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  1. #1

    [Feral] DOC or NV talent is better dps?

    I was wondering which 2 talents between the 2 of them would do more dps? For DOC, whats the burst rotation at the start of a boss fight in a raid ?
    Last edited by Sunfyre; 2013-02-01 at 06:06 PM.

  2. #2
    Pandaren Monk Moosie's Avatar
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    DoC is the theoretically better talent, and for me at least, in practice is also the better talent. Some people argue NV is better on some fights but I am yet to see any fights which do. I guess this is sorely down to play style.
    Moosie <After Hours> : Feral / Restoration

  3. #3
    NV is pretty nice on garalon for added burst on the legs

  4. #4
    To my knowledge, Dead old Corpses is preferred by Feral, while Neon Varnish is the choice for Balance.
    High on toxic Waters is used by neither, at least until 5.2 where the changes to Neon Varnish might drop it below for Balance.

  5. #5
    Burst is alright at the beginning if you do it right, though Nature's Vigil would be higher. DoC does theoretically do more dps as Moosie said, though you need to make sure you can execute it properly.

  6. #6

    which talent would you prefer as a feral druid, DoC or NV?

    as the title says, choose one and give a reason.

  7. #7

    Cool

    HoTW...

    Why?
    -No-brainer talent, more passive agility and makes the rotation simple (just keep rake, rip, SR, spam shred and use TF to buff things and you are done.

    -Good for guild progress:
    Tank died and BR is on CD? pop HoTW and be a tank for 25 segs
    Healer died? No problem I got super tranquility muchachos (actually heals a lot)

    By making easier the dps rotation you can look whats happening and move from bad stuff like fire and things.

    NV is boring and do less dps

  8. #8
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    DoC for 95/100 pulls and HotW on the others for the reason above. I heard NV has a good use on Garalon might try it out, generally as long as we don't progress him on heroic I tend to try sit out because it is one of those suicide fml bosses.
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


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  9. #9
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    For good players: DoC->NV/HotW
    For average/bad: NV/HotW

    The DoC rotation is very complex and if not executed properly you'd end up losing dps the other two are up to personal preference but HotW (If I'm not mistaken) is slightly better overall.
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


    I'm schizophrenic and alone... at least I got each other

  10. #10
    High Overlord Garth's Avatar
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    I sat out our first couple HC Garalon kills because ferals for whatever reason just tend to be abysmal on that fight, I presume because of target switches. I have been using NV stacked with berserk this whole expac so far on most fights, mostly because on HC mode you really can't tunnel and I haven't had much time to get comfortable with DoC, not that I would want to because I really don't like the idea of it.

    With the changes to NV tho, I would start practicing with DoC because it will likely pull even further ahead in 5.2, but it's never going to be easy to dodge the bosses poop balls or void zones or whatever you have to be missing while concentrating on making sure you heal at the right time to reapply DoTs or whatever. I really haven't found a good way to play DoC, it seems no matter how you slice it, it will be a hectic, confusing, and laborious rotation. From the few times i messed around with it (most notably Gara'jal HC) I found that I could butcher the rotation terribly, which I did, and still end up doing more dps, but on fights like Imperial Vizier HC, it would be nearly impossible to do because of all the movement required.

    I've been curious whether there will ever be a point where the 6% raw agility from HotW will pull ahead because of gear scaling, but I'll leave that for the math people to figure out. Interestingly enough,

    I tried a 2-berserk test (6:00) with each of the talents and the one that ended up doing the best was HotW, by quite a bit actually. I assume it's because I was screwing up DoC, but I did manage to keep up DoC buffed DoTs the whole time, so I'm really not sure. That is never a good indication of what happens in a raid, but I just found it interesting.
    Last edited by Garth; 2013-02-01 at 02:33 PM.

  11. #11
    I usually go DoC for most encounters, taking HotW for bosses such as Ta'yak HC (tornado phase), where some extra healing comes in handy.

    DoC rotation can be a little complex at first, but you get used to it in no time really.
    Last edited by Zoibert; 2013-02-01 at 02:32 PM.

  12. #12
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    @Garth, HotW is a very good talent especially for progression if i where you i'd keep HotW and practice DoC on spare time in dungeons and dungeons/LFR.
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


    I'm schizophrenic and alone... at least I got each other

  13. #13
    High Overlord Garth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Etapicx View Post
    @Garth, HotW is a very good talent especially for progression if i where you i'd keep HotW and practice DoC on spare time in dungeons and dungeons/LFR.
    Ya, I plan to spend some more time on it, but i have found I can do competitive DPS with the other talents so I haven't really made it a priority to work on it, as soon as we finish heroic progression I will try to get a better grasp of it before 5.2 drops

  14. #14
    Zookeeper Sunfyre's Avatar
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    I've begun merging these threads since the question is asked every 12 hours or so. In the future, this will be the 'master discussion thread' for DoC vs Nature's Vigil for Feral.

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  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Sunfyre View Post
    I've begun merging these threads since the question is asked every 12 hours or so. In the future, this will be the 'master discussion thread' for DoC vs Nature's Vigil for Feral.
    Should all really be kept in the feral sticky tbh, its been talked about in depth there loads.

  16. #16
    Zookeeper Sunfyre's Avatar
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    Well, in all honesty, all conversations about a spec could probably be pointed back to their sticky, but, that'll never happen :P

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  17. #17
    Mechagnome Etapicx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunfyre View Post
    Well, in all honesty, all conversations about a spec could probably be pointed back to their sticky, but, that'll never happen :P
    The best start would be if ppl actually reed the sticky then asked :-)
    Always choose a lazy person to do the difficult job!
    Why?
    He will find an easy way to do it.


    I'm schizophrenic and alone... at least I got each other

  18. #18
    Now you're just asking for miracles.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Garth View Post
    With the changes to NV tho, I would start practicing with DoC because it will likely pull even further ahead in 5.2, but it's never going to be easy to dodge the bosses poop balls or void zones or whatever you have to be missing while concentrating on making sure you heal at the right time to reapply DoTs or whatever. I really haven't found a good way to play DoC, it seems no matter how you slice it, it will be a hectic, confusing, and laborious rotation. From the few times i messed around with it (most notably Gara'jal HC) I found that I could butcher the rotation terribly, which I did, and still end up doing more dps, but on fights like Imperial Vizier HC, it would be nearly impossible to do because of all the movement required.
    After recently coming back to my Druid, I'd been putting off trying DoC until I changed internet providers (was having some terrible lag issues for a couple weeks) and finally gave it a shot in Terrace the other night. Hectic, confusing, and laborious rotation definitely sums up my impression of it so far. I tried it on Tsulong and my dps was about 4k lower than the previous week with HotW. (though on the other hand, my healing was about 5k higher lol) I guess that's not the best fight to gauge it on though? I'm not entirely sure I understand the proper usage of it either. Basically just line up Predatory Swiftness proc with 3 CP, pop out and HT and then make sure one of your two attacks are a 5cp Rip? Should I be aiming for the DoC buff with every Predatory Swiftness proc?

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 07:20 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Sunfyre View Post
    Well, in all honesty, all conversations about a spec could probably be pointed back to their sticky, but, that'll never happen :P
    Stickies are nice for general guides, but for in depth discussion of specific subjects, individual threads are easier to navigate. Obviously having multiple threads on the same subject are unnecessary but having one outside of a sticky makes things easier for someone looking for that one specific topic.

  20. #20
    DoC is very weird and quirky to play if you're coming in to it from either NV/HotW. There's no denying that it does take quite a bit of time before it becomes naturally to you. I switched from NV when I got my weap from Spirit Kings hc (as I went from a blue to that) and I haven't looked back. Once you get used to it, I think that if you can master it, or get close you won't look back either, it is a massively rewarding spec compared to the now "dull" rotation of NV/HotW. I highly suggest you put in some serious time on dummies to give it some chance because if you crack it you'll love it.

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