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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Funny that, because Chiropractic is basically as effective as Acuputure. As in, not very.

    Good that it worked for you, but you took a big fat placebo.
    Uh yes, ok. If that's what you want to believe you can I'm not going to try and force my opinion down your throat. Don't do the same to me

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nasriel View Post
    Uh yes, ok. If that's what you want to believe you can I'm not going to try and force my opinion down your throat. Don't do the same to me
    It's not a question of belief, it's a question of scientific validity.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Arnorei View Post

    Not really, it counts by what you belive. If you have a cold and I say I will give you the wonder medicine, there's a high chance it will work. But if I say to you I am going to give you a chocolate cookie and this should cure you... it will not. Because you don't expect a chocolate cookie to heal you because you know a chocolate cookie can't heal colds.
    My roommate wanted to fall asleep. I gave him benadryl (Diphenhydramine HCl, first used for allergies such as itching with the side effect of drowsiness). Benadryl basically makes your body overwork itself, hence the drowsiness. He was skeptical and was wide awake hours and hours later.

    I have an allergy medicine that comes in two forms, two different pills with the same ingredient/strength. They work the same for me. He tried one and said it didn't really work, I told him I had something a bit stronger when i'm feeling overwhelmed and he attested that it worked much better for him.

    He also does the same thing with name brand and store brand acid reflex medicine. Same active ingredients, yet one works and one doesn't for him, because he believes one will and one won't. For all I know its the placebo effect working in both directions.

    On-topic: I know a few people who have received acupuncture, and with someone else in this thread its a smorgasbord of reviews in every direction.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 01:47 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Funny that, because Chiropractic is basically as effective as Acuputure. As in, not very.

    Good that it worked for you, but you took a big fat placebo.
    Chiropractic is referred to as not very effective? I have heard by many it works wonders, but along with acupuncture its all rather anecdotal. I figured it had at least some basis in moving the muscles/joints in a way similar to massaging (albeit usually less relaxing). This also makes me wonder about massages.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grokan View Post
    I want to know what kind of doctor recommends pseudoscience.
    Its not really pseudo science. Sure it doesnt do what they actually claim but acupuncture has been proven to have pain relieving properties due to the adenosin getting released from the needles puncturing. The needles makes it a very localized area so ideal for regional pains. Though it doesn't last for long it can be coupled with other treatment.

    To stimulate appetite its bullshit.
    Last edited by Catta; 2013-01-27 at 02:01 PM. Reason: wrong chemical

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gande View Post
    Chiropractic is referred to as not very effective? I have heard by many it works wonders, but along with acupuncture its all rather anecdotal. I figured it had at least some basis in moving the muscles/joints in a way similar to massaging (albeit usually less relaxing). This also makes me wonder about massages.
    It increases bloodflow to the joints. That's all.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 05:58 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Cattaclysmic View Post
    Its not really pseudo science. Sure it doesnt do what they actually claim but acupuncture has been proven to have pain relieving properties due to the endorphin getting released from the needles puncturing. The needles makes it a very localized area so ideal for regional pains. Though it doesn't last for long it can be coupled with other treatment.

    To stimulate appetite its bullshit.
    "Proven"? A correlation has been demonstrated.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    It increases bloodflow to the joints. That's all.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 05:58 AM ----------



    "Proven"? A correlation has been demonstrated.
    Just like a cutter gets a chemical release from cutting the wrists...

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cattaclysmic View Post
    Just like a cutter gets a chemical release from cutting the wrists...
    Well, that's a very encouraging sales pitch for acupuncturists.
    Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.
    - Thucydides

    There is a modern myth that people have always tended towards democracy, constitutions, electoral rights; but in truth, love of freedom has never been the predominant note of popular politics. At most times, popular demand has been for a strong government.
    - Eugen Weber

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Well, that's a very encouraging sales pitch for acupuncturists.
    Well all im saying is that its not really that far off. Its making the body release chemicals by puncturing/cutting.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cattaclysmic View Post
    Its not really pseudo science. Sure it doesnt do what they actually claim but acupuncture has been proven to have pain relieving properties due to the adenosin getting released from the needles puncturing. The needles makes it a very localized area so ideal for regional pains. Though it doesn't last for long it can be coupled with other treatment.
    Well, yeah. It's the same reason I bang my head against the wall when I have bad migraine. If I break a finger, that'll hurt like hell. But if I break a leg afterwards, my finger won't hurt so much anymore.
    I really like christmas. It's sentimental, I know... But I just really like it.

  10. #110
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    Does anyone have an actual study of acupuncture?

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themius View Post
    Does anyone have an actual study of acupuncture?
    http://archinte.jamanetwork.com/arti...513#qundefined
    http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD0032...w-side-effects
    http://images.dieutridau.com/thongti...re-does-it.pdf
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2769056/
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...29FF969.d04t01

    TL;DR: Acupuncture can relieve chronic pain, postoperative nausea and vomiting, but it is highly variable. My guess is that it works mainly through placebo and relieving of pain through other types of pain(like how people can resort to cutting themselves to relieve emotional pain).

    Tbh, I'd rather slam my hand in a door than let someone stick a bunch of needles in me.
    I really like christmas. It's sentimental, I know... But I just really like it.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzalix View Post
    Well, yeah. It's the same reason I bang my head against the wall when I have bad migraine. If I break a finger, that'll hurt like hell. But if I break a leg afterwards, my finger won't hurt so much anymore.
    The good thing with acupuncture being that they aren't many detrimental side effects i can think off barring someone who doesn't clean the needles.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 04:24 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Tzalix View Post
    http://archinte.jamanetwork.com/arti...513#qundefined
    http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD0032...w-side-effects
    http://images.dieutridau.com/thongti...re-does-it.pdf
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2769056/
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...29FF969.d04t01

    TL;DR: Acupuncture can relieve chronic pain, postoperative nausea and vomiting, but it is highly variable. My guess is that it works mainly through placebo and relieving of pain through other types of pain(like how people can resort to cutting themselves to relieve emotional pain).

    Tbh, I'd rather slam my hand in a door than let someone stick a bunch of needles in me.
    Those who cut themselves do not only relieve emotional pain. A chemical pain relief happens as well.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cattaclysmic View Post
    Those who cut themselves do not only relieve emotional pain. A chemical pain relief happens as well.
    Yes, but the primary intent is usually to relieve emotional pain.
    I really like christmas. It's sentimental, I know... But I just really like it.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nasriel View Post
    Uh yes, ok. If that's what you want to believe you can I'm not going to try and force my opinion down your throat. Don't do the same to me
    Chiropracty is dangerous also, its based on no scientific principle, its not regulated or controlled, you are essentially letting some amateur mess around with your spine.

    Some studies show overr 50% of patients using chiropractors end up feeling worse than before the treatment, and a significant proportion end up with quantifiable adverse side effects, sometimes quite serious.

    Steer clear of quacks, of which all chiropractors, acupunturists and homeopathy practioners fall into the category, and go to property medical professionals.

    If you have problems that need medical attention go to a doctor and ask for a referral to a qualified physiotherapist.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-27 at 08:25 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Gande View Post
    Chiropractic is referred to as not very effective? I have heard by many it works wonders, but along with acupuncture its all rather anecdotal. I figured it had at least some basis in moving the muscles/joints in a way similar to massaging (albeit usually less relaxing). This also makes me wonder about massages.


    It has absolutely zero basis in anything remotely scientific or medially proven. its pure quackery, and dangerous quackery at that. Do NOT let unqualified amatures mess around with your spine.
    No game will ever kill wow. Though Blizard themselves are making a pretty damm good attempt lately.

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  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tzalix View Post
    Yes, but the primary intent is usually to relieve emotional pain.
    Yes, and while those who use acupuncture expects magic to occur it doesn't change the fact that a chemical pain relief happens.

  16. #116
    The Lightbringer Whitey's Avatar
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    I have acupuncture treatments very frequently, due to my insurance company demanding them, but they haven't helped with my pains at all.
    Wouldn't call it bahumbug tho.
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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitey View Post
    I have acupuncture treatments very frequently, due to my insurance company demanding them, but they haven't helped with my pains at all.
    Wouldn't call it bahumbug tho.
    Your insurance company demands them? what kind of back ally brokers are you insured with?

    I am continually depressed about how things like acupuncture, chiropracty, and homeopathy are given legitimacy like this...
    No game will ever kill wow. Though Blizard themselves are making a pretty damm good attempt lately.

    THE FIRST RULE OF BRAWLERS GUILD IS YOU DO NOT GET INVITED TO BRAWLERS GUILD.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlacoatl View Post
    Your insurance company demands them? what kind of back ally brokers are you insured with?

    I am continually depressed about how things like acupuncture, chiropracty, and homeopathy are given legitimacy like this...
    Haha Only the biggest one in the country. Both my regular doctor and orthopedic doctor first suggested it to my insurance company, and then the insurance company told me to drag my ass in there. These are no butchers either, the orthopedic doc has treated some world class athletes successfully (f.ex. Beckham), one of the top of his field worldwide.
    As much as YOU think they're not legitimate treatments, there are medical professionals who disagree with you.
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  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitey View Post
    Haha Only the biggest one in the country. Both my regular doctor and orthopedic doctor first suggested it to my insurance company, and then the insurance company told me to drag my ass in there. These are no butchers either, the orthopedic doc has treated some world class athletes successfully (f.ex. Beckham), one of the top of his field worldwide.
    As much as YOU think they're not legitimate treatments, there are medical professionals who disagree with you.

    Its scientificv fact (well as much as any body of evidence can be termed a fact), that actupuncture is not effective, and is dangerous in same cases (right up to punctured lungs and infections from needles beign left in or snapping off). Any decent medical practioner should know that, and I'd lodge complaints against any doctor who recommended it and report them to the relevant professional body. At worst they are incompetent and believe it, at best they are fobbing you off with a placebo.
    No game will ever kill wow. Though Blizard themselves are making a pretty damm good attempt lately.

    THE FIRST RULE OF BRAWLERS GUILD IS YOU DO NOT GET INVITED TO BRAWLERS GUILD.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitey View Post
    As much as YOU think they're not legitimate treatments, there are medical professionals who disagree with you.
    Those which endorse or prescribe quackery shouldn't be allowed to practice.

    Qi, subluxations, humourism... what other baseless superstitions should we exalt without reason?

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