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  1. #621
    Yeah, I have 509 legs and my next valor upgrade was going to be the legs, but even with reforges I get put way over on hit and actually lose damage from a 13 ilvl increase.

    Plus, this will only get worse when we start doing upgrades on gear in 5.3. I can't even imagine how harsh T16 will be.

    It's so bogus that things that should be clear upgrades (trinkets or whatever else) are only tentatively so. Sub-optimal is one thing, but offensive stats being worthless? Really?

    And there are blue sockets that I may end up putting agi/stam cuts in because the hit is worthless but the socket bonus is worth matching.

    Not to mention all the people on the forums who say, "Just replace those pieces of gear that have hit on them with pieces that don't." I have 4 pieces with hit on them (don't even have the hit/exp bow) and, after reforging out of hit on them all, I'm over the cap. Plus, idk how loot drops in their raids, but we don't choose which pieces the boss drops in our raids. Or they'll say, "Reforge out of hit." Because you aren't limited to reforging 40% of the stat or anything like that, amirite?. I hadn't thought of reforging.

    The caps were reasonable in blue gear, and even to an extent, in T14, but this is just going to get more ridiculous with every "upgrade." If they don't want to change stats on the actual gear, at least change the hard cap to some sort of soft cap where there are some returns on hit/exp over the cap. Have excess split evenly among haste/crit/mastery. Or let us reforge more than 40% (reforging is already technical enough that I doubt they'd want to complicate it further for throngs of players, though).

    I know they're ultimately planning on "fixing" hit and expertise at some point down the road, but that doesn't change the fact that we're borked right now and even more so down the road. BiS pieces won't necessarily be the ones that have crit/x but the ones that don't have hit/exp.

    [Btw, I'll piss and moan on the official forums when I get home and have my authenticator on me. I'm thinking I'll post it in the Damage forum, unless someone has a better idea?]

  2. #622
    I'm in the same boat on hit/exp- because I have the Tortos bow and Renataki (and I'm a dwarf) I can only manage to drop either hit to cap or expertise to cap but not both. I hit honored yesterday and went to look at what gear upgrades I could buy, then realized that all of them had hit on them, and in fact the only one that doesn't have hit is at exalted. The hit/exp situation is just a mess.

  3. #623
    You're getting upset over nothing. If you happen to get pieces of gear that have excess hit/exp on them then too bad, but eventually one you start replacing everything it will go back down to a normal level. Higher tiers won't make a difference either because Blizzard always choose the item stats so you aren't overloaded in hit/exp.

  4. #624
    I wonder what they were thinking when creating the Tortos bow...."hey let's make a ranged weapon with a crapton of hit/exp on it, YEAH!"

  5. #625
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hayro1 View Post
    I wonder what they were thinking when creating the Tortos bow...."hey let's make a ranged weapon with a crapton of hit/exp on it, YEAH!"
    There are probably ppl that dont know about hit/exp caps and reforging, with gear like this they wont be missing atleast =D

  6. #626
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    Whch trinket to use?

    I have

    1/2 upgraded Relix of Xuen ilvl480
    993 agility
    chance to proc 3143 agility

    Normal bottle of infinite stars
    1079 mastery (648 mastery and 431 hit reforged)
    chance to proc 3236 agility

    and just got Vicious talisman of the shadowpan assault
    1467 hit
    chance to proc 8800 agility

    I'm pretty sure i'm going to want to replace the infinite stars for the shadowpan one but i just wanted to check before hand.

  7. #627
    35% uptime on renataki on jinrokh this week

    i love rppm and rppm culture

  8. #628
    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    Higher tiers won't make a difference either because Blizzard always choose the item stats so you aren't overloaded in hit/exp.
    Ok, come on. You can't say that as people are overloaded in hit/exp right at this moment.

    Sure, I'd agree that it's not an inherent thing with scaling. But this certainly isn't some kind of odd RNG that a select few people are having.

    The Tortos bow, VP trinket, and Renataki all create real cap problems and they're all items that a lot of hunters are relying on at this point in the tier. Logical gear upgrades are putting lots of hunters into scenarios where it's impossible to get even in the ballpark of the cap. It's a problem created by design.

  9. #629
    How is too much hit/exp "too bad," if it's simultaneously "nothing"?

    I agree that if you can pick exactly what gear drops for you, this isn't as big of a deal, but no one has that luxury. Furthermore, not being hit capped after you've farmed all the gear is little consolation since optimizing is more important for progression than farming.

    As a troll, if I get all BiS, NOT factoring in thunderforged OR item upgrades coming in 5.3, I'm 144 over the hit cap and 36 shy of the expertise cap, and that's reforging away all hit/exp. The first piece to upgrade the ilvls of is the weapon (1103 hit). And again, that's cherry-picking the drops (a lot of which are off Ra-den, which give minimal hit and 0 exp). It gets uglier much quicker if you swap in the heroic Tortos weapon, Megaera neck (the better one is a trash drop), etc.

    Yes, there are obv ways to minimize the impact of excess hit/exp, but to pretend like these will always be sufficient to make this a non-issue is not recognizing reality many hunters will face (esp before they drop the valor trinket, if they have the Tortos bow, etc).

    Iirc, at one point they were talking about having the amount of hit/exp required in raid tiers for MoP to increase, but it obv ended up not being implemented. This is a flawed system imo as it stands. If they don't want to do anything drastic until the next expansion, that's fine by me, but I think that they should put a band-aid in this tier and likely the next as well.

    It is easy to overstate the importance of secondary stats in the grand scheme of things. Someone who is a couple of hit % over is losing out on just over 1k dps or so, which isn't a game breaker. However, that's more of a difference than you'll get upgrading from a regular ring to a heroic ring in T15. It's also more DPS than you get from a food buff, which is something any half-serious raider always keeps up. Or maybe they should just tell their raid leader who isn't happy with them for not eating that they are getting upset over nothing?
    Last edited by Dole4011; 2013-03-27 at 07:12 PM.

  10. #630
    This tier is just topping it all... caps are getting out of hand up to a ridiculous level. For me personally hit is ok but expertise is a different story. After reforging everything out of expertise im still at 4126 rating (12.14%) so im wondering if it's actually better to replace some gear with lower ilvl (would probably be only replacing legs or trinket both 535ilvl)?

  11. #631
    Quote Originally Posted by Neronex View Post
    This tier is just topping it all... caps are getting out of hand up to a ridiculous level. For me personally hit is ok but expertise is a different story. After reforging everything out of expertise im still at 4126 rating (12.14%) so im wondering if it's actually better to replace some gear with lower ilvl (would probably be only replacing legs or trinket both 535ilvl)?
    Would you be able to link an armory or something and all your other gear choices so I can try helping you out?

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  12. #632
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehstool View Post
    Would you be able to link an armory or something and all your other gear choices so I can try helping you out?
    Yes of course, any advice?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ronex/advanced

    Could replace the legs with 517 tier, trinket im not sure only have 502 bottle, so guess that's not really a good choice.
    Last edited by Neronex; 2013-03-27 at 09:00 PM.

  13. #633
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    I'm already using a 510 bottle over the VP trinket, and I've managed to be about 150 stats over the caps, combined. But I'm not using the Tortos bow. I'm really hoping for a random boss drop H-Mirocon bow at some point. I feel like even with the yellow socket, it might be better than Voice and its ELEVEN HUNDRED HIT. I mean, a weapon providing more than 2/5ths of your hit is silly.

  14. #634
    Quote Originally Posted by Neronex View Post
    Yes of course, any advice?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ronex/advanced

    Could replace the legs with 517 tier, trinket im not sure only have 502 bottle, so guess that's not really a good choice.
    This seems to be happening to everyone. You have expertise on literally all your gear. Dropping H Renataki's Soul Charm for H bottle would result in a dps loss since the Real PPM trinkets are very good now. If you swap out your legs it could work since you'd be getting the 2 piece and getting ~500 stats back from your expertise that you will be trading out, I'd say to keep the trinkets as is and sim the legs on femaledwarf.
    Last edited by Tehstool; 2013-03-27 at 09:18 PM.

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  15. #635
    Quote Originally Posted by Solidito View Post
    I have

    1/2 upgraded Relix of Xuen ilvl480
    993 agility
    chance to proc 3143 agility

    Normal bottle of infinite stars
    1079 mastery (648 mastery and 431 hit reforged)
    chance to proc 3236 agility

    and just got Vicious talisman of the shadowpan assault
    1467 hit
    chance to proc 8800 agility

    I'm pretty sure i'm going to want to replace the infinite stars for the shadowpan one but i just wanted to check before hand.
    Use relic of xuen and the VP trinket.

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  16. #636
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neronex View Post
    This tier is just topping it all... caps are getting out of hand up to a ridiculous level. For me personally hit is ok but expertise is a different story. After reforging everything out of expertise im still at 4126 rating (12.14%) so im wondering if it's actually better to replace some gear with lower ilvl (would probably be only replacing legs or trinket both 535ilvl)?
    Damn, think iv been lucky with drops.
    Reforged all exp and is at 7.51%.

    Finally got a new trinket, time to test 7000 haste =D
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...3%A9r/advanced

  17. #637
    Used Renataki's on Megaera tonight, 26% uptime with 4122 Haste rating (The fight took us 8:35).

    Not really sure if that is high or low uptime.. But I like it when both VP trinket and Renat proccs.

  18. #638
    I'm using Heroic Rentaki and Bloodlust but I'll probably change to Rentaki and Organization if/when it drops.

  19. #639
    my question is right now I have the vp trinket and 522 rentakis, is it worth getting juju from lfr and replacing vp trinket or only with the 522 juju?

  20. #640
    Quote Originally Posted by Libertarian View Post
    I'm using Heroic Rentaki and Bloodlust but I'll probably change to Rentaki and Organization if/when it drops.
    Rune of re-orgination is bad. Renataki's is much better than it.


    Here's an old post of mine on the rune:

    My guildie is getting ~20% uptime (give or take since RPPM is weird) with 16% haste with it. He's getting a 20k stat proc. 20k stats on a 20% uptime is +4k best secondary stat -2k lower secondary stats. That's a ~2k stat gain and it messes with your rotation.
    It's not that great.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-28 at 01:54 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by ayaraa View Post
    my question is right now I have the vp trinket and 522 rentakis, is it worth getting juju from lfr and replacing vp trinket or only with the 522 juju?
    Only 522 juju should beat the vp trinket on most occasions, but LFR bad juju may get something insane like 40% uptime and then it will pass the vp trinket, but on average (using normal bad juju's uptime from my guildies) the LFR trinket won't beat the VP trinket.

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