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  1. #1

    Question Not Sure if dumb or good idea.

    so i was thinking, after reading all the arguments and reasons why people are quitting Casuals vs Hardcore content, how hard would it be to make casual and hardcore servers with different rules? like with everything from pvp battlegrounds and arena to pve raiding. Like on casual keep LFR difficulties and keep nerfing the raids as new ones come out where hardcore servers they dont change the raid difficulites as new ones come out. something to this extent...they could do all kinds of things to keep the casual gamer happy and the hardcore guys or guilds. you wouldn't think it would be too much would it?? I don't know just an idea, what do u guys think? think this could be possible? ? ? think of the possibilities?

  2. #2
    I have a better idea, how about we all learn to just get along?

  3. #3
    Super Moderator Darsithis's Avatar
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    Why should we further segregate populations, increasing wait times for everything?



  4. #4
    Bloodsail Admiral
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    many of the 'hardcores' on forums are just blowhards. Judging by raid stats, there are very few hardcore players. Personally, I am hardcore casual. I feel no outside pressure to perform, care nothing about progression, PVP for fun only. It is a game, and is supposed to be fun. Once it is a job or isn't fun, I will stop playing.
    Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelled of elderberries.

  5. #5
    Most hardcore complaints are that they don't have enough shiney stars on their bellies that no one else has so they can feel like their progression makes them special. I don't see how having a whole server just for star bellied sneetches will make them feel unique and special.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by jazen View Post
    many of the 'hardcores' on forums are just blowhards. Judging by raid stats, there are very few hardcore players. Personally, I am hardcore casual. I feel no outside pressure to perform, care nothing about progression, PVP for fun only. It is a game, and is supposed to be fun. Once it is a job or isn't fun, I will stop playing.
    What does that even mean? Are you saying (on forums) that 1) there are not many hardcore players, but that 2) you are one of them, and 3) you are also casual?

    I'm not trying to instigate, I just don't understand your assertion or point, nor your labels.

    What are the default labels these days anymore? Hardcore applies only to raiders, or does it apply to PVP as well? And now there are qualifying monikers, like Hardcore-casual? Does that make Casual-Hardcore a thing?

    OT - I don't see this ever happening, as the damage has already been done by institution of LFD/LFR and transfers. Most people, even the "hardcore" have given up on the semblance of "realm community" after Vanilla/BC days and have accepted the instant gratification era, for better or worse. Doing this would jack up queue times for ALL parties, and cause a huge increase in server/manpower demand from Blizz for something that would likely make nobody happy. If you want to retain the hardcore feel, you can get those Cutting Edge FoS's. If you don't know what I'm referring to, then you probably don't care and that's fine too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  7. #7
    I don't think spreading the population more thinly is a good idea, and certainly isn't in line with Blizzard's current direction.

  8. #8
    I agree with the others above. The hardcore versus casuals is just an imaginary battle cry for everyone. Some who claim "they don't have time" but yet have nine 90s are hardly "casual". So of those that claim the rest of the world sucks but them and then it turns out they have done jack afterall, are hardly hardcore.

    It's easy and I guess just human nature to try and put everyone into a category to justify why things aren't the way we want it. I don't see hardcore servers ever happening, the same way I don't see them ever offering a vanilla or TBC only server. I believe the demand is much smaller than the chest thumpers claim.

    It's actually pretty comical the level of seriousness people take this game. I like how they try to correlate people in game to being losers in real life, if they can't clear heroic modes. Just a hoot really.

  9. #9
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    This would necessitate server mergers and free realm transfers.

    Both of which Blizz has said will never happen.
    You don't create "justice" by destroying. That includes buildings, cars, or the careers of the people you want "justice" for.


  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Mad_Murdock View Post
    It's actually pretty comical the level of seriousness people take this game. I like how they try to correlate people in game to being losers in real life, if they can't clear heroic modes. Just a hoot really.
    I thought (based off of some of the replies in this very thread, even!) that you were a loser in real life if you COULD clear heroic modes? Or is that not the en vogue bashing anymore?
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  11. #11
    Too much effort for too little payback. Same thing with keeping servers with old content (i.e. BC servers for example)

    Blizz said they won't do anything like this.

  12. #12
    I think one shouldn't discuss the issue, period. If you are "The Fearless, <name>" already what difference does it make to you? If you're not, stop QQing about trying to keep other people behind you down and focus on moving forward yourself...

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Nairobi View Post
    What does that even mean? Are you saying (on forums) that 1) there are not many hardcore players, but that 2) you are one of them, and 3) you are also casual?

    I'm not trying to instigate, I just don't understand your assertion or point, nor your labels.

    What are the default labels these days anymore? Hardcore applies only to raiders, or does it apply to PVP as well? And now there are qualifying monikers, like Hardcore-casual? Does that make Casual-Hardcore a thing?

    OT - I don't see this ever happening, as the damage has already been done by institution of LFD/LFR and transfers. Most people, even the "hardcore" have given up on the semblance of "realm community" after Vanilla/BC days and have accepted the instant gratification era, for better or worse. Doing this would jack up queue times for ALL parties, and cause a huge increase in server/manpower demand from Blizz for something that would likely make nobody happy. If you want to retain the hardcore feel, you can get those Cutting Edge FoS's. If you don't know what I'm referring to, then you probably don't care and that's fine too.
    Labels like casual, casual hardcore and hardcore are entirely up to personal opinion but I also see myself as a Casual Hardcore. To me that means I with a wife/child/work/social life I don't play wow all day and what little time I have is spent getting valor/gear to raid. Then I raid as much as possible with my raid group on raid night. I usually spend an hour a day on weekdays doing dailies while waiting for dungeon qeues to pop so I can max out my valor and one night a week I spend 6 hours either raiding or doing lfrs, on weekends I tend to finish off my LFR's and valor cap by saturdays. We are close to getting to Heart of fear but some others who are more casual than me need more time to gear up.

  14. #14
    I am Murloc! Anjerith's Avatar
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    If you segregated the True Hardcore from the True Casual, you would end up with desolated servers for the 'hardcore' players. This would result in the Hardcore whining, incessantly, about how unfair the game is to them.

    A few key points to this argument;
    - There are lots of people that whine and bitch on the forums about how unfair their lives are, both points of view are totally open to these people.

    - "I support free drugs and Guns for children under 12 years old!" Perhaps you see that the internet allows people to make comments like this, comments they would never make to a person face-to-face? There are very few opinions on the official forums that are not just people being blowhards.

    - Most 'hardcore' players these days are simply casuals that have the time to invest in complaining about the game. Most 'casuals' are now the old tBC and Vanilla playerbase that loves to raid, but doesn't have the time to invest in it. In-between that, is the new player (new can range from 0-2 years in the game total).

    Ironically, I would wager the majority of the vocal minority is comprised of these new players.
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Gold and the 'need' for it in-game is easily one of the most overblown mindsets in this community.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    Labels like casual, casual hardcore and hardcore are entirely up to personal opinion but I also see myself as a Casual Hardcore. To me that means I with a wife/child/work/social life I don't play wow all day and what little time I have is spent getting valor/gear to raid. Then I raid as much as possible with my raid group on raid night. I usually spend an hour a day on weekdays doing dailies while waiting for dungeon qeues to pop so I can max out my valor and one night a week I spend 6 hours either raiding or doing lfrs, on weekends I tend to finish off my LFR's and valor cap by saturdays. We are close to getting to Heart of fear but some others who are more casual than me need more time to gear up.
    So then, genuinely, what does that make me? I am in the same boat for the most part: work 8-4, gym after work, out on weekends, live with GF (who also plays, though). We raid 3x4hours a week, and have an active alt. We're 10/16H currently, moving on shortly. I value my time online and use it efficiently (doing LFR/dailies/heroics on my alt to get valor capped to make capping my main faster/easier). Does that make me less casual by definition, based on progression?

    Not seeking instigation or argumentation over hardcore vs casual, just asking what is considered to be the bounds/limits of each definition, if there is one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Anjerith View Post
    Most 'hardcore' players these days are simply casuals that have the time to invest in complaining about the game.
    I agree with you. My evidence is mostly anecdotal or a few observations but a whole lot of these people demanding that nerfs be removed and so on are members of the post-nerf 6/7 HC Firelands crowd, you know the ones who needed a 20% nerf to get anything in HC down but still haven't the ability to down Rag, even with full freebie 391s. They got theirs, fancy themselves hardcore raiders, and forget it was a nerf, not their abilities which got them where they are. And they dont want anyone else to have what they have (after the got it ofc).

  17. #17
    Epic! Detheavn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    I have a better idea, how about we all learn to just get along?
    I like you. I will give you a hug

    And all joking aside ... yeah ... why can't people just learn to love people who are different from them?

  18. #18
    The Insane Trassk's Avatar
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    this arguments about as valid as 'why don't we make a city for gay people only and so they can live there while all straight people live here'. Doesn't work.

  19. #19
    What does that even mean? Are you saying (on forums) that 1) there are not many hardcore players, but that 2) you are one of them, and 3) you are also casual?
    He said there are few hardcore players.
    He is "hardcore casual" (stupid wording), what he wants to say is that he is extremely casual.

    Most hardcore complaints are that they don't have enough shiney stars on their bellies that no one else has so they can feel like their progression makes them special. I don't see how having a whole server just for star bellied sneetches will make them feel unique and special.
    To be fair, that's not all that this is about. I for example find it sad what they have done to heroic dungeons, they are just simply faceroll through, no cc, no special pull tactics no hard bosses where you need to cc aswell ect.
    My problem here is not that everyone can get the loot, i don't give 2 shits about what other players have and haven't got lootwise or what titles and mounts they have. What i find sad is that the content is so ridiculously easy. Heroic dungeons were a thing i really really enjoyed doing with 4 friends back in TBC, in Wrath the Achievements were kind of fun even though the dungeons were pretty friggin easy by themselves. I sadly can't comment on how heroics were at the start of Cata because i started playing again at the end of Cata after leaving at the end of Wrath.
    And i just noticed this the other day while leveling my hunter over dungeon finder. I got into a shadow labyrinths group and the tank just pulled whole fucking rooms full of mobs (3-4 groups) and we aoed them down. I remember how that instance actually used to be when it came out. I remember cc-ing 2-3 mobs every pull in one room especially and having to interrupt casts that would mind controll players ect. and i got really really sad, because pulling 4 packs and spamming aoe isn't fun at all. Not 1 bit. And the new heroics are pretty much the same brainless shit, even if no one silences a spell and no mob gets ccd you can faceroll through, most of the times pulling 2 groups at once, even with mediocre gear.
    I know there are challenge modes but those aren't exactly what heroics used to be, at least from my point of view.

    On raiding, i have only done LFR so far because i don't have the time for a fixed raid schedule anymore, and LFR is pretty dull as a DPS, it's at least a little bit funny as a healer because everyone fucks up every mechanic so you have to be at least somewhat good as heal to cover it up (also with at least 2 ppl queueing as heal and then going dps every time)

  20. #20
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    It would be rather difficult actually since it would, in essence, create separate games and further divide development time in creating content and balancing for two different sets of players. So, in essence, you'd cut the amount of new content down by a considerable percentage since you would be supporting two games.

    As well, no one actually has a definition for hardcore or casual. I'm aware of plenty of self-defined hardcore players who aren't all that and alternately more than a few casual players who play very well and can hold their own in any situation.

    Lastly, it's not a new idea, has been brought up in the past and Blizzard has said "Not interested."

    So there you go.
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