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  1. #41
    Stood in the Fire Gum's Avatar
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    i dont think theres much reason to keep discussing the statweights, as also pointed out by zcorn. the general consensus is, that crit =| Str, with SmF being slightly below, with about as much as TG is above. Now, lets get back to looking at trinkets - Does anyone actually have any idea as to how they work? Namely thinking of the stacking ones, but also considering the quite arbitrary ICD/Uptime trinkets of the first tier have, it would be lovely to have an idea - Specially for CD stacking ect. Might change the values of said trinkets a bit

  2. #42
    Blue quote on proc rates of new trinkets:

    Strength DPS
    - Brutal Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault - 15% chance on landing harmful abilities and spells, and melee/ranged abilities and swings. 75 sec ICD.
    - Fabled Feather of Ji-Kun - 0.56 RealPPM on landing harmful abilities and spells, and melee/ranged abilities and swings. 22 sec ICD.
    - Primordius’ Talisman of Rage – 3.00 RealPPM on landing harmful abilities and spells, and melee/ranged abilities and swings. No ICD.
    - Spark of Zandalar - 5.00 RealPPM on landing harmful abilities and spells, and melee/ranged abilities and swings. No ICD.
    - Gaze of the Twins – 1.00 RealPPM on critical harmful abilities and spells, periodic spell, and melee/ranged abilities and swings. No ICD.

    Some competent theorycrafter can probably enlighten us what type of uptimes we can expect based on this
    Last edited by Delath; 2013-02-14 at 08:20 AM. Reason: Added link to source

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Delath View Post
    Blue quote on proc rates of new trinkets:



    Some competent theorycrafter can probably enlighten us what type of uptimes we can expect based on this
    Adding these to OP.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    The problem with that is that if you're already gearing to maximise crit then the gain isn't going to be huge because you won't have as much of the other stats
    You're also not using a trinket that just already has crit on it, and it's an agility trinket


    And with a 20 second duration and that big a potential boost it's going to have a big ICD
    Its icd is 22 seconds with .46 ppm.

  5. #45
    Imo, BiS trinket will be Talisman of Rage for sure, but the secondary trinket will be a toss up between Spark of Zandalar and Gaze.

    Couple of things: (these are for my character with just weapon swaps. Not completely accurate, but just as an example)
    Fury TG, Crit=3.1, Strength=3, everything else <1.5.
    Fury SMF, Strength=3, Crit=2.85, everything else <1.5.
    Arms, Strength=3, Crit=1.8, everything else <1.0. (Likely to change with haste buff)

    Spark of Zandalar has a garbage passive haste bonus. However, it's 5rppm, despite requiring 10 stacks to proc, for a static 8297 (sorry, using the 535 since I don't know the values on Thunderforged).
    Gaze of the Twins has a static 1657 Strength bonus, which is great. But, it has a low 1rppm for a (CHANCE ON CRIT) to gain a stacking crit buff that adds up to 9708 Crit at 3 stacks.

    At first glance, Gaze is optimal. At a second pass, low proc on chance on crit is kind of whatever. However, I'd like to direct your attention to the new meta gems that Blizz is trying to make bis (by making them have orange pixels).

    Capacitive Primal Diamond – 15.00 base RealPPM on landing melee/ranged abilities and swings. No ICD. At 5 stacks, fires Lightning Strike, which deals [280 + 75% AP] Nature damage. That base proc rate is multiplied by an additional coefficient by spec:
    - Arms: 1.771
    - Fury (TG): 1.784
    - Fury (SMF): 1.951

    With our slower weapon speed than other classes, our class has a relatively higher chance to gain Capacitance.
    The reason I bring up this new meta is for two major reasons.
    1) The damage from 5 stacks deals damage based on Attack Power. We'll (in full 535/TG) be sitting around 40% Crit. This warrants Strength (which is equivalent to 2 Attack Power). Based on my napkin math, we'll gain ~2k Strength by the time we are BiS, and from 34k+ Attack Power to almost 40k. A strength proc trinket, not to mention we are most likely running Talisman of Rage which grants us the same bonus strength at 5 stacks, will add roughly 18k Strength, which will be an additional 36k Attack Power while the trinkets are up. This can make the new meta hit really hard, alongside our other abilities.
    2) We lose our current meta which increases our crit damage by 3% which will lower crits value.

    Once again, this was all just napkin math and I haven't been able to test these trinkets on ptr to fully enjoy/test how it goes, but it's worth a look.

  6. #46
    Stood in the Fire Gum's Avatar
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    Interesting observation, depending on the uptimes of the different trinkets, its most certainly a factor when considering the Meta, the 15k AP from the Spark will surely look nice when thinking Metagem - I most certainly, as you also point out Recke, wouldnt rule it out just yet.

  7. #47
    Bloodsail Admiral Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurimlinn View Post
    If I remember correctly, you can still add a meta gem socket to the new weapons in 5.2
    I think you meant to say prismatic gem socket.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    I think you meant to say prismatic gem socket.
    You're right, thanks.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Recke View Post
    Gaze of the Twins has a static 1657 Strength bonus, which is great. But, it has a low 1rppm for a (CHANCE ON CRIT) to gain a stacking crit buff that adds up to 9708 Crit at 3 stacks.

    At first glance, Gaze is optimal. At a second pass, low proc on chance on crit is kind of whatever.
    In the RPPM system, "chance on crit" is a relatively meaningless distinction. While you crit less often than you hit, that just means the chance to proc on any given crit is higher since you will have gone longer since your last chance to proc the trinket. As long as you don't go more than 10s without any sort of crit(at which point you're no longer banking additional proc chance), proccing off crits instead of all hits will have very little impact on overall proc rate.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthan View Post
    In the RPPM system, "chance on crit" is a relatively meaningless distinction. While you crit less often than you hit, that just means the chance to proc on any given crit is higher since you will have gone longer since your last chance to proc the trinket. As long as you don't go more than 10s without any sort of crit(at which point you're no longer banking additional proc chance), proccing off crits instead of all hits will have very little impact on overall proc rate.
    2 bits about how RPPM works.
    The ‘time since the last chance to proc’ is capped at 10sec, so that your first attack of a fight isn’t a guaranteed proc.
    For example, if you have 22% Haste, it was 1.4sec since the last chance to proc, and you’ve got Windsong, then the chance to proc is 2(ppm) * 1.22(haste) * 1.4(time since last chance) / 60 (sec per min) = 5.693%

    Changing this, for a warrior stand point. 1(ppm)*1.01*10/60= 16.8% chance to proc at best, on a crit. A warrior's crit rate should be around 30% by the time they get this gear (in total with buffs). That's about 5% of every action to get a crit that procs the trinket. This would be fine, except it's a 20 second duration and it stacks 3 times. This means it might not refresh in time to maintain the buff, let alone 3 stacks of the buff.
    (note, using 10 because it caps at it)
    Compare this to Spark of Zandalar which has 5 times the proc rate on all hits, and only requires 3.33 times the stack to get the buff.
    5ppm*1.01*10/60= 84.17% chance to proc on anything. To me, this favors the Spark, regardless of having crap haste instead of Strength.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Asmodejjj View Post
    Agi hasn't given us AP since Cata. Back in Wrath some of our BiS gear had Agi on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Video Games View Post
    Agi hasn't given us ap since 3.1 when they made berserker stance 20% str instead of 10 or 20% ap.
    .. What? Agi has NEVER given a Warrior AP. What are you guys on?

    Warriors used Agility gear back in the days because that gear also gave AP. The Agility itself never did.
    I'm not a native English speaker, and yet, I don't suck at English. The argument "English is not my mother tongue" doesn't actually give you an excuse to do so.

  12. #52
    Brewmaster Sainur's Avatar
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    Some really good trinkets for fury warriors there.

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