Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ...
2
3
4
5
LastLast
  1. #61
    Don't let this discussion become a flame-fest. Keep it cool people, personal jabs are unacceptable.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Jarg View Post
    Why? whats your problem with SR's cost/damage ratio? while i agree with the silence is way too powerful against us, GC said they like it so its not likely gonna be changed

    just for reference: SR hits for 50-60k while SS hits for 10k (same rune cost)
    Cost/damage ratio is fine in pve no doubt about that but for pvp it's not. The 5sec detonation delay makes it incredibly hard to land. Awesome when it lands for 60k+ (150k shadow + 20k physical highest arena crit 4 me *g*) but most of the time it runs out because the target is back above 35% health . :/
    Last edited by Spamor; 2013-02-04 at 10:16 AM.
    Pity Heal
    Unlimited range
    Channeled
    Baron Ashbury has pity on you, but only so he can continue inflicting pain! Heals all nearby enemies and allies for 5% health every 1 sec.
    Spellid 93705

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Kraeth View Post
    A blue post upon howling blast. HB is bound to be nerfed.
    That have happened before, we can go back really far in DK history and remember the 0/32/39 unholy DW with howling blast where you in crap gear literally could be #1 in dps in naxx for a few weeks before it got "adjusted"

    Unholy is certainly viable even as is, and this is coming from someone that has played unholy almost exclusively since release of wrath. And i personally wont play frost ever, hate the clonky feel of it. And 5.2 patch will give us QoL changes which are welcome and probably some increased dps numbers so should be a good patch,

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by araine View Post
    Unholy is certainly viable even as is, and this is coming from someone that has played unholy almost exclusively since release of wrath. And i personally wont play frost ever, hate the clonky feel of it. And 5.2 patch will give us QoL changes which are welcome and probably some increased dps numbers so should be a good patch,
    Agree'd, I think the only time I went Frost was for a bit twords the end of Firelands and then I switched back soon after anyways due to the fact I had played Unholy for so long, that I knew the rotation better and thus was able to do better dps with gear that was more attuned to Frost then Unholy. 5.2 is going to be an amazing patch for us, I know a lot of people won't understand how just small qol changes affect our dps, but they are going to be splendid to have.

  5. #65
    The Patient
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    right behind you
    Posts
    286
    Quote Originally Posted by Spamor View Post
    Cost/damage ratio is fine in pve no doubt about that but for pvp it's not. The 5sec detonation delay makes it incredibly hard to land. Awesome when it lands for 60k+ (150k shadow + 20k physical highest arena crit 4 me *g*) but most of the time it runs out because the target is back above 35% health . :/
    Ah, someone who understands! FINALLY! SR in pvp is a waste of a spell. And for UH, you will see your damage go way up, but your kills will go way down. So, basically, its a trade-off.

  6. #66
    Blademaster Aerdil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Somewhere in Russia О_о
    Posts
    26
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxweii View Post
    Agree'd, I think the only time I went Frost was for a bit twords the end of Firelands and then I switched back soon after anyways due to the fact I had played Unholy for so long, that I knew the rotation better and thus was able to do better dps with gear that was more attuned to Frost then Unholy. 5.2 is going to be an amazing patch for us, I know a lot of people won't understand how just small qol changes affect our dps, but they are going to be splendid to have.
    Yes, yes, those QoL changes can really greatly affect our dps, especially on fights with a lot of target switches. And yes, been playing unholy from WoTLK and even don't think about going frost :P

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Aerdil View Post
    Yes, yes, those QoL changes can really greatly affect our dps, especially on fights with a lot of target switches. And yes, been playing unholy from WoTLK and even don't think about going frost :P
    I wish the PS change was in already honestly, it would be so good on a fight like Tsu where you switch to the little adds and can quickly and easily pop on the diseases and blow em up quicker.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Spamor View Post
    Cost/damage ratio is fine in pve no doubt about that but for pvp it's not. The 5sec detonation delay makes it incredibly hard to land. Awesome when it lands for 60k+ (150k shadow + 20k physical highest arena crit 4 me *g*) but most of the time it runs out because the target is back above 35% health . :/
    First, I thought I read they are bumping it up to a 40% execute range?

    Second, now that SR is a guaranteed crit with Killing Machine, I think that's going to be a very powerful move. Toss in a Necrotic Strike to stall any HoTs and then wait for the bomb to off.

  9. #69
    Yea this will be fun

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Adrim View Post
    First, I thought I read they are bumping it up to a 40% execute range?

    Second, now that SR is a guaranteed crit with Killing Machine, I think that's going to be a very powerful move. Toss in a Necrotic Strike to stall any HoTs and then wait for the bomb to off.
    The 4 piece on the PvE tier 15 is guna be to extend the range of soul reaper to 45%, so while yes they are extending it you will be giving up your 4 set for pvp (and 2 set) to get this.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Adrim View Post
    First, I thought I read they are bumping it up to a 40% execute range?

    Second, now that SR is a guaranteed crit with Killing Machine, I think that's going to be a very powerful move. Toss in a Necrotic Strike to stall any HoTs and then wait for the bomb to off.


    That is the t15 4 piece bonus. Its 45% and works on KM. Its unlikely people will use 4 piece tier in arena but that doesn't make SR useless. SR always has the advantage of being able to be used before execute phase in order to do some great burst.

  12. #72
    The Patient
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    right behind you
    Posts
    286
    Quote Originally Posted by Nangz View Post
    That is the t15 4 piece bonus. Its 45% and works on KM. Its unlikely people will use 4 piece tier in arena but that doesn't make SR useless. SR always has the advantage of being able to be used before execute phase in order to do some great burst.
    You don't understand the mechanics of the dk in pvp, do you? PvP as a dk means you go 2H, which means your top damaging ability is obliterate. There is no way a dk with any semblance of skill in pvp will waste a frost rune on something that is goign to take 5 seconds to do damage. Its a waste of a frst rune that is needed for obliterare, which hits like a mack truck. using SR in pvp is not a viable option. I doubt it is viable for unholy either, as it does not proc reaping, and you need those death runes to span either necro or scourge strike. It may be a viable spell in pve, but I doubt it. If you compare the tooltips on the spell, the damage from obliterate is higher than SR, so why waste frost runes on it? Makes no sense to me, tbh. I don't pve much, but the in heroics I have done, SR hit like a wet noodle compared to OB.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by forwards1ca View Post
    You don't understand the mechanics of the dk in pvp, do you? PvP as a dk means you go 2H, which means your top damaging ability is obliterate. There is no way a dk with any semblance of skill in pvp will waste a frost rune on something that is goign to take 5 seconds to do damage. Its a waste of a frst rune that is needed for obliterare, which hits like a mack truck. using SR in pvp is not a viable option. I doubt it is viable for unholy either, as it does not proc reaping, and you need those death runes to span either necro or scourge strike. It may be a viable spell in pve, but I doubt it. If you compare the tooltips on the spell, the damage from obliterate is higher than SR, so why waste frost runes on it? Makes no sense to me, tbh. I don't pve much, but the in heroics I have done, SR hit like a wet noodle compared to OB.
    You don't understand the mechanics of the dk, do you?
    Necrotics and general damage with good SR timing can lead to overwhelming healers and therefore kills.

    You say SR doesn't proc reaping? Why pray tell does a ability that costs a Unholy Rune need to proc reaping?
    Is it a viable spell in any situation, of course it is. Hits for the same as a crit obliterate for half the cost, hits for the most amount of damage of any ability as unholy and as I mentioned above you can totally setup kills in pvp, large necro stacks can mean that burst of SR at 35% will kill sometimes.
    Compare tooltips you say? Surely you understand that tooltips update with your gear, so you might have a really good weapon for obliterate, but bad gear for the SR attack power scaling. How can you compare this?

    Many bad questions about frost and soul reaper going on in this thread, a thread that asks the question about unholy's viability, how is frost and SR talk relevant?

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Sinzaram View Post
    Many bad questions about frost and soul reaper going on in this thread, a thread that asks the question about unholy's viability, how is frost and SR talk relevant?
    Maybe because any discussion of unholy's viability would necessarily include discussion of it's competition? Like frost? And given that Unholy has a shadow-boosting mastery, SR talk is certainly relevant. It's not like I'm asking about Seal of Justice here.

    Also in regards to "trading" runes for SR instead of Oblit or something else...you can essentially hit someone with both SR and Oblit in the same GCD. That five-second delay doesn't give instant gratification true, but you can time an Oblit to hit just as SR goes off and really burst the target. Then the next GCD reapply SR and repeat. I can do this all day as Blood and that spec doesn't even have the flexibility of four perma-death runes.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by forwards1ca View Post
    You don't understand the mechanics of the dk in pvp, do you? PvP as a dk means you go 2H, which means your top damaging ability is obliterate. There is no way a dk with any semblance of skill in pvp will waste a frost rune on something that is goign to take 5 seconds to do damage. Its a waste of a frst rune that is needed for obliterare, which hits like a mack truck. using SR in pvp is not a viable option. I doubt it is viable for unholy either, as it does not proc reaping, and you need those death runes to span either necro or scourge strike. It may be a viable spell in pve, but I doubt it. If you compare the tooltips on the spell, the damage from obliterate is higher than SR, so why waste frost runes on it? Makes no sense to me, tbh. I don't pve much, but the in heroics I have done, SR hit like a wet noodle compared to OB.

    First off, theres no need to be hostile. My comment was specifically to the post that refers to using a pve tier bonus in pvp. It doesn't happen, especially not a 4 piece. Second, SR damage is TOTALLY worth using as 2h frost, especially in pvp. In pve it deals barely more than an obliterate but for half the rune cost. In pvp it should hit for just as hard ( when compared to obliterate) AND it ignores armor! What more could you want?

    SR costs an unholy runes and unholy runes have nothing to do with reaping. Below 35% (Or higher if you can time burst with the detonation), you just swap a SR for a scourge strike.

    You even question whether its viable in pve ( hint; its the highest damage per cast time ability for both unholy AND frost.)


    SR us worth using in all cases provided you get it to proc. It deals more damage in pve AND pvp due to it dealing magic damage, and this isn't even mentioning how you can use it on people with higher than 35% health, burst them low, and let the detonation finish them off.

    And it is fine to discuss frost in comparison to unholy in this thread. Its a valid point that because it is the alternative, it needs to be compared. However discussions about a pve tier bonus's effect on pvp is just silly.
    Last edited by Nangz; 2013-02-11 at 12:59 AM.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Nangz View Post
    First off, theres no need to be hostile. My comment was specifically to the post that refers to using a pve tier bonus in pvp. It doesn't happen, especially not a 4 piece. Second, SR damage is TOTALLY worth using as 2h frost, especially in pvp. In pve it deals barely more than an obliterate but for half the rune cost. In pvp it should hit for just as hard ( when compared to obliterate) AND it ignores armor! What more could you want?

    SR costs an unholy runes and unholy runes have nothing to do with reaping. Below 35% (Or higher if you can time burst with the detonation), you just swap a SR for a scourge strike.

    You even question whether its viable in pve ( hint; its the highest damage per cast time ability for both unholy AND frost.)


    SR us worth using in all cases provided you get it to proc. It deals more damage in pve AND pvp due to it dealing magic damage than either obliterate or scourge strike and this isn't even after discussing how you can use it on people with higher than 35% health, burst them low, and let the detonation finish them off.

    And it is fine to discuss frost in comparison to unholy in this thread. Its a valid point that because it is the alternative, it needs to be compared. However discussions about a pve tier bonus's effect on pvp is just silly.
    just gonna nitpick that SR costs a frost rune while in frost spec. but otherwise, yes. its more damage per rune spent than obliterate

  17. #77
    Dreadlord Miseration's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    San Tan Valley, AZ
    Posts
    808
    Quote Originally Posted by Nangz View Post
    Don't let this discussion become a flame-fest. Keep it cool people, personal jabs are unacceptable.
    AGREE. Also, I would like to see UH dks on the pve side of the battlefront. All I notice now is FROSTFROSTFROSTFROST. well, and blood.

  18. #78
    Nitpick rejected! I only mentioned unholy rune when talking about unholy spec! Also editing a brutally tired-induced runon sentence.

  19. #79
    counter-nitpick-point
    the only people who complain about SR are 2H frostknights (the scum, to complain about that when they get everything else for them *damn T14 2p*)
    so i inferred anything that looks like a complaint to be from frosts perspective =P

  20. #80
    counter-counter-nitpick!

    The post i quoted said you may not as unholy!

    this if fun

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •