Apparently we are NOT allowed to say D3 has now sold 12 million copies on a fan site.

[BenBos]

The awful server stability does have something to do with the game's quality, because it should've been avoided by not requiring servers for the singleplayer. Lagging around in singleplayer because of server overload isn't acceptable, which the South Korean government told Blizzard as well. The game itself had quite bad balance(on launch, at least), a very obvious(even to somebody who hasn't played the earlier Diablo games) and boring story, and the way RMAH/gear drops worked were very annoying.

That's the problem: by making the CODE on servers, you can't copy a client disc. Besides there are several thousand games that only run on internet only (all MMO's, all DOTA like PvP games, lots of Ipad apps...).

It is quite clear that those 12M would never have been reached if D3 had no server controls and having local client copies. The few hic ups at the launching night don't explain the hate against this server control.

[Tehstool]

I'm going to be completely honest here and say I don't know what you are trying to say. I can't understand the OP's English. Can someone please explain it to me?

[BenBos]

You are right. Online-only is worse than traditional DRM. And you don't solve piracy by punishing legitimate consumers. Pirates bypass the DRM anyway, so it only hurts the people who legitimately pay for it.
.

There is not ONE decent single working local copy of Diablo 3. So "pirates bypassing" did not even happen. The end result: 12.000.000 legitmate copies and copyright earned money.

[Hyve]

Maybe because there are already topics about the subject, that you could post your information and thoughts in?

Oh, and a small reminder, discussion of moderation is not allowed on MMO-Champion.

[Tradu]

That's the problem: by making the CODE on servers, you can't copy a client disc. Besides there are several thousand games that only run on internet only (all MMO's, all DOTA like PvP games, lots of Ipad apps...).

It is quite clear that those 12M would never have been reached if D3 had no server controls and having local client copies. The few hic ups at the launching night don't explain the hate against this server control.

And do you know why those other games are online only? Hint: it's because they're online multiplayer games, D3 is a singleplayer hack'n'slash with a co-op feature. The free game Alien Swarm(on Steam) is an example of a game that did it right. You can play the singleplayer offline, because it's... just you playing, and the co-op is online, because you're playing with other people via the internet.

Making an offline option for D3 wouldn't even have hurt Blizzards RMAH cashcow, because the offline characters could be unable to use the GAH/RMAH. They had lots of options to maintain the integrity of the RMAH other than extremely annoying online-only that lagged singleplayer games months after launch.

[BenBos]

I'm going to be completely honest here and say I don't know what you are trying to say. I can't understand the OP's English. Can someone please explain it to me?

Diablo 3 managed to have gigantic OFFICIAL sales figures due to its on line only playing mode which prevented pirating of the thing.

(let's see I have a subject, a verb, a decent expression and a sentence...)

---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 10:52 AM ----------

And do you know why those other games are online only? Hint: it's because they're online multiplayer games, D3 is a singleplayer hack'n'slash with a co-op feature. The free game Alien Swarm(on Steam) is an example of a game that did it right. You can play the singleplayer offline, because it's... just you playing, and the co-op is online, because you're playing with other people via the internet.

Actually Diablo 3 is very much a multi player game you can solo but where ALL your actions have a group trading interaction and consequence.

Also: do you know that the NEW XBOX720 will be on line ONLY ?

You DO know that one ? If not ... you heard it here first.

[Tradu]

Diablo 3 managed to have gigantic OFFICIAL sales figures due to its on line only playing mode which prevented pirating of the thing.

(let's see I have a subject, a verb, a decent expression and a sentence...)

Thats great for Blizzard, but the next Diablo game is very unlikely to be as succesful(relative to other games, at least) because of the numerous issues D3 had that were directly related to online-only. People loved D2, that sold a lot of copies of D3. D3 is nowhere near as well regarded.

[BenBos]

Thats great for Blizzard, but the next Diablo game is very unlikely to be as succesful(relative to other games, at least) because of the numerous issues D3 had that were directly related to online-only. People loved D2, that sold a lot of copies of D3. D3 is nowhere near as well regarded.

Fat chance, since the new XBOX will have ON LINE only mode too.

This mode will be the default playing mode for the future: Diablo3 set a perfect example by using this mode.

[veldrinal]

That's an odd statement/

Because these AAA companies have several thousands of co workers who need to feed their families too. They have investors that take risks to deliver the much needed resources and you have the honest player that wants to have support and updates after official purchase...

Besides, without these AAA titles you won't have much of an industry at all: where would all those young graduated developpers find a job ?

Nope it is shortsighted , but it is your opinion of course and it explains MUCH of the hate at the launch of Diablo 3 at so called Meatcritic comments: because of server controlled on line only mechanics.

Those comments (and hate scores of 1/10) - like yours - had very little to do with the game qualitiy since they were made minutes after launch...

Proving my previous points... TY for this helpful contribution.

More young developers end up in small gaming companies, or end up doing indie dev at night while working their days jobs maintaining legacy java shit. There are very, very few openings in large companies for young devs. Why have a new dev when you can afford to pull in all the experienced ones?

Without all those AAA titles, maybe we'd have more original ideas. IMO $10 steam sales provide way more value for money than a major production, and you always end up with something different. Not the same old shooter, or the same old MMO.

[rol3x]

It sold alot therefore its fine right?
The game was carried by its brand, that can only happen for so long before people get fed up and purchase a better option instead. Consumer good will is a limited commodity.
the damage to the brand brought bout by obnoxious drm practices and is yet to be fully realized, I for one have lost faith in developers and their consideration for their player base. playablity and functionality were knowingly hampered for the sake of a cash grab, I find it astonishing people are fine with this.

[Tradu]

Actually Diablo 3 is very much a multi player game you can solo but where ALL your actions have a group trading interaction and consequence.

Also: do you know that the NEW XBOX720 will be on line ONLY ?

You DO know that one ? If not ... you heard it here first.

If you consider D3 a multiplayer game, I'll just stop arguing with you. Diablo is a singleplayer series, with an optional co-op mode. I know Blizzard say D3 is not a singleplayer game, but that's what it was supposed to be. And I'm not sure what the xbox 720 has to do with anything.

[BenBos]

It sold alot therefore its fine right?
The game was carried by its brand, that can only happen for so long before people get fed up and purchase a better option instead. Consumer good will is a limited commodity.
the damage to the brand brought bout by obnoxious drm practices and is yet to be fully realized, I for one have lost faith in developers and their consideration for their player base. playablity and functionality were knowingly hampered for the sake of a cash grab, I find it astonishing people are fine with this.

I find it astonishing that people (not you) actually support piracy or theft in this thread.
I also think that Diablo 3 is a good game: opinions do vary and apparently 2 million extra PC sales AFTER an unseen hating campaign is quite extra ordinary.

---------- Post added 2013-02-08 at 11:02 AM ----------

If you consider D3 a multiplayer game, I'll just stop arguing with you. Diablo is a singleplayer series, with an optional co-op mode. And I'm not sure what the xbox 720 has to do with anything.

The Diablo series have ALWAYS been a game where trading and grinding were part of the game.

D2 had trading with crook sites and copies, cracked, dupe problems.

The moment you talk about TRADING you have a multiplayer game mechanic. Logical that in these times of internet copying crime, the game only had server controlled mechanics and online play.

And the server controlled online only mechanics let the official sales BOOM. It is quite clear to me now: that first hate wave against D3 was directed against its server only and protection feature: it had ZERO to do with in game mechanics.

[Tradu]

The Diablo series have ALWAYS been a game where trading and grinding were part of the game.

D2 had trading with crook sites and copies, cracked, dupe problems.

The moment you talk about TRADING you have a multiplayer game mechanic. Logical that in these times of internet copying crime, the game only had server controlled mechanics and online play.

And it let the official sales BOOM

Grinding, yes. You didn't HAVE to trade before D3(as in, completing the game with just your own drops was actually possible, unlike launch-Inferno in D3), because droprates weren't completely retarded. Having an offline mode that had no effect on the online stuff would've avoided the shitstorm caused by lag in singleplayer/login errors. Hardcore and normal are seperate, offline could've been as well.

[BenBos]

Grinding, yes. You didn't HAVE to trade before D3, because droprates weren't completely retarded. Having an offline mode that had no effect on the online stuff would've avoided the shitstorm caused by lag in singleplayer/login errors. Hardcore and normal are seperate, offline could've been as well.

But ... an off line mode would have meant a seperate local disk with ALL code to play on it...

That disc copy would be distributed WEEKS before the official launch on EVERY torrent site in sight, resulting in multi millions losses of actual copyright ownership.

Probably hundreds of millions even.

The same copy would be cracked, duped, so any play would have been meaningless: since the stats could be manipulated eternally.

You can find ANY popular PC game on any torrent site, except client copies of D3 these days... it works not only to counter piracy but also to control the trading aspect of this game.

So the critics were wrong: in order to have an official support, a return on investment - both from players as from developpers - the online control will be standard in the next few years.

[Tradu]

But ... an off line mode would have meant a seperate local disk with ALL code to play on it...

That disc copy would be distributed WEEKS before the official launch on EVERY torrent site in sight, resulting in multi millions losses of actual copyright ownership.

Probably hundreds of millions even.

The same copy would be cracked, duped, so any play would have been meaningless: since the stats could be manipulated eternally.

You can find ANY popular PC game on any torrent site, except client copies of D3 these days... it works not only to counter piracy but also to control the trading aspect of this game.

What part of "completely seperate from the online game" didn't you understand? The offline game wouldn't affect the online game, because only the offline game would be on your computer, while the online one would be just like it is now.

[Deleted]

You are of course allowed to say that Diablo 3 has sold 12 million copies. What you are not permitted to do on this site is to create threads publicly questioning a moderator decision. The previous thread was closed with a reason why - you can PM that moderator or any moderator if you wish to query / discuss this. Starting a thread and then adding public comments about moderation is guaranteed to get the thread closed - NOT because you're saying Diablo 3 has sold 12 million copies.

This thread has already derailed into the exact discussion we've been having in http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...y-all-the-hate so let's continue it there.

In future, please PM a moderator if you have a problem with their decision, or you can PM Sunshine if you wish to complain or comment on appropriate moderation.