Thread: Depressing dps

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  1. #1

    Depressing dps

    So I was watching a stream last night of a guild progressing on Sha 10hc, and on the first try they wiped early p2 and I noticed that their shadow priest was almost level with their affliction lock in dps. This surprised me so I went and armouried the 2 toons. As I was doing this they made another pull and when I came back from the armoury page they were 45s into the fight and lust had just worn off. At this point the lock was at 183k dps and the priest was around 125k. Priests ilvl - 504, the locks was 488. He had blue rings and only 2 piece t14

  2. #2
    Whats so depressing then? The fact that the warlock is able to do so much more with less gear? I was actually just thinking about posting something about warlocks a few moments ago. I just did a dungeon on my lvl 83 lock and noticed that everyone in the group but me was level 85 and that most of them had dragon soul gear yet i was beating them in dps by a good margin. I dont think it had anything to do with me being a warlock either since there was an affliction warlock either. What im wondering is if destruction is viable at 90 (the spec I'm playing right now).

  3. #3
    It is depressing from the priests point of view, which is where this thread is.

  4. #4
    While, dont get me wrong, the difference IS really depressing. A shadow priest progressing on sha hc should be doing WAY more than 125k right after heroism

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Ifeanychukwu View Post
    Whats so depressing then? The fact that the warlock is able to do so much more with less gear? I was actually just thinking about posting something about warlocks a few moments ago. I just did a dungeon on my lvl 83 lock and noticed that everyone in the group but me was level 85 and that most of them had dragon soul gear yet i was beating them in dps by a good margin. I dont think it had anything to do with me being a warlock either since there was an affliction warlock either. What im wondering is if destruction is viable at 90 (the spec I'm playing right now).
    This has nothing to do with the class. It has to do with level scaling. Each level you gain decreases all your damage stats, except spellpower. Essentially, you were 2 levels ahead of everyone, even though you were actually 2 levels behind.

  6. #6
    Stood in the Fire espoire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiporispit View Post
    This has nothing to do with the class. It has to do with level scaling. Each level you gain decreases all your damage stats, except spellpower. Essentially, you were 2 levels ahead of everyone, even though you were actually 2 levels behind.
    Exactly. That effect used to be covered up by miss chances, partial resists and glancing blows when attacking things above your level. Now, levelling up still makes you markedly weaker, but it doesn't have a very big impact on your ability to hit higher-levelled foes; it's only +3% hit right now. It used to be 3-15% hit, and about 20% damage due to bypassing glancing/resist.

  7. #7
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Decent FDCL RNG Sha HC DPS at the end of BL:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=5057&e=5099

    Bad FDCL RNG Sha HC DPS at the end of BL:
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/c...?s=1289&e=1330

    The only burst we get from BL is more Flay and VT ticking (slightly) more often, giving us more potential FDCL stacks. Basically, close to none.

    But we can do this to the adds, this on huddles, and this little thing even locks can't do, so screw them.

    Long story short, stop thinking about stuff you can't do, but rather focus on the stuff you can and your raid will love you.
    Last edited by veiledy0; 2013-02-10 at 03:10 AM.
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  8. #8
    No class can compete with locks on sha 10 HC.

  9. #9
    Pandaren Monk Myz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rowl View Post
    No class can compete with locks
    Fixed for you. Locks are a bad point of reference altogether.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    The only burst we get from BL is more Flay and VT ticking (slightly) more often, giving us more potential FDCL stacks. Basically, close to none.
    30% more on VT and SW: P and an extra tick on DP depending on what haste you start with.
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  11. #11
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stiglet View Post
    30% more on VT and SW: P and an extra tick on DP depending on what haste you start with.
    You're mixing up sustained dmg spells with burst ones. Our dots tick miserably low to call it a burst sequence. DP can be labeled a burst, but you can only get off 1 during a Bloodlust off the pull, so it's not much of a burst either.
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  12. #12
    The Patient
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    Man, after reading about depressing DPS, I feel much better about my self.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    You're mixing up sustained dmg spells with burst ones. Our dots tick miserably low to call it a burst sequence. DP can be labeled a burst, but you can only get off 1 during a Bloodlust off the pull, so it's not much of a burst either.
    AH I see what you mean, burst wise, I thought you meant we get no benefit from heroism :P
    "I never met a miner who complained about the weather"

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    You're mixing up sustained dmg spells with burst ones. Our dots tick miserably low to call it a burst sequence. DP can be labeled a burst, but you can only get off 1 during a Bloodlust off the pull, so it's not much of a burst either.
    You know, the OP is comparing a shadowpriest with an (with 99% certainty) affliction lock. What exactly is the difference between the two regarding the benefit of BL? More dot ticks and more Flay/Malific Grasp.

  15. #15
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feio View Post
    You know, the OP is comparing a shadowpriest with an (with 99% certainty) affliction lock. What exactly is the difference between the two regarding the benefit of BL? More dot ticks and more Flay/Malific Grasp.
    Difference is in the amount of dots that profit from BL.

    SP has 3 dots ticking more often during BL:
    • VT,
    • SW:P and
    • MF; DP isn't spammable, and can only be used once during BL so I wont count it in.

    Lock has 7 dots ticking more often during BL:
    • UA,
    • Corruption,
    • Agony,
    • Malefic Grasp,
    • Malefic Grasp UA ticks,
    • Malefic Grasp Corruption ticks,
    • Malefic Grasp Agony ticks.
    (And a DPS CD in form of an additional 20% haste on top of all that).

    7 > 3. Basic maths really.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  16. #16
    Im pretty sure that blizzard has stated more than once that affli locks are doing too much dps at the moment. Think they said something about nerfing arcane mages as well.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    Difference is in the amount of dots that profit from BL.

    SP has 3 dots ticking more often during BL:
    • VT,
    • SW:P and
    • MF; DP isn't spammable, and can only be used once during BL so I wont count it in.

    Lock has 7 dots ticking more often during BL:
    • UA,
    • Corruption,
    • Agony,
    • Malefic Grasp,
    • Malefic Grasp UA ticks,
    • Malefic Grasp Corruption ticks,
    • Malefic Grasp Agony ticks.
    (And a DPS CD in form of an additional 20% haste on top of all that).

    7 > 3. Basic maths really.

    This is it basically...

    Spriest may be low or high but honestly that isn't really relevant because of a few simple facts.

    The damage of a affliction warlock comes from all intents and purposes from his dots, even the damage of MG and haunt is irrelevant because the only reason both of these spells are used is because they increase dot damage.

    The benefit that affliction warlocks get from bloodlust and other haste cooldowns is much more then most specs simpley because such a huge part of their damage benefits from haste.

    if we compare affliction warlocks to any other caster then you will notice that warlocks don't have a strong damage spell on cooldown like priest, druids and shamans have.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    7 > 3. Basic maths really.
    The number of dots is irrelevant. Consider 2 classes: class A has one dot, which ticks for 30k every 3 seconds. Class B has ten thousand dots, which tick for 1 damage every second. Both classes have 10k dps. Now we add bloodlust. Class A has one dot which ticks for 30k every 2.4 seconds. Class B has ten thousand dots, which tick for 1 damage every .83 seconds. Both classes miraculously have the same dps (12k). This obviously ignores refreshing dots, and other issues, but "7 > 3" says nothing.

    The differences are 1. Devouring Plague, one of our hardest hitting abilities, essentially not scaling with haste (or conversely, as ati87 said, pretty much everything warlocks have scales with haste, while Mind Blast+Devouring Plague do not for priests), 2. Warlocks having a damage CD that scales well with bloodlust, and 3. Warlocks have Pandemic.

  19. #19
    Dreadlord veiledy0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Invrnc View Post
    The number of dots is irrelevant. Consider 2 classes: class A has one dot, which ticks for 30k every 3 seconds. Class B has ten thousand dots, which tick for 1 damage every second. Both classes have 10k dps. Now we add bloodlust. Class A has one dot which ticks for 30k every 2.4 seconds. Class B has ten thousand dots, which tick for 1 damage every .83 seconds. Both classes miraculously have the same dps (12k). This obviously ignores refreshing dots, and other issues, but "7 > 3" says nothing..
    At same amounts of spellpower Vamp Touch ticks for as much as UA, and SW:P ticks for as much as Corruption.



    My dots tick a slight bit more 'cause my 2nd trinket is the DMC which procs int, and his Sha trinket procs haste. But when you compare the amount of ticks, what makes the difference becomes obvious.
    Quote Originally Posted by Invrnc View Post
    The differences are 1. Devouring Plague, one of our hardest hitting abilities, essentially not scaling with haste (or conversely, as ati87 said, pretty much everything warlocks have scales with haste, while Mind Blast+Devouring Plague do not for priests),
    DP does scale with haste, but has a too low uptime for that scaling to matter, because MB does not scale with haste, which I've already said.
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    DP isn't spammable, and can only be used once during BL so I wont count it in.
    /
    Quote Originally Posted by Invrnc View Post
    2. Warlocks having a damage CD that scales well with bloodlust,
    Quote Originally Posted by veiledy0 View Post
    (And a DPS CD in form of an additional 20% haste on top of all that).
    Basically, you've just repeated everything I've already said, bar the Pandemic part. Not saying that you're wrong about DP and MB scaling issues, but the fact that locks have 4 DoTs more than a SP has everything to do with how the 2 classes scale with BL.
    Last edited by veiledy0; 2013-02-12 at 04:28 PM.
    When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
    When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
    And I held your hand through all of these years

  20. #20
    in cata in days to top dps meter was an easy thing depend on your gear and your rotation + how do u use your cd's in mop no cds bro rng in everything starting a fight without orbs and they nerfed the only thing we might have dp ,, they took the first tick xD
    solution = reroll

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