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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Zerdus View Post
    I'm not talking from a lore standpoint. Alliance players can already team up and go kill Garrosh. So doesn't that mean he's dead already? Lots of broken mechanics here, players shouldn't be able to attack him or any other major figure that isn't supposed to die in lore yet.

    Or maybe I'm missing a key piece of information that one of you will enlighten me with. I'm hoping I'm just ignorant and this all makes sense somehow.
    Do you really think the events that happen in a dungeon happen realtime everytime you do it?

  2. #42
    Stood in the Fire Tayace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerdus View Post
    Well the thing is it's going to be a big deal to kill him at the end of the expansion but he's already been killed multiple times by the Alliance. Just doesn't make sense.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-01 at 09:53 PM ----------



    Yes however it's still immersion breaking IMO. It shouldn't exist if it's just for gameplay when it breaks the lore.
    World of Warcraft has always been bad at Immersion. My suggestion is if your looking for Immersion find a better story driven game.

  3. #43
    How many times have you killed the same raid boss? Come on man, how is this even a thing?

    What I want to know is why in the hundreds of times I've cleared Naxx the bosses never locked the doors before we pulled. We just killed all of your buddies, one by one, and you're gonna let us in and take us on alone?
    Just calm down.
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  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    Hey all!
    First time poster here!

    OT. Who has said that Garrosh actually dies this expansion? 0.o
    While I was searching the interwebs for a blue post about another topic I came across an interview with Metzen by Pc gamer and he said "We’re all going to make it together through this storyline. And it may not be the end of his story. But it’s gonna be a glorious moment.". I don't know what the hell he meant by that but it would royally suck if Garrosh didn't die.

    Source:http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/03/30/ch...real-villains/ the quote is from the fourth paragraph under the "Having Orgrimmar be the next big part, that’s gotta just fuel the fire, right?" question.

  5. #45
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tayace View Post
    World of Warcraft has always been bad at Immersion. My suggestion is if your looking for Immersion find a better story driven game.
    Yeah no. It's no worse then any other MMO out there.
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  6. #46
    Scarab Lord Maxilian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerdus View Post
    I think you misunderstood and I should have phrased it better. What I meant when I said I'm not talking from a lore standpoint is I'm not saying he shouldn't die because x, y, z. I'm saying he's already been killed a thousand times by the Alliance....but he's this big bad that we're going to fight as the final boss....but he's already dead...
    Is true, but then don't you think that they would have to make all npcs with an unique name unkillable or at least replace all those npcs every expansion with another npc with an unique name?
    Last edited by Maxilian; 2013-02-02 at 05:22 AM.

  7. #47
    This is no worse for immersion than killing the same boss you killed for the last 5 weeks.

  8. #48
    Dreadlord Csnyder's Avatar
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    well how bout this, if you die in the game shouldn't you be dead. no resurrection, just start a new toon an level it up til you die and then start another and so on. now would that be fun cause this is what you are saying. would you enjoy the game then? i doubt you would.

  9. #49
    I killed Varian in wrath prior to ulduar being released. In the Ulduar trailer Varian is alive. How can be be alive if I killed him? Simple. Lorewise he isn't dead, yet.
    Alliance have been killing thrall since vanilla yet there he was in dragon soul.

    Garrosh doesn't die lorewise till SoO, how is that hard to understand?
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  10. #50
    I don't know why but Im getting very suspicious of Wrathion. First he seems to try to tip the balance of the war by pushing the alliance and horde to fight each other with upgraded weapons he provides thus stretching thin the forces of the alliance and the horde as they battle each other on multiple fronts. Then he seeks the power of the mogu to increase his own knowledge and power. In the process he learns about the power of the titans and desires to learn more about what they were doing in azeroth as well as the knowledge they possess. I can't help but wonder if we are actually seeing the slow progression of a final raid boss being slowly unwittingly created by horde and alliance players looking for greater tools to fight each other when they should be looking at who is suddenly getting a lot more powerful than he was before. I suspect that garrosh may be a boss that is fought by alliance players and maybe horde players but the real final boss may very well be the one loose end left over from cataclysm.

  11. #51
    Immersion is you, completely absorbed by what you are doing in a game, it's not you pretending the game is real and having your judgement of what seems real challenged or not.

    This pedantic issue with Garrosh has nothing to do with immersion. Video game players should have never learned the word in the first place because they don't understand what it even means exactly when they try to throw it back in a devs face as legitimate criticism. Immersion is not the literal thing you make it out to be, that's only a part of the overall effect. Neuroplasticity allows you to be immersed in Tetris as well as third person games or driving games where you see the car instead of the inside of it in a first person perspective.

    If you want to claim that's immersion, you're talking about suspension of disbelief more than you are literal video game immersion. The issues are connected, but not in the literal way you are making it seem.

    It's just inconsistent to cite this issue with Garrosh as a problem considering literally hundreds of other things in this game that remind you it's not actually happening. Some more major than others.

    What you do in the game is not literal, and never will be. If that's a problem for you, using Garrosh as the symbol of your "argument" is just arbitrary. Kael'thas isn't sitting in Tempest Keep and in the Sunwell at the same time. Enemies don't respawn, and legendary weapons do not copy themselves.

    You have to either play along, or not. And that's what the issue really is, how much are you willing to play along with, and how much imagination do you have to be immersed anyways?
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  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkenedfist View Post
    While I was searching the interwebs for a blue post about another topic I came across an interview with Metzen by Pc gamer and he said "We’re all going to make it together through this storyline. And it may not be the end of his story. But it’s gonna be a glorious moment.". I don't know what the hell he meant by that but it would royally suck if Garrosh didn't die.
    I only thought I would throw in into the chaos because there hasn't been any mention of his death or not.

    I do see where you are coming from, if he didn't die I would be pissed too, being Alliance I want him to fall but isn't this expansion about moving on past the bs and fixing the wrongs? I dunno with Blizz anything is possible and whatever they pull off with be done magnificently as it usually always is
    Last edited by Leonheart327; 2013-02-02 at 05:52 AM. Reason: Made a blunder!

  13. #53
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    I only thought I would throw in into the chaos because there hasn't been any mention of his death or not.

    I do see where you are coming from, if he didn't die I would be pissed too, being Alliance I want him to fall but isn't this expansion about moving on past the bs and fixing the wrongs? I dunno with Blizz anything is possible and whatever they pull off with be done magnificently as it usually always is
    When was that? Can I get a link if you could give us one?
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron View Post
    When was that? Can I get a link if you could give us one?
    Sorry I should have said, that's just my opinion on what this expansion is about and what Metzen said about the players being the bad guys. It just seems to fit in my head :\

  15. #55
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    Sorry I should have said, that's just my opinion on what this expansion is about and what Metzen said about the players being the bad guys. It just seems to fit in my head :\
    No I don't believe we're the bad guys. I just think we're being dragged along this crazy war.
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple

  16. #56
    Bloodsail Admiral HavelTheRock's Avatar
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    You, sir, are over-thinking video game logic.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron View Post
    No I don't believe we're the bad guys. I just think we're being dragged along this crazy war.
    Just depends on your stand point and view of the events unfolding I guess but we did just turn up on Pandaland unannounced with our war and what not.

    I do also happen to agree that we are being dragged into the mess but someone has gotta stop the Horde war-machine

  18. #58
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    Just depends on your stand point and view of the events unfolding I guess but we did just turn up on Pandaland unannounced with our war and what not.

    I do also happen to agree that we are being dragged into the mess but someone has gotta stop the Horde war-machine
    Err I meant both sides. We're all being dragged along.

    OT: WHY YOU THINK SO HARD?
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...htsongg/simple

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron View Post
    Err I meant both sides. We're all being dragged along.
    Meh whatever the Horde started this mess anyways.

  20. #60
    High Overlord Freeasacar's Avatar
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    What the hell is this thread. I killed Thrall, Cairne, Sylvanas, Vol'jin and the rest of the Alliance leaders as well as Jaina before Cataclysm. Lor'themar (features in MoP cutscenes), Velen (the world is basically doomed if we actually kill him) and a myriad of other major lore figures are "killable" and you're making a big deal of Garrosh, an idiot orc who was only introduced in WoW's second expansion? Give me a break.

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