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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Roose View Post
    Oh, you actually think that Democrats are liberals. That is your mistake.
    huh? then what are they if not liberals?

  2. #62
    Scarab Lord Roose's Avatar
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    If anything we see that party affiliation does not determine military outcomes. Both parties feed the war machine.

    I am just scared of the day that I see these drones flying over my head.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Raybourne View Post
    huh? then what are they if not liberals?
    Democrats are centrists by and large. Some are a bit to the left of center and some to the right.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  4. #64
    The Lightbringer Deadvolcanoes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    It shouldn't matter if you are a republican or a democrat a liberal or a conservative
    it is a very serious matter when the executive branch of the government ignores a basic right granted to all American citizens by the constitution that gives us due process of the law and grants it self the power to assassinate any citizen they feel is a threat
    I think that the government should have some leeway in targeting Americans abroad if they are assisting al Qaeda with terror operations, should capture not be possible, and should they be an actual imminent threat.

    The stipulations in the memo, however, are too vague to support, but let's not pretend our government is gonna start assassinating anyone they want.
    It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere.

  5. #65
    Scarab Lord GreatOak's Avatar
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    If you really want to freak people the fuck out you have to pepper your schemes with mind-boggling inefficiency.

  6. #66

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Zechs-cenarius View Post
    This pretty much sums it up. I do not think, regardless of my views against him, he would just up and kill an american citizen without that individual being a clear and present danger to national security. Man...the day I come to Obama's side on an issue, what a day! lol.
    are we talking about the same guy who some how interpret the constitution to mean that congress wasn't in session when they was in session

    Obama and his Chicago ambulance chasing lawyers can interpret any law to mean anything they want it to mean and argue it with a straight face

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Democrats are centrists by and large. Some are a bit to the left of center and some to the right.
    oh. well it just shows how right wing the US is, when liberals are somehow to the left

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    are we talking about the same guy who some how interpret the constitution to mean that congress wasn't in session when they was in session

    Obama and his Chicago ambulance chasing lawyers can interpret any law to mean anything they want it to mean and argue it with a straight face


    So much random in that post.

    oh. well it just shows how right wing the US is, when liberals are somehow to the left
    If memes weren't against the rules this is where I would put that princess bride one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadvolcanoes View Post
    I think that the government should have some leeway in targeting Americans abroad if they are assisting al Qaeda with terror operations, should capture not be possible, and should they be an actual imminent threat.

    The stipulations in the memo, however, are too vague to support, but let's not pretend our government is gonna start assassinating anyone they want.
    It should go to a grand jury and they need to decide if their is enough evidence of a threat to warrant the assassination

  11. #71
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    A confidential Justice Department memo concludes that the U.S. government can order the killing of American citizens if they are believed to be terrorist even if there is no intelligence indicating they are engaged in an active plot to attack the U.S.

    The 16-page memo provides new details about the legal reasoning behind one of the Obama administration’s most secretive and controversial polices: its dramatically increased use of drone strikes against terrorist suspects, including those aimed at American citizens, such as the September 2011 strike in Yemen that killed alleged al-Qaida operatives Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan. Both were U.S. citizens who had never been indicted by the U.S. government nor charged with any crimes.
    I take issue with your claim of 'indiscriminately'... Can the president order it... yes... presidents have historically been able to order, its nothing new.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 09:42 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Roose View Post
    3 actual Americans were killed. No trial, no jury, just executed. They may have been found guilty, but we will never know.


    Links to sources help, OP:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-21333570
    Taking up arms against the US to fight for a foreign power/entity doesn't require a trial, a jury or a court... its not a law enforcement matter.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 09:43 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Clampz View Post
    Holy Impeachment Process batman!
    not a chance that he'd be impeached over this. not a chance in hell.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 09:45 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan where natural born American citizens and they was tried and executed by the President with out any jury or judge Obama decided on his own they where a threat and ordered their assignation with out any due process of the law that is granted to all American citizens by the constitution

    Do you want any President to have that Power to decide and order the assignation of any American citizen he decides on his own as a threat
    Obama administration has called the Tea Part terrorist would then he order their assassination
    Vyxn... it wasn't a law enforcement matter... thereby, it wasn't as you describe it... When you take up arms against the US like that, then you are an enemy combatant... and thus forfeit any 'due process'. I may absolutely positively despise Obama, but I WILL stand with him on this.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Roose View Post
    3 actual Americans were killed. No trial, no jury, just executed.
    Funny thing, that. Police kill plenty of people daily without trial or jury, and nobody calls that an execution. I see no difference here. The men killed were free and dangerous, not some restrained prisoners they shot in the back of the head. Execution my ass.

  13. #73
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prokne View Post
    Its just because it gives a Democrat president the power to do it. If the president was a Republican they would be fine with it. Basically feigned opposition.
    Actually, I'd support a president of EITHER party having this power.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  14. #74
    There are several information that are not release into the public everyday. Killing of those American might appear at random and shiz like that but I think the government has several information in who they will kill/ assassinate and does not need to release it to the public in order to avoid confusion and panic among the citizens.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Seran View Post
    I take issue with your claim of 'indiscriminately'... Can the president order it... yes... presidents have historically been able to order, its nothing new.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-05 at 09:42 PM ----------



    Taking up arms against the US to fight for a foreign power/entity doesn't require a trial, a jury or a court... its not a law enforcement matter.
    It shows how little you know about the constitution

    So do the liberal run public schools teach the constitution anymore or are they scared if the students know all their constitutional rights it would make it harder for liberals to take the ones they dont like away

  16. #76
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magpai View Post
    We have a jury system for a reason. What "right to be an American" you have, including the right against government execution, is determined by a jury of your peers, not a politician.
    Magpai, regardless of his US citizenship status... when you take up arms against the US and fight for a foreign power you are an enemy combatant... you dont get a trial, its not a law enforcement matter...

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    It shouldn't matter if you are a republican or a democrat a liberal or a conservative
    it is a very serious matter when the executive branch of the government ignores a basic right granted to all American citizens by the constitution that gives us due process of the law and grants it self the power to assassinate any citizen they feel is a threat
    Thank you. I am reading all this my party/your party crap. This is about Americans being kiled without their rights. Has anyone been wrongly accused? All Americans should be outraged.
    "Peace is a lie"

  18. #78
    Over 9000! apepi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    Here are some links you should really have included in the OP:

    Article on the issue:
    http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news...americans?lite

    The white paper itself (link in the NBC article above):
    http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/msnbc/se...hite_Paper.pdf

    I note this in particular:



    Seriously shady stuff. That kind of logic can basically sanction anything as long as you yell "national security!" while doing it. Not that that's anything new in this "war".
    http://www.southparkstudios.com/clip...g-right-for-us

    This is so relevant :O

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    It shouldn't matter if you are a republican or a democrat a liberal or a conservative
    it is a very serious matter when the executive branch of the government ignores a basic right granted to all American citizens by the constitution that gives us due process of the law and grants it self the power to assassinate any citizen they feel is a threat
    I agree, people are not really even taking this seriously. This is like writing a law making it the law of the land going over our constitution which nothing expect other amendments should do.
    Last edited by apepi; 2013-02-06 at 03:56 AM.
    Time...line? Time isn't made out of lines. It is made out of circles. That is why clocks are round. ~ Caboose

  19. #79
    The Lightbringer Seranthor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    It shows how little you know about the constitution

    So do the liberal run public schools teach the constitution anymore or are they scared if the students know all their constitutional rights it would make it harder for liberals to take the ones they dont like away
    Vyxn... then show me exactly where it says he CANT do it... go ahead smart guy... Teach us... show us in the USC where it says he cant...

    And to call me a liberal is clear and present evidence that you have no utter clue what you are talking about. Some here would accuse me of being to the far right of Attilla the Hun. Which means I'm truly loathe to agree with the President on this... but I DO.
    Last edited by Seranthor; 2013-02-06 at 03:57 AM.

    --- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Vyxn View Post
    It shouldn't matter if you are a republican or a democrat a liberal or a conservative
    it is a very serious matter when the executive branch of the government ignores a basic right granted to all American citizens by the constitution that gives us due process of the law and grants it self the power to assassinate any citizen they feel is a threat
    The only reason I can think of to justify this law is that if it wasnt there this is what would happen:

    American terrorist is in a heavily guarded terrorist supporting area
    US sends military units to arrest the terrorist
    The terrorist dies in the firefight and bombing that happens when the troops get overrun.

    So basically the guy is probably going to die anyway while being arrested.

    I dont agree with it but it would be much more legal if they had trials in absentia or legal ways to rescind the persons citizenship.

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