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  1. #1

    [WW/BRM] Need some Challenge mode advice...

    Yo.
    I have been talking with my challenge mode group buddies about going BRM, for some challenge modes, from time to time. so our warrior can go dps. Anyway, I have a question, currently it's "Ok" for BRM to go softcap for it so i can have no gear change issues with this. but i would have to gem Haste/crit instead of agil (for BRM), and in order for this to make a WW dps increase, most fights (boss fights) needs to be FAIK: Patchwerk fight or just me having high uptime on the boss, now some bosses have added things to them. So would it be worth it to regem for that? (Challenge mode is my only end game content except for random BGs, atm.

    Thanks in advance .

    I am also aware that more haste = lowers duration on FoF and SCK, which means more AoE on trash etc and more of that WW/MW buff only.
    Last edited by Garush; 2013-02-01 at 08:16 AM.
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  2. #2
    Tip, if you're going to do CMs and it's your first time getting gold you're going to want to have a good bit of stam as well. BrM only need "enough" stam, I'm tanking heroic sha of fear on my monk just fine, I go into CMs and I get trucked compared to on my DK I just face tank everything in CMs.

  3. #3
    You want to stack Haste and crit, and forget about Stam/mastery; The things that kill you in CMs will do far more dmg than any stamina/mastery will give you a buffer. You need to have chi/EB to be able to handle them.

    You have to remember, your stat pool is limited. The way BrM CM tanking works is that you are the top DPS + a tank; and as such you have to know the cooldowns of your comp and their CCs. The best way (hardest to pull off) is to pull big packs, and tank them for about 5 seconds with a CD up (interrupting casters ofc - you can use BoF glyph for that), and after 5 seconds (to get Vengeance) you Leg Sweep, and go mad with AoE, have someone else chain a CC after that, and if they aren't dead by then, they will be in the next 3/4 seconds, thats when your healer needs to spam you.

    You have to really let your healer know that when healing a BrM, it isnt reactive healing at ALL, its all proactive, mana shouldnt be an issue. Due to the increased speed of killing trash packs, healers can actually sit down to drink sometimes.

    So yes, haste/crit; you will need the extra Chi. You can't go in there thinking you can tank anything, the "proper" way.

  4. #4
    I've got some questions regarding brewmaster in challenge modes:

    1. Gear level: 463 is max, right? I mean even epics that drop from heroics will be scaled down, right? Like 476 fist from Shadopan Monastery.
    2. Gems: Does legendary gem work?
    3. What trinkets would you suggest? What about procs from higher level trinkets? Do they work? Like elegon trinket.
    4. Stat priorities: how much hit & exp should I have?

  5. #5
    response to above

    1. yes 476 would be scaled down to 463.
    2. regular gems do legendary dont.
    3. procs are scaled as well/
    4. need to be able to go in and get 7.5/7.5% for this i would highly suggest just grinding out a 463 gear set and gemming/chanting that it makes it way easier to calculate ur stats and also the way blizzard does the scaling they mess up with hit and exp on items making u over all lose out if u are wearing higher lvl gear the 463 is itemized the best for cms. its hard to explain but im sure u could find posts on it

  6. #6
    The Lightbringer SurrealNight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Areohotah View Post
    4. need to be able to go in and get 7.5/7.5% for this i would highly suggest just grinding out a 463 gear set and gemming/chanting that it makes it way easier to calculate ur stats and also the way blizzard does the scaling they mess up with hit and exp on items making u over all lose out if u are wearing higher lvl gear the 463 is itemized the best for cms. its hard to explain but im sure u could find posts on it
    Uggg no wonder why I haven't bothered with Challenge modes yet =P How annoying.

    I've heard that getting stunned is a huge issue for BrM as well?

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  7. #7
    Dreadlord Angrybathtub's Avatar
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    Brewmasters are the worst for tanking CMs imo. DKs making tanking in CMs really easy.

    Good luck though, it's definitely doable with Brewmasters.

  8. #8
    First of all, lovely to see the replies here, (though i wish i could get some more info regarding gemming haste over agi (due to higher frequency on AE).

    I do appreciate the comments that are about BRM, (Upon further notice I will probably go for that spec in 5.2 for challenge modes should i have anything left, the EB buff (6sec cd instead of 9),mastery buff, and that stun removal thing are all neat buffs for the class when doing PvE and PvP.

    Second, I would love to hear some WW thoughts as well.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Garush View Post
    First of all, lovely to see the replies here, (though i wish i could get some more info regarding gemming haste over agi (due to higher frequency on AE).

    I do appreciate the comments that are about BRM, (Upon further notice I will probably go for that spec in 5.2 for challenge modes should i have anything left, the EB buff (6sec cd instead of 9),mastery buff, and that stun removal thing are all neat buffs for the class when doing PvE and PvP.

    Second, I would love to hear some WW thoughts as well.
    I've run through challenge modes on three characters now, maybe five times gold each, and here's my thoughts on monk WW/BRM:

    WW:

    Pros:
    * AOE stun x 2
    * Crit buff
    * Good personal cooldowns

    Cons:
    * Crap dps. While this could possibly be the result of just overall bad play, I feel as if the WW monk is one of the five lowest dps spec for challenge modes. No cleave worth a damn, aoe is mediocre, and at 463, doesn't really exhibit high single target dps either.

    ---

    BRM:

    Pros:
    * Highest tank dps for challenge modes by a long shot.
    * Great self/group healing - generally the healer can dps 100% of the time on half the bosses.
    * AOE stun, spammable aoe interrupt.

    Cons:
    * Weak cds
    * Gets wrecked so hard


    -------------

    I don't really have much experience with a mistweaver, but honestly brewmaster is still the spec to be while running challenge modes now. You basically shift the difficulty - I can't recall the last time any group containing my brewmaster had difficulty reaching the gold timer, even with dps as low as 30k in the group - from DPS to HPS. You'll have to plan your pulls and rotate cooldowns properly. IMO, the best possible tank/healer comp for CM is brewmaster/disc priest.

    Good luck.

  10. #10
    surreal - yes if u get stunned without a gaurd or something stroner/external up it becomes really bad. 9/10 times its an instant death.

    ^^ what angrybathtub said. now i havent done gold modes but just from what ive seen with my group going in and doing them ur much better off going ww and finding a dk tank. plus with the 5.2 changes for ww they will be 100% better than they are now for cms which is already really good. quicker tigerseye build up means higher uptime on trash>> storm earth fire for bosses such as whitemane and so on will be awesome.

  11. #11
    As I said in my earlier post, you will want some stam (trinket or 2 should be enough). I ignored mastery when i did them. You will normally pull the harder pulls with 1-2 cooldowns up, get some high vengance, leg sweep, if any other aoe stuns are available, use them and then SCK spam while staying out of melee range (Depending on healer you can stay in longer, priest spamming heals with spirit shell up). As I said, DKs are the easiest tanks to get gold with, BrM are easier to get world rank times with.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Toxiel/simple is my monk.
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...llfrost/simple is my dk.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/challeng...drenden/#reset As you should be able to tell, I much rather use my dk for my runs than my monk even though he has much better gear. I gem and reforge differently for CMs on my monk. Warrior tanks are also pretty good for them, and ww dps is by no means bad.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by kaiadam View Post

    Cons:
    * Crap dps. While this could possibly be the result of just overall bad play, I feel as if the WW monk is one of the five lowest dps spec for challenge modes. No cleave worth a damn, aoe is mediocre,
    Eh wot
    Sure we arent the best for bosses, our burst isn't exactly high, but we have pretty strong AE.
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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by SurrealNight View Post
    Uggg no wonder why I haven't bothered with Challenge modes yet =P How annoying.

    I've heard that getting stunned is a huge issue for BrM as well?
    Thats why i won't bother with cm's until 5.2. Or just go as WW with a DK buddy,

  14. #14
    Field Marshal PrecizionHunting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garush View Post
    Yo.
    I have been talking with my challenge mode group buddies about going BRM, for some challenge modes, from time to time. so our warrior can go dps. Anyway, I have a question, currently it's "Ok" for BRM to go softcap for it so i can have no gear change issues with this. but i would have to gem Haste/crit instead of agil (for BRM), and in order for this to make a WW dps increase, most fights (boss fights) needs to be FAIK: Patchwerk fight or just me having high uptime on the boss, now some bosses have added things to them. So would it be worth it to regem for that? (Challenge mode is my only end game content except for random BGs, atm.

    Thanks in advance .

    I am also aware that more haste = lowers duration on FoF and SCK, which means more AoE on trash etc and more of that WW/MW buff only.
    I personally don't know much about monks in general, but, my CM team is currently #1 in the world. My tank is Nerthfu (http://www.wowprogress.com/character/us/lethon/Nerthfu), I'll let him know about your questions and try and point him to this thread or to your via PM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by PrecizionHunting View Post
    I personally don't know much about monks in general, but, my CM team is currently #1 in the world. My tank is Nerthfu (http://www.wowprogress.com/character/us/lethon/Nerthfu), I'll let him know about your questions and try and point him to this thread or to your via PM.
    Oh thanks, that would do wonders ^^.
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  16. #16
    Honestly stam and mastery only exist to give your healer a margin of error, outside of that both stats are useless for CMs as they'll likely never make the difference between life and death. Whenever I did in CMs is because I didn't use my ability properly or someone in my group didn't use theirs at the right time. You'll be taking more dmg overall with either more stam or more mastery too since any other stats would actually help you reduce the dmg you receive. Playing BRM monk in CMs will have alot more risk than playing a dk, but it's also higher reward.


    Anyway, while your stats choice do matter in CMs, execution is far more important untill you try to get good times. Personally I aim for 7.5% hit and a bit more expertise (between 7.5 and 10 depending on my mood) and the rest into haste *then crit. My gems are a balance of agi and haste and both my trinkets are dps trinket with high passive agility.

    As for windwalker monk, I'm confident they're alot more viable than what most people think in CMs. They have very good sustained dps in both AoE and single target and bring their fair share of utility. They also have alot of ways to avoid taking dmg for a melee. Just make sure that you use both your stuns wisely as they can make a run alot easier for the tank/healer. It might also be worth swapping between xuen and Rushing Jade Wind midrun.

    I'll also add that while I agree BRM monk might be better than DK for CMs world time, I strongly disagree with the previous statement that it's easier to do world time with a BRM. The margin for errors as a BRM tank when you try to do world best time is simply to thin compared to what DKs/Warriors have.

  17. #17
    Field Marshal PrecizionHunting's Avatar
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    There he is!!! Thanks Nerth! <3 <3 <3

  18. #18
    Brewmaster definitely offers both greater risk and greater reward for challenge mode content. Paired with the right healer, (Disc priest), magical things can happen, or you can get faceplanted in 2 seconds if you take a bad stun.

  19. #19
    Anyway to counter stuns in CMs?
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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Garush View Post
    Anyway to counter stuns in CMs?
    Siege: the amber weaver can and should be interrupted, 2 class interrupt should be enough for each pull, any other form of CC works too. The engineer at the end won't stun you if you don't have the fire debuff (or w/e it is) on you. You can also stun them not sure about interupts.

    Mogu'shan palace: for the quillen there's not much you can do, I just eat the stuns with all CDs up and they're all dead before a second round of stun. We also have a hunter pet tank one so that's one less stun to worry about. For the skulker on the boss, he won't move while casting his stun and you can just go out of range. He'll keep casting it until he lands it on you tho. A hunter pet also works wonder here.

    Shado-pan: just move out of range of the 2 adds that can stun and they'll just miss it. Their stun still goes on cooldown when you go out of range. IF you have problem trying to time yourself with the stun just look for the shiny lightning in their hands, it's a sign they're casting.

    Scarlet Monastery: Stack cds before you get stunned or kill em before they kill you.

    GSS: nothing to do to counter the weird stun the small infiltrator (or sapper don't remember) do when they jump on your back, most annoying stun of all CMs if you ask me.

    I think that's about it.

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