that has no sub which in this market is a selling point no matter what and the fact that it was riding on its extremely successful predecessors coat tails.

    Im sure D3 is a better game now than it was a launch, but the game itself is not what sold those copies. Blizzard needs to get off it...

  19. #259
    Quote Originally Posted by philefluxx View Post
    What I dont get is Blizzard boasts numbers on a game that has no sub which in this market is a selling point no matter what and the fact that it was riding on its extremely successful predecessors coat tails.

    Im sure D3 is a better game now than it was a launch, but the game itself is not what sold those copies. Blizzard needs to get off it...
    When they posted the D3 sales so far they were giving a message.
    Imo they are saying that D3 sold +-4M copies at launch day and every month up until now the game kept selling and selling even when "all the internet" was saying it was the flop of the year and yet here they are at 12M copies sold after 8 months.

    Thats how i interpret it.

    P.S - Dont bother typing something like "more then half of those are bots".
    Last edited by Letsbefair; 2013-02-08 at 06:53 PM.
    by Aurust :
    Although i havent played it, there is I believe enough info to form a valid opinion.
    To give my opinion on the new WOW xpac..... Ive played enough wow to know MOP is a complete disaster..... I visualized playing it in my head and it was bad.

  20. #260
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Tír na nÓg
    Posts
    12,850
    Quote Originally Posted by Letsbefair View Post
    P.S - Dont bother typing something like "more then half of those are bots".
    I have a theory more than 55% of those are bots.

    Also, I have have a theory it could be bunnies.
    BAD WOLF

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •