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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by skrump View Post
    Maybe if schools actually allowed their students to take out their aggression in such minor ways kids would stop swallowing their anger until it explodes from the tip of a gun.

    I mean we can't really advocate fighting in schools but I see no reason not to build a boxing ring on the playground and advocate letting them beat the crap out of each other under supervision..
    I for one promote the old Boys will be boys outlook....A few good fights can be healthy for a growing boy. Hell my dad was once vice principle of a school that ahd a damn shooting range in it's basement. Then when i was in highschool we got yelled at for practicing our Kata not even sparring.

  2. #102
    my general point is who the hell cares about a kid's self expression. They probably go the whole day with out paying attention to what they are wearing themselves. I know I do and I'm damn near 30.When I go out in a t-shirt and jeans... I just slap something on. I went to catholic school growing up and looking back on it, with every other stupid social pressure on bearing down on me... I'm glad as hell that I didn't have to worry about what I was going to be wearing.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    This is also a movie, and you quoting it is pretty much the example of undue influence, it is a story, having a zero tolerence policy isn't likely to cause random light sabre duels in a metal factory either.


    it is a good policy, and one that is effective, kind of a good idea, since we have kids actually going to school and doing this sort of nonsense.

    It's called a joke and shows you lack a decent imagination. Fantasy is often used to create parallels with reality and even to point things out that are too touchy to touch upon in realistic settings.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    And here i thought you were joking before....Seriously man let the kids imagine and the boys playfight. It's natural and perfectly healthy behavior.


    What if the kid practices systematic forms of bigotry or racism, or starts pretending to round up his class mates, and classify them by color in his notebook, what if the child watches one too many episodes something really cool he seen while his parents weren't looking on TV and takes to copying those ideas. This kid isn't being punished for imagination, this kid is specifically being suspended because he and obviously other knew he was pretending to throwing an imaginary grenade at people.




    Please inform me how that form of play, shouldn't get the attention of faculty in light of recent events?

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    my general point is who the hell cares about a kid's self expression. They probably go the whole day with out paying attention to what they are wearing themselves. I know I do and I'm damn near 30.When I go out in a t-shirt and jeans... I just slap something on. I went to catholic school growing up and looking back on it, with every other stupid social pressure on bearing down on me... I'm glad as hell that I didn't have to worry about what I was going to be wearing.
    I never worried i just wore what i liked. Still do. I have a few favorite shirts to this day.

  6. #106
    I.... don't... even know what to say

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    I for one promote the old Boys will be boys outlook....A few good fights can be healthy for a growing boy. Hell my dad was once vice principle of a school that ahd a damn shooting range in it's basement. Then when i was in highschool we got yelled at for practicing our Kata not even sparring.
    the important thing in these suggestions is that the consequences be instilled from an early age, with the sort of organized activities you two are espousing there is the general idea that the consequences are taught, that structure is being given and that such behavior is only acceptable within it

    that you got yelled at for practicing Kata is silly, but its because you knew better than to do something that actually merited being yelled at

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    It's called a joke and shows you lack a decent imagination. Fantasy is often used to create parallels with reality and even to point things out that are too touchy to touch upon in realistic settings.


    I have a great imagination, but i don't have to imagine a 7th grader going to school with a gun next, and deciding to shoot some of his classmates, because you see that is real that does happen, and if we aren't going to say it is video games, then we damn well better atleast try to find out how to curb this behavior before even starts now. Because Kids didn't always go to school with firearms and start shooing their class mates, and while it isn't happening everyday, even the one in a few times it does, innocent people are being impacted by what may have started off by an innocent imagination.



    The kid isnt in prison, he isn't jail, he isnt harmed he got a suspension, and instead of taking the time to point fingers and the school making taking a little time to explain to this child why that sort of behavior or thinking iis alarming, chances are better this sort of thing wont be done by him, and will be curbed from happening by others.


    And yes Fantasy can have a rich charector and story from which to learn from, but Fantasy can also be a way of telling an entertaining story.
    Last edited by Mall Security; 2013-02-08 at 09:59 AM.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    I for one promote the old Boys will be boys outlook....A few good fights can be healthy for a growing boy. Hell my dad was once vice principle of a school that ahd a damn shooting range in it's basement. Then when i was in highschool we got yelled at for practicing our Kata not even sparring.
    the problem with schools today is that it's run by a bunch of feminazis who treat maleness as a disease that needs to be medicated and cured and removed if need be. They just can't wrap their little heads around the idea that most of the time the 'fight' is really just a form of communication and at the end of that back-and-forth the guys usually end up (better) friends or at least would have respect for one another.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    What if the kid practices systematic forms of bigotry or racism, or starts pretending to round up his class mates, and classify them by color in his notebook, what if the child watches one too many episodes something really cool he seen while his parents weren't looking on TV and takes to copying those ideas. This kid isn't being punished for imagination, this kid is specifically being suspended because he and obviously other knew he was pretending to throwing an imaginary grenade at people.




    Please inform me how that form of play, shouldn't get the attention of faculty in light of recent events?
    In light of recent events? You mean fully grown men going nuts? Probably more than a little because of mental health problems.

    EASY they are PLAYING everyone with ANY sense could see that.

    As for the systematic forms of bigotry it happens talk to em and TBH there is a VERY big difference between say play fighting and rounding kids up by race/color...Even if they did that might depend on what kinda game they're playing. You'd be amazed at what kids do.

    Hell i still remember playing games where we "hunted" each other. Was just fun and games. None of us grew up to be killers we'd never even heard of things like Battle Royal and Hunger Games...I used old power rangers toys and sticks and all that was fun and healthy.

    We laughed we played we imagined. We ran around in woods as well as playing games and watching TV.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    I have a great imagination, but i don't have to imagine a 7th grader going to school with a gun next, and deciding to shoot some of his classmates, because you see that is real that does happen, and if we aren't going to say it is video games, then we damn well better atleast try to find out how to curb this behavior before even starts now. Because Kids didn't always go to school with firearms and start shooing their class mates, and while it isn't happening everyday, even the one in a few times it does, innocent people are being impacted by what may have started off by an innocent imagination.



    The kid isnt in prison, he isn't jail, he isnt harmed he got a suspension, and instead of taking the time to point fingers and the school making taking a little time to explain to this child why that sort of behavior or thinking iis alarming, chances are better this sort of thing wont be done by him, and will be curbed from happening by others.


    And yes Fantasy can have a rich charector and story from which to learn from, but Fantasy can also be a way of telling an entertaining story.
    either that or it will show to the kid the huge reaction from the school and media and if in the future if he wants attention he knows perfectly well how to get it. As far as i'm concerned all school shooting are a combination of striking back at bully culture in school and making a name for themselves.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    the problem with schools today is that it's run by a bunch of feminazis who treat maleness as a disease that needs to be medicated and cured and removed if need be. They just can't wrap their little heads around the idea that most of the time the 'fight' is really just a form of communication and at the end of that back-and-forth the guys usually end up (better) friends or at least would have respect for one another.
    I have a joke about this actually. So two guys get into a fight. After the fight they're bloody brusied and maybe evena few dislocated joints. One of em then goes "hey wanna go geta drink" the other replies "You read my mind man".

    For men fighting CAN be a form of bonding.

    Oh and ironically BOTH my parents agree with what you said as do i. They were highschool teacher and in my dads case a middle school/high school principle as well back when this was all starting(the 70s-99 or so) and yeah they see this and nothing good. Wouldn't even let us do archery when i went to the EXACT same school my dad was principle of..They had archery classes hen he was principle.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 10:03 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    the important thing in these suggestions is that the consequences be instilled from an early age, with the sort of organized activities you two are espousing there is the general idea that the consequences are taught, that structure is being given and that such behavior is only acceptable within it

    that you got yelled at for practicing Kata is silly, but its because you knew better than to do something that actually merited being yelled at
    Ummm no they said no sparring..not no Kata OR martial arts...PLUS we weren't even at school and both os us studied the same style and i was looking at going back after a break. As far as we knew we were doing nothing wrong.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 10:05 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    either that or it will show to the kid the huge reaction from the school and media and if in the future if he wants attention he knows perfectly well how to get it. As far as i'm concerned all school shooting are a combination of striking back at bully culture in school and making a name for themselves.

    I still say one of the best ways to deal with a bully is to beat em at their own game whether it be the "smart" bully who uses intelligence or the physical one who gets his kicks outta beating people up. Match your method to your enemy.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    In light of recent events? You mean fully grown men going nuts? Probably more than a little because of mental health problems.

    EASY they are PLAYING everyone with ANY sense could see that.

    As for the systematic forms of bigotry it happens talk to em and TBH there is a VERY big difference between say play fighting and rounding kids up by race/color...Even if they did that might depend on what kinda game they're playing. You'd be amazed at what kids do.

    Hell i still remember playing games where we "hunted" each other. Was just fun and games. None of us grew up to be killers we'd never even heard of things like Battle Royal and Hunger Games...I used old power rangers toys and sticks and all that was fun and healthy.

    We laughed we played we imagined. We ran around in woods as well as playing games and watching TV.


    Yes, and look where some of that influence MAY have gotten us. I am not talking about the adults here, I am talking about school shooting where children have commited severe acts of violence, and in the wake of some of those other shootings that have been all over the news, bet your butt, i want my kid to feel safe and have one less thing to think about, when it comes to someone pretending or otherwise blow people up or harm them.



    As for your running around the woods imagining things, again, that specific instance doesn't mean very much to me, I don't know you are how what you did or didn't do effected your life, I am also not an expert in human behavior, but the faculty, school board they do, and if they felt concerned about this kids actions to say " Ya know what maybe Timmy needs a time out for a while to think about things" well then maybe that is the right call and instead of jumping up and down about a situation most people here don't have knowledge of, why not refrain from acting as if, and operate on what we do know IF we have qustions.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Ummm no they said no sparring..not no Kata OR martial arts...PLUS we weren't even at school and both os us studied the same style and i was looking at going back after a break. As far as we knew we were doing nothing wrong.
    I know, my point was that you did nothing wrong, that you knew better

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    either that or it will show to the kid the huge reaction from the school and media and if in the future if he wants attention he knows perfectly well how to get it. As far as i'm concerned all school shooting are a combination of striking back at bully culture in school and making a name for themselves.


    Actually thats a pretty rational and logical counter arguement, that is true, that is something to consider. But again based on the information avaliable, I don't know how much of that kids imagination was responsible for what happened, and how much other factors might have added to it.


    I don't think most human beings are bad people or mean or cruel, and i dont think educators in general get off on sending kids HOME for giggles.

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by draynay View Post
    I know, my point was that you did nothing wrong, that you knew better
    Oh sorry been up all day haven;t been sleeping right lately.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 10:10 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    Yes, and look where some of that influence MAY have gotten us. I am not talking about the adults here, I am talking about school shooting where children have commited severe acts of violence, and in the wake of some of those other shootings that have been all over the news, bet your butt, i want my kid to feel safe and have one less thing to think about, when it comes to someone pretending or otherwise blow people up or harm them.



    As for your running around the woods imagining things, again, that specific instance doesn't mean very much to me, I don't know you are how what you did or didn't do effected your life, I am also not an expert in human behavior, but the faculty, school board they do, and if they felt concerned about this kids actions to say " Ya know what maybe Timmy needs a time out for a while to think about things" well then maybe that is the right call and instead of jumping up and down about a situation most people here don't have knowledge of, why not refrain from acting as if, and operate on what we do know IF we have qustions.

    I feel that you should NEVER make laws that harm the majority JUST to prevent a POSSIBLE incident form a minority of the populace.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    I still say one of the best ways to deal with a bully is to beat em at their own game whether it be the "smart" bully who uses intelligence or the physical one who gets his kicks outta beating people up. Match your method to your enemy.


    My opinion is it is better for it to be a group thing, not return bullying with bullying, but to make it clear, that bullying is a sort of behavior not acceptable.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    Actually thats a pretty rational and logical counter arguement, that is true, that is something to consider. But again based on the information avaliable, I don't know how much of that kids imagination was responsible for what happened, and how much other factors might have added to it.


    I don't think most human beings are bad people or mean or cruel, and i dont think educators in general get off on sending kids HOME for giggles.
    Some if not alot DO go in for power reasons these days sadly.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post

    I feel that you should NEVER make laws that harm the majority JUST to prevent a POSSIBLE incident form a minority of the populace.

    True, but let us be specific, your imagining and it being found out obviously from you that you are pretending to throw a grenade and BLOW people up, I don't think a kid getting a time out for that or a serious conversation about what is okay is HARMING anybody.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mall Security View Post
    My opinion is it is better for it to be a group thing, not return bullying with bullying, but to make it clear, that bullying is a sort of behavior not acceptable.
    A group in which way? Because telling teachers and authority will often end in bullies just moving it off school ground or being more subtle about it. As i see bullies thet etnd to follow the alpha male mindset and will follow those stronger until they feel they can challenge for the lead again.

    At least that's been my experience.

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