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  1. #1

    GC on why RBGs give higher cap and why it's a problem


    Greg Street
    To provide rewards commensurate with the extra logistics and time commitment that RBGs require. 2s esp. take very little time


    He is glossing over the fact that weekly caps are what is causing the gear disparity problem. If you play an RBG, you get get more Conquest points for that win than an Arena win, which is fine. The additional points are the reward.

    This question is specifically about the cap. As long as rating and format affect the cap, then players will never be able to catch up.

    All they need is a season cap that increases weekly for all players. A season cap for all doesn't allow "instant" catch up either. If you start week 10(assume the cap increased by 2700 /week) and have to earn 27,000 cps, that's going to take you 150 Arena wins.

    Is 150 Arena wins instant?

  2. #2
    How about no? In all honesty it is far harder to get 10 decently skilled people together, find a date where they all have time and then actually get your RBG going. More over unlike in 2's you're actually risking your rating, so just taking anyone as you can do in 2's and Raids just wont do.

    If you want a higher than 1800 cap, just get over 1.550 rating. It really isn't that hard and if you can't manage to do that, you don't deserve an increased cap in the first place.

  3. #3
    I think sometimes they forget that World of Warcraft is a game, and that you should be able to have fun in it any day of the week and do what you want to do.

    Things like:

    It takes atleast 2 months of playing at level 90 to become viable in arena, and not SERIOUSLY disadvantaged (although you still will be) - and you can't have fun during this time.
    You have to do something you dislike, in order to be optimal. Such as doing RBGs even if you hate them, just because they get bonuses over arena (which you do like).
    Throughout the entirety of the low level experience all PvP is extremely unbalanced, and unfun.

    I think they just think like... "Oh WoW Has most subscribers so we can get away with them wanting to /wrist while they do bgs for 2 weeks while they get 1shot by everyone, and can't do anything about it." Kinda annoys me.
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  4. #4
    You guys don't have to do any RBG whatsoever to get more points, you just have to break 1.550 rating because then your weekly cap will go up. The reason I guess most of you are complaining is because for some reason you can't do that. But don't worry, with the planned rating inflation even you might be able to, just stick to ONE team for the season and see your rating and thus weekly point cap slowly increase!

  5. #5
    Breaking the cap increases BOTH the amount you can receive in RBG's and Arenas. It is not possible to cap conquest with just arena. Even if you had a 5000 rating. Still have to do RBG's to cap out.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Asher13 View Post
    Breaking the cap increases BOTH the amount you can receive in RBG's and Arenas. It is not possible to cap conquest with just arena. Even if you had a 5000 rating. Still have to do RBG's to cap out.
    This is plain wrong and verifies my suspicion that you never even broke 1,55. If you go above 1,55 your Arena cap increases till it eventually hits the 2,2k cap at 1,75. Only after that you have a general increase in points you can make per week and you can get them all by doing Arena. The only them this doesn't hold true is if your RBG live rating provides an even higher cap.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Deleth View Post
    You guys don't have to do any RBG whatsoever to get more points, you just have to break 1.550 rating because then your weekly cap will go up. The reason I guess most of you are complaining is because for some reason you can't do that. But don't worry, with the planned rating inflation even you might be able to, just stick to ONE team for the season and see your rating and thus weekly point cap slowly increase!
    So you're saying that 2k rating in arena is the same as 2k in RBGs ?

  8. #8
    Casual PvE players don't have to raid to cap Valor points. Why should casual PvP players have to RBG (the PvP equivalent of raiding) to cap conquest? Especially since PvP is supposed to be more about skill than gear in the first place.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Rabian View Post
    Casual PvE players don't have to raid to cap Valor points. Why should casual PvP players have to RBG (the PvP equivalent of raiding) to cap conquest? Especially since PvP is supposed to be more about skill than gear in the first place.
    This. You can say 10/25 mans take more effort to organize than LFD or dailies and they all give full cap, while 2s does not.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rabian View Post
    Casual PvE players don't have to raid to cap Valor points. Why should casual PvP players have to RBG (the PvP equivalent of raiding) to cap conquest? Especially since PvP is supposed to be more about skill than gear in the first place.
    if you get a high enough (not even rly that high) rating you dont have to do rbgs anymore.
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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferg View Post
    if you get a high enough (not even rly that high) rating you dont have to do rbgs anymore.
    That's why I said CASUAL. A PvE player in greens can grind heroics and dailies and cap valor each week. A PvP player in greens cannot get a rating high enough to get the increased cap unless he has a very geared friend carrying him. See the difference?

  12. #12
    A lot of people are missing something very important. RBGs point cap increases more than arenas with equal rating. An 1800 RBGs rating will give you a way higher cap than 1800 arenas, which is just silly. It means if you want to keep up on gear, you absolutely have to do RBGs every week even if you dislike them.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Rabian View Post
    Casual PvE players don't have to raid to cap Valor points. Why should casual PvP players have to RBG (the PvP equivalent of raiding) to cap conquest?
    Not comparable.

    In PvE you get the best gear from the raids itself, not from Valor points, so it's no big deal to let PvE'ers cap valor from unimportant shit because they don't actually get anything decent from it. In PvP, however, you do get the best gear from the Conquest points.
    Humans are the only species on the planet smart enough to be this stupid.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by savvasp View Post
    So you're saying that 2k rating in arena is the same as 2k in RBGs ?
    No, he's saying the idea that you HAVE to do RBG's to reach the weekly conquest point cap is completely false.
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  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral nerdjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vandrel View Post
    A lot of people are missing something very important. RBGs point cap increases more than arenas with equal rating. An 1800 RBGs rating will give you a way higher cap than 1800 arenas, which is just silly. It means if you want to keep up on gear, you absolutely have to do RBGs every week even if you dislike them.
    Not to mention that the ratings themselves aren't equivalent. 1800 in rating in RBGs is nothing compared to 1800 in arena right now, further compounding that problem. There's supposed to be some kind of arena rating inflation system being implemented though, which may make RBGs less mandatory as the season progresses.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Rabian View Post
    Casual PvE players don't have to raid to cap Valor points. Why should casual PvP players have to RBG (the PvP equivalent of raiding) to cap conquest? Especially since PvP is supposed to be more about skill than gear in the first place.
    Stuff in PvE mostly drop from bosses, points aren't comparable.

    Quote Originally Posted by Illiterate View Post
    This. You can say 10/25 mans take more effort to organize than LFD or dailies and they all give full cap, while 2s does not.
    No they don't. You can pretty much bring everyone to a raid and still be successfull. There is no punishment, no loss for actually losing. You can wipe a hundred times and the boss will still drop the same stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by asb View Post
    Not to mention that the ratings themselves aren't equivalent. 1800 in rating in RBGs is nothing compared to 1800 in arena right now, further compounding that problem. There's supposed to be some kind of arena rating inflation system being implemented though, which may make RBGs less mandatory as the season progresses.
    Unless it is also implimented for RBG's. They're still not mandatory though. 1750 rating is easy and gives you the full 2,2k cap. So people claiming they don't get the full cap aren't able to even reach 1750 and thus I am questioning why they even need PvP gear in the first place. Not like they'd use it for PvP.

  17. #17
    Bloodsail Admiral nerdjames's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deleth View Post
    Unless it is also implimented for RBG's. They're still not mandatory though. 1750 rating is easy and gives you the full 2,2k cap. So people claiming they don't get the full cap aren't able to even reach 1750 and thus I am questioning why they even need PvP gear in the first place. Not like they'd use it for PvP.
    Yeah, that's a scary but realistic possibility. As for the conq cap itself, I might be seeing it a little differently than you. It sounds to me like you're saying: For someone playing at an entirely sub-1500 level, RBGs are mandatory in that you want to play a couple games to finish off your cap and get your full conquest cap. And yes, if they could bring up their arena rating to 1750, they'd be able to achieve that same cap, sans-RBG. The thing is, if they simply invested that much effort into RBGs in the first place, they'd probably be able to pull off ~2000 rating and wind up with a conquest cap into the 3000s the next week. RBGs very simply give you much more reward for the same skill level when compared to arena, so they're necessary if you want to compete at the highest level you can.

  18. #18
    So tired of hearing "if you aren't 2000 in arena you can't pvp or if you aren't 1750 you must suck etc."

    Ratings and rankings are a joke until Blizz fixes the MMR system and the exploits, and don't even get me started on addons like gladiatorlosa coupled with macros that allow you to basically automate interrupts and ccs. Get rid of all the automated help with macros and addons and you will see how good people really are.

    Some people who can pvp don't play arena seriously for various reasons. I do 2s just for points with several friends and my rating every year is probably around 1500 so I guess by the standard definition I am bad. Yet nearly every time some arena hero or RBG win trader opens their mouth and actually has the balls to duel I trounce them. Yea I know the game is not balanced around 1 v 1. Still everyone with 2400+ RBG rating and full elite gear should be able to beat a 1500 player, right?

  19. #19
    To me its not the fact about getting the 2.2 cap, its the fact that RBG gives an overall way higher cap than arena can ever achieve. For example the max you can get in arena at 2600 currently is I believe around 3100 but in RBG its like what 3789 conquest at the same rating. So for anyone that plays at the highest levels, RBGs is mandatory.

    So for someone that does arenas around the 2200's bracket will get a cap of about 2281 or so while someone who does rbgs at the same level will get a cap of 3521? And if you can achieve 2200 in 3's its probably real easy to find partners that can get higher than 2200 in RBGs since its way easier, it just sucks that you are forced into it in order to stay competitive.

    Edit: Also wanted to add its especially important to do RBGs the first couple of weeks in order to get the higher cap than just do strictly arenas to get ahead of the gear curve.
    Last edited by Xevz; 2013-02-02 at 06:25 AM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Deleth View Post
    You guys don't have to do any RBG whatsoever to get more points, you just have to break 1.550 rating because then your weekly cap will go up. The reason I guess most of you are complaining is because for some reason you can't do that. But don't worry, with the planned rating inflation even you might be able to, just stick to ONE team for the season and see your rating and thus weekly point cap slowly increase!
    The problem is the max RBG cap is ALOT more than the max Arena one, making it that to stay competitive you HAVE to play RBGs! And the fact getting high in RBGs is easier than Arena is annoying as hell!
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    You not gamer, you go play your boring "Real life" with crappy graphics'n stuff! You cant even do Quests, dungeons and BGs in "IRL" :s
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