1. #1

    Silence applying to totems

    As many of you know totems have been silenced via silencing the shaman and now they cant cast totems. I really don't feel that this is a very fair or even reasonable change... A shaman get all of their utilty from totems. You stun a shaman they have to eat it or trinket . You cast at a shaman they have to interupt or grounding totem. Silence a shaman now we have to eat the silence and not cast. Basically silencing a shaman whether we r ele/resto/enh all has the same effect. The effect is the same as being duck taped to a chair. You cant do anything but hope to god someone helps you. This is espcialy bad for ele and resto because they cant do any melee damage to try and do something. Now that their are no diminishing returns on stuns and silences ( and if their are they are so minute they're non existent). As of now silencing a shaman is the worst thing you can do to them because now we cant pop any utilitie totems to protect our selves and have to rely on shaman rage which i cant remember off hand if you can use that in a stun or silence. Also hope that our passive guardian 1st tier talent can save us. Other than that Shamans are just so screwed after being silenced that once they are silenced its basically in my opinion 95% chance you're gonna die.
    Now i think this is a bit unfair seeing that many other classes have class cd's that break them out of silences fear and even stuns while they are stunned silenced or feared. Why shaman got the crap end of that I have no idea. I felt that being able to cast totems as a shaman when silenced was 100% fair seeing as it is their only way to avoid or have some utility when being countered. That makes total sense to me but where the qq began for shaman totems needing to be un-castable when the shaman is silenced started I'll have no idea. I hope this gets reverted by maybe next X-pac x-[

  2. #2
    It was a stupid change I agree don't know why blizzard would do such a thing... I'm running with nature's guardian and it helps much more than astral shift. While not that great, it still works while CCed.

    Eating a spriest silence is the worst :<
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  3. #3
    SS priest makes me QQ on my end lol .. Working on trying to figure out ways around this change so far no luck.. I dont think blizz wants shamans to have the ability to negate or protect them selves while silenced. Even tho as Enh were mellle but w/e

  4. #4
    I follow your concerns about that issue totally OP .Seems the way it is now, i rely more at the help of my team mates in arena to save me in case of burst dmg and silences of opposite team. I found a macro that helps a bit to counter the first burst attacks the other team might do and generally just trying to stay out of line of sight to avoid the silences .Not very fun i know but unfortunately this is probably how i personallly deal it with it currently.Hope at some point things will change.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by sargis View Post
    As many of you know totems have been silenced via silencing the shaman and now they cant cast totems. I really don't feel that this is a very fair or even reasonable change... A shaman get all of their utilty from totems. You stun a shaman they have to eat it or trinket . You cast at a shaman they have to interupt or grounding totem. Silence a shaman now we have to eat the silence and not cast. Basically silencing a shaman whether we r ele/resto/enh all has the same effect. The effect is the same as being duck taped to a chair. You cant do anything but hope to god someone helps you. This is espcialy bad for ele and resto because they cant do any melee damage to try and do something. Now that their are no diminishing returns on stuns and silences ( and if their are they are so minute they're non existent). As of now silencing a shaman is the worst thing you can do to them because now we cant pop any utilitie totems to protect our selves and have to rely on shaman rage which i cant remember off hand if you can use that in a stun or silence. Also hope that our passive guardian 1st tier talent can save us. Other than that Shamans are just so screwed after being silenced that once they are silenced its basically in my opinion 95% chance you're gonna die.
    Now i think this is a bit unfair seeing that many other classes have class cd's that break them out of silences fear and even stuns while they are stunned silenced or feared. Why shaman got the crap end of that I have no idea. I felt that being able to cast totems as a shaman when silenced was 100% fair seeing as it is their only way to avoid or have some utility when being countered. That makes total sense to me but where the qq began for shaman totems needing to be un-castable when the shaman is silenced started I'll have no idea. I hope this gets reverted by maybe next X-pac x-[
    Sham rage can be used while stunned but cannot be used while you're silenced

  6. #6
    when silence locks out the shaman for 99% of his spells regardless of being totem or not is a bit unfair

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by pkm View Post
    It was a stupid change I agree don't know why blizzard would do such a thing... I'm running with nature's guardian and it helps much more than astral shift. While not that great, it still works while CCed.

    Eating a spriest silence is the worst :<
    You're ineed right about this well actually its a close tie with eating a DK's silence at least u can attempt to run away from a priest but silence by a DK might as well just drop your mouse

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamoTray View Post
    Sham rage can be used while stunned but cannot be used while you're silenced
    True but if they keep the Nature's Guardian change, that's a nice buff to a defensive option that can be 'used' while silenced. Its an ok talent now anyways, but its that much better with keeping the health.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by shell View Post
    True but if they keep the Nature's Guardian change, that's a nice buff to a defensive option that can be 'used' while silenced. Its an ok talent now anyways, but its that much better with keeping the health.
    Now that is true but losing the buffed stonebulwark totem will hurt alot if you take that talent the shield should be around 50-60K now

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SamoTray View Post
    Now that is true but losing the buffed stonebulwark totem will hurt alot if you take that talent the shield should be around 50-60K now
    I unsubbed because of the totem nerf but prior to that I was using SBT. I mostly did reg bgs and it was fine for that. I liked NG but felt like we could use something before it kicked in (which we now have in Shamanistic Rage) and really didn't care for Astral Shift except when I was doing some arena. It was kind of a security blanket I guess, in that it gave me some protection every 30 secs which I preferred to every 2 minutes, with the added benefit of being able to use it while silenced.

    But once they made the silence change, the totem lost all of its appeal to me. It's now the only talent in the tier that can't be used while cc'd in some particular way. So for me, if I were still playing, I'd go for Nature's Guardian. Personally, I feel like the combination of it plus Shamanistic Rage is more appealing for now.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  11. #11
    I agree that it sucks for ele and enh but resto needed it. They were and still are the strongest healer and basically dominated an entire expansion because they could still use half their abilities while silenced, unlike every other healer.

    Quote Originally Posted by sargis View Post
    You stun a shaman they have to eat it or trinket . You cast at a shaman they have to interupt or grounding totem. Silence a shaman now we have to eat the silence and not cast. [
    This line cracked me up honestly. I really hope your not talking about resto here. Let me put it into hpally terms: Stun an hpally then have to eat it or trinket. Cast at an hpally he has to eat it or LOS. Silence and hpally and he has to eat it.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    This line cracked me up honestly. I really hope your not talking about resto here. Let me put it into hpally terms: Stun an hpally then have to eat it or trinket. Cast at an hpally he has to eat it or LOS. Silence and hpally and he has to eat it.
    And then when a hpally is being nuked and in any1 of those effects he can just bubble and be immune to damage and get out of all the effects

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    I agree that it sucks for ele and enh but resto needed it. They were and still are the strongest healer and basically dominated an entire expansion because they could still use half their abilities while silenced, unlike every other healer.
    Thanks to this approach, I dislike the class I used to love.
    Resto is OP? Then let's nerf all shaman specs!

    They divided abilities and defined specs in MoP, which lead people to believe that this horrible approach will die out. Sadly, we are still suffering because of resto. Sick of seeing the same movie for years now. If resto is OP, nerf resto.

    Also sick of "Shaman is in the decent spot, all others are high above. We'll do nothing about shaman but try to get other classes to shaman's level." bullshit. This kills any hope and expectation for a change / buff / solution to problems in the class. Add Blizzard's aggressive "shut the fuck up, I'm the boss" behaviour to that, whereas silence change gets reverted quickly after some bad players start moaning: "omg how am I supposed to winz nowwww unsub"

    Suck it up, I thought MoP would change things, unfortunantly I was clearly mistaken.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by delaxes View Post
    And then when a hpally is being nuked and in any1 of those effects he can just bubble and be immune to damage and get out of all the effects
    Dont tell me your mentioning a 5 minute cd to avoid cc, or are you just mentioning when we get nuked? Yea bubble is about all pallys have going for them when switched too, while shammies still have a free 25% last stand every 30 seconds, and can have mutliple strong hots / earthshield rolling on themselves, and the second you are out of stun/silence you can NS heal to full or SLT to survive. Shamans have been the best pvp healer since wotlk at least and are still even after the nerf.

    Thanks to this approach, I dislike the class I used to love.
    Resto is OP? Then let's nerf all shaman specs!
    Yea like I said this kinda sucks. Its honestly strange that they havent reverted it for for Enh at the very least since they have been making alot of spec specific pvp changes lately, but you gotta think they are still spells like everyone else. Silence a ret or a dk or a feral and they cant do alot either. Wars, rogues, and hunters are about the only classes silence is mostly useless on (dont know about monks).

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Mithgroth View Post
    Thanks to this approach, I dislike the class I used to love.
    Resto is OP? Then let's nerf all shaman specs!

    They divided abilities and defined specs in MoP, which lead people to believe that this horrible approach will die out. Sadly, we are still suffering because of resto. Sick of seeing the same movie for years now. If resto is OP, nerf resto.

    Also sick of "Shaman is in the decent spot, all others are high above. We'll do nothing about shaman but try to get other classes to shaman's level." bullshit. This kills any hope and expectation for a change / buff / solution to problems in the class. Add Blizzard's aggressive "shut the fuck up, I'm the boss" behaviour to that, whereas silence change gets reverted quickly after some bad players start moaning: "omg how am I supposed to winz nowwww unsub"

    Suck it up, I thought MoP would change things, unfortunantly I was clearly mistaken.
    Exactly. Blizz justified the totem nerf with incoming silence nerfs. Meanwhile, they quickly took back those nerfs (which were done to classes who, overall, where doing much better in pvp).
    What's the result? Totems are still nerfed, despite blizz having destroyed their own justyfication for it(which was complete bullshit, even so).

    Totems hard to counter was what they were going on about, it was their resonse to like five complains.
    5 HP hard to counter?
    'nuff said

    -They had no reason for this nerf, as it did not adress the problem in question at all.
    -They completely ignored the effect on ele/enh, and dug their herp-derp grave even deeper with their "ele? maybe" line, making it evident they dont even consider shaman dps in pvp
    -They provided groundless reasons for the nerf (nerf to silences on other classes) they didn't follow through with
    -They didn't bother reverting the nerf, or mentioning it any further
    -They rarely make shaman changes at all (shamans in general got less blues than other classes since forever
    It is true, look through old patch notes or beta development, the blue class always gets less blues and among that most is either stuff nobody really wanted, stuff that might be decent (but isn't adressing problems), nerfs, new abilities with bad lay-outs (additional to the ones we already have), straight out nerfs or resto specific stuff.
    The actual enh/ele specific buffs are maybe 5%, and of those 80% is purely dps/numbers specific. Actually adressing shaman dps pvp utility is rare among rare
    - They respond rarely if ever to posts on the official shaman forums and whenever they do respond to something, it is to derp-questions of derp-people. In the end it is (according to them) a lack of proper feedback from us that leads to this state. Even IF that were the case (which is not), they surely would've caused that lack through discouraging it first

    It is really frustrating that with all the good work they make with new content, awesome looking items, lore, new features such as transmog and what not (and even making awesome class overhauls like they did with warlock or paladins), they are apparently not capable of showing shamans love. I believe we are the only class to never have gotten a overhaul patch.
    Last edited by Omanley; 2013-02-12 at 06:58 PM.
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    Dont tell me your mentioning a 5 minute cd to avoid cc, or are you just mentioning when we get nuked? Yea bubble is about all pallys have going for them when switched too, while shammies still have a free 25% last stand every 30 seconds, and can have mutliple strong hots / earthshield rolling on themselves, and the second you are out of stun/silence you can NS heal to full or SLT to survive. Shamans have been the best pvp healer since wotlk at least and are still even after the nerf.



    Yea like I said this kinda sucks. Its honestly strange that they havent reverted it for for Enh at the very least since they have been making alot of spec specific pvp changes lately, but you gotta think they are still spells like everyone else. Silence a ret or a dk or a feral and they cant do alot either. Wars, rogues, and hunters are about the only classes silence is mostly useless on (dont know about monks).
    Lol pallys bubble is all they have going for them is that so. pallys have lots of baseline dmg reduction CD's as well as a baseline immunity to silence and interupts. not only that hand of freedom and HOJ as well as blinding light to help themselves escape while they're being trained. They also wear plate so they have a lots of Physcial resistance as well. If a resto Shaman is silenced they have access to nothing for the whole duration of the silence (astral Shift is the exception if they take it)

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by SamoTray View Post
    Lol pallys bubble is all they have going for them is that so. pallys have lots of baseline dmg reduction CD's as well as a baseline immunity to silence and interupts. not only that hand of freedom and HOJ as well as blinding light to help themselves escape while they're being trained. They also wear plate so they have a lots of Physcial resistance as well. If a resto Shaman is silenced they have access to nothing for the whole duration of the silence (astral Shift is the exception if they take it)
    Are you talking about being stunned/silenced or about being trained. None of an hpallys DR (the amazing 20% it is..) and silence immunity cds are usable while cc'd. Your not making any sense. If a pally is silenced he cant do shit, same as a shammy, as it should be. Shammies have plenty of escape abilities along with pallys when being trained, but being trained isnt being cced while nuked. The problem was you couldnt nuke an rsham unless they were stunned because they could avoid casts with grounding/shear and still had tools while silenced, which among other things made them OP, hence cata dominance. And dont even bring up plate, shammy with mail/shield is a literally unnoticeable armor difference.

    Moral of the story: Rsham is fine.

  18. #18
    It would've been ok if they didn't retract the blank-silence change. Now it's just gonna keep on being sucky ...

    Out of NS we don't have anything useful to cast while being trained and cannot afford to fake-cast 2-3 interrupts.
    Healing Tide Totem gets instagibbed.
    With the ridiculous damage Spirit Link Totem requiers the whole team to fall back in to defensive when it needs to be used for the shaman himself, not even gonna talk about a situation when it needs to be used on a say warrior or even a mage on the other side of the map ....

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    Yea like I said this kinda sucks. Its honestly strange that they havent reverted it for for Enh at the very least since they have been making alot of spec specific pvp changes lately, but you gotta think they are still spells like everyone else. Silence a ret or a dk or a feral and they cant do alot either. Wars, rogues, and hunters are about the only classes silence is mostly useless on (dont know about monks).
    As long as they can be destroyed, they are not spells.
    They are physical, stationary wooden sticks. Planting a totem is not casting a spell, both in terms of gameplay or lore. How magical it can be to drop a wooden stick on the ground? The magic is done by the totem itself.

    This nerf will be justified once I'm able to destroy a frostbolt by auto-attacking.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by thisnamesucks View Post
    Are you talking about being stunned/silenced or about being trained. None of an hpallys DR (the amazing 20% it is..) and silence immunity cds are usable while cc'd. Your not making any sense. If a pally is silenced he cant do shit, same as a shammy, as it should be. Shammies have plenty of escape abilities along with pallys when being trained, but being trained isnt being cced while nuked. The problem was you couldnt nuke an rsham unless they were stunned because they could avoid casts with grounding/shear and still had tools while silenced, which among other things made them OP, hence cata dominance. And dont even bring up plate, shammy with mail/shield is a literally unnoticeable armor difference.

    Moral of the story: Rsham is fine.
    LOL so you're saying when you're silenced your not able to use Bubble ?? or use aura mastery to prevent being silenced in the 1st place to go along with all your dmg reduction CD's as well as your Utility CD's ?? Hand of Freedom ? if your being trained all you need to do is pop ur bubble or u can use Blinding light or Hoj one of the dps training you. please dont note all a resto Shamans utility without noting your own as well. with the silence nerf a Shaman is useless cant do anything what so ever i admit resto was op at the beginning of MOP but the totem silence nerf over killed the entire class, which in fact has now made pally's the dominant PVP healer.

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