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  1. #641
    As far as i'm concerned your only racist if you HATE people specifically for their race

    Judging people from statistics isnt racism, and being prejudice against certain people due to past experiences isnt racism either. As a kid if you get stung by a wasp you learn, same goes for people. its very human to look for patterns in behavior and 'judge books by their cover', which isnt even a bad thing, people portray how they want to be seen and should be judged by that.

    on another note, give individual people chances, if somebody from a race you tend to think negatively of talks to you, dont be rude, treat them as you would any other person. you might find you have alot in common with them, not everyone from a race is the same.

    judge people as people not as a race, but dont be ignorant of statistics.

  2. #642
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    As far as i'm concerned your only racist if you HATE people specifically for their race.
    I don't really get why you think you should invent your own definition of words. A good general operating definition comes from Wiki:

    Racism is usually defined as views, practices and actions reflecting the belief that humanity is divided into distinct biological groups called races and that members of a certain race share certain attributes which make that group as a whole less desirable, more desirable, inferior or superior.

  3. #643
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    I don't really get why you think you should invent your own definition of words. A good general operating definition comes from Wiki:
    Because it's a stupid summation?

  4. #644
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    Judging people from statistics isnt racism, and being prejudice against certain people due to past experiences isnt racism either. As a kid if you get stung by a wasp you learn, same goes for people. its very human to look for patterns in behavior and 'judge books by their cover', which isnt even a bad thing, people portray how they want to be seen and should be judged by that.

    on another note, give individual people chances, if somebody from a race you tend to think negatively of talks to you, dont be rude, treat them as you would any other person. you might find you have alot in common with them, not everyone from a race is the same.

    judge people as people not as a race, but dont be ignorant of statistics.
    This is a load of bollocks.
    To judge people from statistics isn't racist at all, no. To judge the behaviour of certain RACES because of certain statistics about certain SUBCULTURES is absolutely racist.
    To judge someone based on past experiences with someone else of the same race is understandable because of the wiring of the brain. It is also incredibly STUPID. It simply means you do not have the capacity for awareness of your own thought processes. It is also racist.

    You say we shouldn't be ignorant of statistics, and believe you me: I'm not ignorant of statistics. Nor of what they imply. But people aren't great staticians (not even staticians are great staticians), and the implications of statistics are easily misinterpreted. These misinterpretations are often favoured over scientific evidence.
    For instance:
    A survey shows that 40% of all crime in a certain (large) area is performed by smurfs. In that same (large) area, Smurfs make up only 35% of the total populace. Now; you could argue that this is clear evidence that smurfs are naturally inclined to crime. Now take a look at that same area. In 80% of that area, the amount of smurfs is about 10% when compared to snorks, the 'peaceful' people. However, in the remaining 20% of that area, which happens to be a single neighbourhood, the amount of smurfs is 90%, and snorks only make up 10% of the population.
    Generations back, smurfs were treated much differently. They were poor and uneducated. They banded together. Their children didn't get much of an incentive to get a good education, because smurfs were generally seen as inferior, and wouldn't get much of a job anyway. Evidence of this was seen by all smurfs, and they decided that there wasn't any point in bothering. Then a few smurfs thought: 'Well; if we can't get what we need the honest way, we'll go criminal!' Considering the poor state of smurfs, and the fact that they could clearly see the much privileged state of the snorks, this wasn't actually that bad an idea. It caught on. Soon, crime became a part of life. Competition became rampant, which ramped up violence. And now, people would avoid smurfs wherever they see them, and act much more favourably towards snorks. In fact, a lot of people are now believing that violence and crime are a part of smurf nature; that their race is inferior...

    Self-fulfilling prophecy. And while the statistics are right, that doesn't mean the statistics have a conclusion as to the cause of those numbers. That's not up to statistics.

  5. #645
    Bloodsail Admiral Giants41's Avatar
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    Because your judging people you don't know. I judge people but only after i have met them. Nothing really to do with skin color.
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  6. #646
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    I've done the forums things before on other sites and usually somewhere along the lines somebody will try to label me a racist. Over the years I've grown to accept it (dont really think I am though). I've never hurt somebody over race, hell I still hold a door open for somebody other than my race, I treat them absolutely the same irl but I am a lot more wary of some races compared to others. I guess what it stems down to is being a realist that acknowledges some races are prone to violence, drugs, and general mayhem. Don't really know what I'm trying to get out of this but I'm tired of others thinking racist people are bad. There is many degrees of racism, please don't lump all of us together and dismiss an individual so easily because he/she doesn't think like you.
    I think that racism is bad because generally its connotations are immoral and quite simply unfair, unjust, whatever you want to call it. People branding other people for being racist because they're not attracted to black or asian people are just idiots.. Personally I don't think it's the same as having preference to someone with blonde hair over brown hair, but why should it be wrong to have preference over races? I'm sure people of varied ethnicities also have their preferences.

    The only problem I have with your opinion is how you think some races are more prone to violence and drugs etc. I think because in society black people have been vilified so much over the years in stead of white people, their actions are exaggerated and made seem worse than their white counterparts. But I'd like to see a global statistic where it shows that black people commit more crime than white people.

    P.S. I am drunk, forgive me if there is incoherence.
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  7. #647
    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    I guess what it stems down to is being a realist that acknowledges some races are prone to violence, drugs, and general mayhem..
    its the environment and the upbringing that influences a person the most.

  8. #648
    Quote Originally Posted by gzathegenius View Post
    its the environment and the upbringing that influences a person the most.
    This is true, but generally speaking, said people created the environment and upbringing.

  9. #649
    Quote Originally Posted by Stir View Post
    This is a load of bollocks.
    To judge people from statistics isn't racist at all, no. To judge the behaviour of certain RACES because of certain statistics about certain SUBCULTURES is absolutely racist.
    To judge someone based on past experiences with someone else of the same race is understandable because of the wiring of the brain. It is also incredibly STUPID. It simply means you do not have the capacity for awareness of your own thought processes. It is also racist.

    You say we shouldn't be ignorant of statistics, and believe you me: I'm not ignorant of statistics. Nor of what they imply. But people aren't great staticians (not even staticians are great staticians), and the implications of statistics are easily misinterpreted. These misinterpretations are often favoured over scientific evidence.
    For instance:
    A survey shows that 40% of all crime in a certain (large) area is performed by smurfs. In that same (large) area, Smurfs make up only 35% of the total populace. Now; you could argue that this is clear evidence that smurfs are naturally inclined to crime. Now take a look at that same area. In 80% of that area, the amount of smurfs is about 10% when compared to snorks, the 'peaceful' people. However, in the remaining 20% of that area, which happens to be a single neighbourhood, the amount of smurfs is 90%, and snorks only make up 10% of the population.
    Generations back, smurfs were treated much differently. They were poor and uneducated. They banded together. Their children didn't get much of an incentive to get a good education, because smurfs were generally seen as inferior, and wouldn't get much of a job anyway. Evidence of this was seen by all smurfs, and they decided that there wasn't any point in bothering. Then a few smurfs thought: 'Well; if we can't get what we need the honest way, we'll go criminal!' Considering the poor state of smurfs, and the fact that they could clearly see the much privileged state of the snorks, this wasn't actually that bad an idea. It caught on. Soon, crime became a part of life. Competition became rampant, which ramped up violence. And now, people would avoid smurfs wherever they see them, and act much more favourably towards snorks. In fact, a lot of people are now believing that violence and crime are a part of smurf nature; that their race is inferior...

    Self-fulfilling prophecy. And while the statistics are right, that doesn't mean the statistics have a conclusion as to the cause of those numbers. That's not up to statistics.
    exactly this.

    Infracted.

    "This" posts aren't allowed. Contribute more to the thread please.
    Last edited by Majad; 2013-01-29 at 02:40 AM.

  10. #650
    Quote Originally Posted by kukulcan13 View Post
    judge people as people not as a race, but dont be ignorant of statistics.
    And with a basic knowledge of statistics, you'll learn not to confuse correlation with causation. A higher crime rate among black males vs. whites does not logically imply that black people are inherently more prone to crime. There's a confounding factor that a larger proportion of black people live in areas of higher population density and greater poverty, two huge contributing factors to crime rate.

    Misinterpreting statistics to conclude that a black man is more prone to crime because of his race is ignorant. If it's an intentional misrepresentation, it's also racist. Or perhaps you failed statistics and became a criminal profiler.

  11. #651
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiricine View Post
    This is true, but generally speaking, said people created the environment and upbringing.
    It is not their race though... WHICH IS THE POINT.

  12. #652
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    not a big fan of racism..but my brother and everyone else says the "n" word all the time.. makes for awkward moments for me but its sad i'm used to it by now by them.

  13. #653
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    being a realist that acknowledges some races are prone to violence, drugs, and general mayhem.
    No, that isn't being a realist, but I do think almost everyone is racist to one degree or another even when they don't want to admit it.
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  14. #654
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    Wish people would stop thinking this. Rich black people do more crime than rich white people - check the stats
    You're honestly stupid. All of these rappers and NBA players grew up poor. They were raised in the ghetto, so they were immersed in that lifestyle. Rich white people on the other hand are usually rich by inheritance or were middle class suburban kids who became entrepreneurs.
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  15. #655
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    Quote Originally Posted by oxymoronic View Post
    Wish people would stop thinking this. Rich black people do more crime than rich white people - check the stats
    Meh, every rich white guy I know is a criminal to some degree or another where I live...and there are a lot of rich white guys where I live. Just their crimes come with a financial penalty or no penalty at as oppose to jail time.
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  16. #656
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam the Wiser View Post
    Everyone a racist deep down even if they don't admit it.
    Not really I'm mixed race with a blood line/heritage that according to my relatives involves both asian (north indian) and various european countries (English, Irish, Scotish, Spanish and Italian) and i have a keen interest in Chinese and Japanese cultures, not to mention a passing interest in Africa. So I would find it hard to be racist.

    Personally I find racism to be a biproduct of ignorance, most people I have met who have been racist in some degree are so because they lack knowledge of the people they dislike and without sounding arrogant they are usually poorly educated.
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  17. #657
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    Statistics are an idiot's excuse to reinforce their pre-existing prejudice. I work in the criminal justice system, and I know the statistics - but furthermore I know they're bullshit. The vast majority of our prison system is black males - but there are a number of socio-economic factors that play into it, and their race isn't one of them.

    Some of these factors *ARE* poverty, and living in crowded urban centers, and a history of disenfranchisement, and are theoretically and psychologically "able to be overcome" (though the double standard of what minorities are asked to overcome while the majority are railing against things like Affirmative Action is incredible). But some of these factors are out of their control - police are more present in their neighborhoods, are more suspicious due to their own personal race beliefs, the majority of police are white, drugs used by poor people (crack, e.g.) have incredibly harsh punishments compared to the slaps on the wrists given for designer drugs (ecstasy, LSD) and "rich people" drugs (cocaine), etc, etc. Some of it has to do with the fact that our judiciary is still made up largely of old, white men born in the 40-60s, though that's now changing, thank god.

    Also, "rich black people" commit more crimes than rich white people? Last I checked every financial scandal in this country has been headed up by a white man. Unless, of course, you're talking about the crimes of rappers and famous black people, who grew up in the ghetto and never changed the behavior even when they got money.

  18. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omnoms View Post
    "Races more prone to violence and drugs" listen to you. It couldnt possibly have anything to do with the society they live in or are forced into.
    It is actually a proven fact. Native americans, for instance, have very very poor resistance to alcohol, it's in their genes.
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  19. #659
    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    It is actually a proven fact. Native americans, for instance, have very very poor resistance to alcohol, it's in their genes.
    Which has nothing to do with being "naturally violent" as implied, just a low alcohol tolerance. Last time I checked being drunk doesn't make everyone violent. Try again.

  20. #660
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam the Wiser View Post
    Everyone a racist deep down even if they don't admit it.
    That. Also in my country I wouldn't call it racist but when you have a lot of "inculture" shows/music showd down on you that appeal and features only citizens of a certain race/ethnicity ( I am talking about gypsy or better new called "rroma", because we so needed to changed their name, right?). But the thing even since we have imigration problems with such people leaving our country and doing bad stuff in other EU countries, then the send them back here and they repeat that, if we do say anything we are automatic racist.

    Now I don't consider all of romanian gypsy's bad, but the majority of them are and the rest that are maybe good are a very little few. Add on top of that the "inculture" promoted by them via music/shows in mass-media, because some of them got rich and spend it to show off and promote such pseudo-cultural ways, it makes the regular people despise them even more.

    It's even sad that we can barly talk about it, on any radio/tv talk-show they can't even talk about it without getting fined by our Cable Regulation Association. Like the other day there was a radio talk-show about why romanians are not wanted to come in UK and people called and said that it's not real, but we do have some "gypsy" type people there commiting some illegal acts that makes us look bag. And moderator needed to change the subject fast, because he would get fined (like he got before) if he debates anything "gypsy" related, even if the facts check out and statistics the romanian gypsys that left our country do 99% illegal stuff.
    Last edited by naturestorm; 2013-01-29 at 07:54 AM.

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