# Thread: Someone explain taxes to me

1. Originally Posted by obdigore
I'm not disputing you, I'm saying that the guy who makes 40k pays the same rate on that 40k as a the guy makes 300k pays on that first 40k. Assuming both sources are personal income and not, say, capital gains or gifts.
well dunno what countery you from. but in the netherlands its diffrent(numbers made up)

person A 100k = 20% tax
person B 200k = 30% tax
person C 300k = 40% tax.

person A would pay 20% over 100k
person B would pay 30% over 200K and not 20% over 100k and then 30% over the other 100k
person C would pay 40% over 300k. and not 20% over the first 100k then 30% over another 100% and then 40% over another 100k

2. Yeah unless your income is coming in in a really weird way, there's no way to get a raise and make less money over all due to taxes.

There's just a lot of flat ignorance among the anti tax crowd.

3. Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor
I understand, but i made a mistake when wrote example because didn't used actual tax brackets.

But, actually, there is a chance that you will get less money from increased wage (but i doubt anyone can make that mistake when actual money are involved)
if you look at tax brackets, and count tax for 399.999 per year and 400.001 per year, you will get 259999,35 against 241600,60.
true. but atleast the dutch goverment also give back at the % of your taxed income. lets lets say i payed 9k interest over my mortgage. then if i payed 30% taxed i will get 30% of 9k back. but if i payed 60% tax i will get 60% of the 9k back.(but they are changing it slowly atm in the netherlands)

4. Originally Posted by loki504
well dunno what countery you from. but in the netherlands its diffrent(numbers made up)

person A 100k = 20% tax
person B 200k = 30% tax
person C 300k = 40% tax.

person A would pay 20% over 100k
person B would pay 30% over 200K and not 20% over 100k and then 30% over the other 100k
person C would pay 40% over 300k. and not 20% over the first 100k then 30% over another 100% and then 40% over another 100k
I'm in the US.

Person A makes 100k and has 20% tax on that.
Person B makes 200k, that person pays the same 20% on the first 100k then 30% on the next 100k.
Person C makes 300k, they pay 20% on the first 100k, 30% on the second 100k, then 40% on the third.

And, I just looked at the Wiki entry for Income Tax in the Netherlands, and it is the exact same way.
For 2010, income tax for persons under 65 is as follows:

For the part of income up to € 18,218: 2.3%; tax on €18,218 is €419
For the part of income between €18,219 and €32,738: 10.8%; tax on €14,520 is €1,568
For the part of income between €32,739 and €54,367: 42%; tax on €21,629 is €9,084
On all income over €54,367: 52%

5. Originally Posted by loki504
true. but atleast the dutch goverment also give back at the % of your taxed income. lets lets say i payed 9k interest over my mortgage. then if i payed 30% taxed i will get 30% of 9k back. but if i payed 60% tax i will get 60% of the 9k back.(but they are changing it slowly atm in the netherlands)
I heard that you can get a little boost from taxed money when you buy an apartment in russia

6. Originally Posted by obdigore
I'm in the US.

Person A makes 100k and has 20% tax on that.
Person B makes 200k, that person pays the same 20% on the first 100k then 30% on the next 100k.
Person C makes 300k, they pay 20% on the first 100k, 30% on the second 100k, then 40% on the third.

And, I just looked at the Wiki entry for Income Tax in the Netherlands, and it is the exact same way.
humz looked it up to. me feel kinda stupid.......

7. Originally Posted by loki504
humz looked it up to. me feel kinda stupid.......
Most people who claim taxes are horribly unfair or whatever they want to complain don't understand how taxes actually work. Almost all (all I've looked at, but I can't say I've looked at them all) tax structures in first world countries work that way.

8. Originally Posted by Nayelie
I only get \$275 from the \$315 I was supposed to make. Around 12% taken out.
Pfff that's nothing. I get almost 50% of my 56K Euro a year taken away :P

If you have a good tax accountant, you can get a lot of that back, luckily.

9. Originally Posted by obdigore
Most people who claim taxes are horribly unfair or whatever they want to complain don't understand how taxes actually work. Almost all (all I've looked at, but I can't say I've looked at them all) tax structures in first world countries work that way.
yea but its also because your boss and even the tax company make tabels that look horribel and cluttered. and maybe because of the fact i never made above 18,218

---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 08:48 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Howard Moon
Pfff that's nothing. I get almost 50% of my 56K Euro a year taken away :P

If you have a good tax accountant, you can get a lot of that back, luckily.
i would to pay 56k a year on taxes. but it also means i make the money up from it

10. Originally Posted by Orlong
Id love to them get rid of those and all other subsidies. Businesses need to make or their own or fold. But they also need to cut all the other nonessential crap like NASA, the EPA, foreign aid, research grants and everything else not related to providing a basic education, national defense, police, and physical infrastructure
Dr. Tyson would like a word with you. No, seriously. Go look at how much fucking money NASA pumps back into the country as a result of jobs and innovation alone, nevermind inspiring people to further their education to be a part of enormous, awe inspiring projects like the Apollo missions and the Mars rovers. Fuck you if you think NASA is "nonessential."

Ever used a GPS? Thank NASA. Not had your food spoil in a week? NASA. Written with a pen upside-down? NASA. Just to start.

Hope for the future is priceless.

---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 09:09 AM ----------

Originally Posted by Orlong
First of all wasting money to go to the moon serves no purpose other that to say we did it again. Nothing good can come from it.Secondly there is ALREADY a private company sending people into space soon. Its called Virgin Galactic
What about everything we learned by doing it? What about the massive shift, however brief, in how humanity views itself in relation to the universe and itself? You cannot put a price tag on that sort of achievement.

11. The world doesn't revolve around you, so either pay your taxes and contribute to society. You make a lot of money? Cool, that means you can contribute more to society without suffering too much economically. Nobody cares if you can't afford a brand new sports car or whatever, we don't need egoists.

12. Originally Posted by Dezerte
The world doesn't revolve around you, so either pay your taxes and contribute to society. You make a lot of money? Cool, that means you can contribute more to society without suffering too much economically. Nobody cares if you can't afford a brand new sports car or whatever, we don't need egoists.
I agree, the rich can afford it. So what if they get one less ivory backscratcher in a month?

Even after taxes they still earn huge sums of money and bonuses, more than most people can even dream of. Do they really need all that money on top of everything they already got?

13. Because if you earn more, you gotta give more. Thats just how fucked up the system is.

14. Originally Posted by Dezerte
The world doesn't revolve around you, so either pay your taxes and contribute to society. You make a lot of money? Cool, that means you can contribute more to society without suffering too much economically. Nobody cares if you can't afford a brand new sports car or whatever, we don't need egoists.
This is what it boils down to really.

"You worked hard earning all that money? Tough shit, we'll spend an ever increasing amount of your money the way we want as opposed to how you want; and you can bet your ass the underclass will be glad of it."

15. If you don't want to pay taxes, you can move to a tax free country. Bye!

16. If people are "punished for success," like some of the people in this thread have suggested, then by all means dole out some of that kind of "punishment" on me.

17. Originally Posted by Alenarien
This is what it boils down to really.

"You worked hard earning all that money? Tough shit, we'll spend an ever increasing amount of your money the way we want as opposed to how you want; and you can bet your ass the underclass will be glad of it."
This isn't an argument at all.

18. Originally Posted by Alenarien
This is what it boils down to really.

"You worked hard earning all that money? Tough shit, we'll spend an ever increasing amount of your money the way we want as opposed to how you want; and you can bet your ass the underclass will be glad of it."
1> Wealthy people don't work any harder than anyone else.
2> Money that's taxed is not "your money", it's the government's money.
3> The fact that you even HAVE "money" boils down to government.
4> The chief reason the government is forced to tax people is because society agrees that certain social safety nets are necessary, and wealthy people aren't willing to voluntarily fund it out of common decency. Because they won't, it's taken from them in an egalitarian and equitable manner.

19. Originally Posted by Endus
1> Wealthy people don't work any harder than anyone else.
Not true at all.

20. Originally Posted by Endus
3> The fact that you even HAVE "money" boils down to government.

This is an important point. I think a lot of the "success is punished" folks underestimate how much government assistance to the poor and middle class makes the wealth that the wealthy person has generated possible. Who do you suppose buys the products and services that make the wealth possible? Who works in the companies owned or operated by the "wealthy?" None of these markets, whether product/service markets or employment markets would be nearly as robust (or even existent in some cases) without the benefits provided by government.

So if anything, the wealthy have benefited far MORE from government influence and spending than the poor, since they get to reap the benefits of the greater stability and flexibility of society as a whole, instead of only the direct benefits to themselves specifically.

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