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  1. #141
    Legendary! Granyala's Avatar
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    GC said he wants to keep some diversity among classes/specs. That's why spriest is still the only spec without a cooldown. (Shadowfiend doesn't really count, does it?)
    I know it sounds weird and masochistic, but I wholeheartedly agree with GC on that one.

    Which isn't fair to arms warriors right now because they've already been told many times this build that they will be getting massive damage buffs before the build hits live.
    Oh boy... bottom of the simulationcraft pit it is then. :<

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  2. #142
    I think ghost crawler stating leaving diversity for spriests is a cop out. Even if you give spriets an actual cd to use that doesn't define them as similar to other classes. It's like saying MF and life siphon are the same because they are both channeled spells that do damage. It's how they work is what defines them.

    Making a distinct CD for spriests would not make it similar to other classes that have cd's (which is all of them *cough*).

    In short he is lazy, look at the insanity change, look at the excuse for not making holy viable for pvp for the past 3 expansions, look at adding a past talent they removed at the start of the expansion to make disc pvp viable again.

    Fucking lazy.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Elodeon View Post
    WTF, guys?

    Last I checked, my Shadow Priest could spec Power Infusion. It's practically the same thing as Dark Soul for Affliction. It's 20% rather than 30%, but then you have Shadowfiend/Mindbender on top of that. Plus timing your Devouring Plague for use with Power Infusion.
    Which lowers our burst elsewhere. Which means it lowers our overal damage (which is sustained). Also PI is only haste, not damage (which means it doesn't scale with DoTs once you got your haste breakpoint, and it doesn't increase MBl damage), and Dark Soul is your base in every spec (your warlock's T5 is grimoires which allows you to spec into more burst or sustained depending on what you want). On top of that, you get to decide from 3 specs the one you prefer with one minor issue being hit cap (affli doesn't go for it, destro/demo do) but rest of stat weight being similar. Shadow can't spec into another DPS spec. Shadow priests do not have base line Ascendance or Dark Soul CD in baseline. They can spec for a weak one (PI), but it won't increase their overal DPS. Plus priests can't even give PI to you anymore...

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-31 at 02:14 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    I know it sounds weird and masochistic, but I wholeheartedly agree with GC on that one.
    Then something has to be above average. Something output-wise. Increase our sustained single target? More burst multiDoT fights? Or increase our utility, but from mana battery and VE that feels like a deja vu.
    "When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Washuwa View Post
    leveling a warlock right now to reroll... .
    Mine is 87 atm, lvling it to re-roll aswell. Spriests are a broken class, and if one have read blizzards hints, it will never be fixed to a good state again.

    So those of you that are gonna keep playing them, have fun wining with shitty dps the rest of your wow time, becuse you wont be good, ever again

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Elodeon View Post
    WTF, guys?

    Last I checked, my Shadow Priest could spec Power Infusion. It's practically the same thing as Dark Soul for Affliction. It's 20% rather than 30%, but then you have Shadowfiend/Mindbender on top of that. Plus timing your Devouring Plague for use with Power Infusion.
    Far from the optimal choice of that tier, as has been discussed thoroughly in this very thread.

  6. #146
    I am Murloc! Volitar's Avatar
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    Well they are planning to nerf the shit out of Shadow PVP so maybe we will get DPS buffs.

  7. #147
    GC says we "probably" lost some movement dps because of the MSp glyph nerf. He also added that they hadn't done any PvE adjustments, but they would. Like buffin SW: P insta damage by 5% or something. lol.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by lolalola View Post
    Also PI is only haste, not damage (which means it doesn't scale with DoTs once you got your haste breakpoint
    Completely false. Hitting a breakpoint does not mean the dot stops scaling with haste. Do a search on the forums, this subject has been exhausted to infinity already. DP is a slight exception to this, but the added haste from PI would actually give you an extra tick anyway basically increasing your DP damage by 12.5% assuming you are over the 8 tick breakpoint already.

    PI is actually not that bad, but you do have to sacrifice some damage elsewhere to take which is the real issue. I think we need a baseline cooldown, but more importantly we need some way to make other abilities scale with haste the same way our dots do.
    Last edited by stiglet; 2013-01-31 at 10:48 AM.
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  9. #149
    I would love to see an ability like this:
    Orb Infusion
    Creates 1 Shadow Orb every 2 sec for 12 seconds.
    2 minute Cooldown

    Maybe even replace Power infusion with that talent. Twist of Fate should be reworked too imo..

  10. #150
    Sorry that was a stupid and incorrect statement which doesn't make sense (if it doesn't scale at all it means stat priority becomes zero), but haste doesn't scale with MBl. DS is both a bigger damage increase, and is baseline. If you do take PI your overall damage / multiDoT damage (from DI) or execute phase / multiDoT damage (from ToF) _will_ suffer too much.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-31 at 12:01 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Theed View Post
    I would love to see an ability like this:
    Orb Infusion
    Creates 1 Shadow Orb every 2 sec for 12 seconds.
    2 minute Cooldown

    Maybe even replace Power infusion with that talent. Twist of Fate should be reworked too imo..
    What's wrong with ToF? It competes well with DI.

    Your suggestion is it a channel or a GCD which triggers a proc? It doesn't seem to scale well with MBl, and it seems very OP for PvP given you can chain DP (or even PH + DP)
    "When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Theed View Post
    I would love to see an ability like this:
    Orb Infusion
    Creates 1 Shadow Orb every 2 sec for 12 seconds.
    2 minute Cooldown

    Maybe even replace Power infusion with that talent. Twist of Fate should be reworked too imo..
    The real problem isn't the lack of a dps cooldown, it's the fact that orb generation doesn't scale at all with anything. Shadow needs a Sanctity Of Battle-like passive that reduces MB cooldown based on haste.
    Quote Originally Posted by Karragon View Post
    I'd like WoW to be a single player game

  12. #152
    i feel also a bit broken, playing a sp for many years now but these days iam falling way behing even though i hit all buttons correctly. DOT Uptime is no issue as well. Wanna have T13 Burst back,that was really fun and viable!!!

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by lolalola View Post
    but haste doesn't scale with MBl. DS is both a bigger damage increase, and is baseline. If you do take PI your overall damage / multiDoT damage (from DI) or execute phase / multiDoT damage (from ToF) _will_ suffer too much.
    Yep, pretty much this.

    Have to say i'm looking forward to this new Insanity talent, just for a change if nothing else. Looks like it will be a viable 3rd choice.
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  14. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairm View Post
    You still do great all around dps. If you had CD's, you wouldn't be happy to use them, or get nerf to compansate for having them.

    I play a shaman. One of my dps CD is a pet, the fire elemental. Yes i have Ascandance, but i can't sustain your dps without it. Its a pick and choose. You can't top meters and have big dps CD's.
    Not to mention you lose close to 0 dps while moving. On heavy movement fights spriests really suck. Unless you're lucky and fdcl and di proc while moving.
    But that's not the point. At the start of the fight, every class is bursting for around 200k dps, I can't get past 150 and even to hit that I need a proc or 2 and 3 shadow orbs before start of the fight.
    Shadow priests need a buff in pve - either a cooldown (*cough DA *cough) or something like ele shamans have with their lightning bolt (or warlocks for every spell)..

    Ofc some people will say that we have a cooldown (PI). Guess what! Other specs have baseline cooldowns + another one in their talent tier. And they're somewhat better than PI.

    I wish haste reduced cd on mind blast so we'd generate orbs a little bit faster (+ haste would become a bit better)
    Last edited by Maticko; 2013-01-31 at 11:43 AM. Reason: Scaling with gear
    Hate is a special type of love given to people who suck.

  15. #155
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by blargh312 View Post
    The real problem isn't the lack of a dps cooldown, it's the fact that orb generation doesn't scale at all with anything. Shadow needs a Sanctity Of Battle-like passive that reduces MB cooldown based on haste.
    The thing is that the result of the orb generation (DP) scales just perfectly fine with haste. So Orb generation does indirectly scale with haste aswell.
    Reducing MB Cooldown bsed on haste would mean DP would double dip with haste, which cant be a design goal...

  16. #156
    Field Marshal Adelphia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hammerofpope View Post
    If I continue playing I may just roll a damn Warlock. Save my Priest in case Blizz ever wakes up.
    This is exactly my route atm.
    Melting faces since 2005.

  17. #157
    scales just perfectly fine with haste
    it scale fine til you get required amount of haste. i dont think that we can obtain 14800 haste point in 5.2 without full haste gem.
    Last edited by Aleaa; 2013-01-31 at 12:32 PM.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by burk23
    The thing is that the result of the orb generation (DP) scales just perfectly fine with haste. So Orb generation does indirectly scale with haste aswell.
    Reducing MB Cooldown bsed on haste would mean DP would double dip with haste, which cant be a design goal...
    DP doesn't scale the same way as other dots, because it is a non-refreshable dot much like combustion. You cannot keep the dot ticking indefinitely, which means that unless you hit haste breakpoints it doesn't actually do any more damage. The complete opposite is true of any other dots. There is a breakpoint at 8.3% haste, then every 16.7% ish after that. So, we get an extra tick at 8.3%, then the second tick comes at 25% (which is the damage spike we see at 8085 rating). The next tick comes at 41.7%. Until then, DP gets zero haste scale. However, PI does edge us over so we see a nice increase in dps with PI.

    Orb generation and it's resultant damage doesn't really scale with haste in a linear scale at all unless you spec into DI. This is THE biggest problem with Spriests right now. It would be nice if they changed the mechanic of DP to somehow change the way it scaled with haste. Perhaps if it didn't have haste breakpoints, and only ever had 6 ticks ticking once every 1 second i.e. haste has no effect in the conventional way. Instead, haste would directly increase the damage of the ticks themselves by the same amount of haste i.e. at 25% haste, the ticks on DP do 25% more damage. That would be awesome. Warlocks have a similar mechanic with Crit for a spell I cannot recall right now where that spell cannot crit but instead crit directly increases that spell by the same percentage.

    Edited to say so i'm wrong, it's actually Chaos Bolt I was thinking of and instead of not being able to crit it always crits. But the idea is generally the same.
    Last edited by stiglet; 2013-01-31 at 01:07 PM.
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Alidie View Post
    Please be quiet, you're obviously a real shit shaman if you get beaten by a spriest.
    Sad thing is that in my guild I am way too high on the dps meters on single target fights... as shadow priest. Everyone is around the same ilvl and most even higher than me.

    Some people don't believe in simulations etc. but this list is a much better representation than some random persons experience.
    I don't understand how 25% dps difference is acceptable.
    Last edited by Gilian; 2013-01-31 at 12:45 PM.

  20. #160
    spell cannot crit but instead crit directly increases that spell by the same percentage.
    spell have 100% crit chance and %of crit chanse inc damage - Soul Fire/Chaose Bolt

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