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  1. #21
    Brewmaster jahasafrat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Would this boarder line harassment?
    I don't think being (purposefully) useless in a dungeon can be called harassment, even if you're spamming nonsense for the duration.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    What fine line would you make sure not to cross?
    You're already beyond hope, I fear.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Commissarr View Post
    What sort of pathetic person would do that anyway?

    If you know of such a person, suggest they get laid and go outside once in a while to get some fresh air and reacquaint themselves with sunshine.

    They must lead a pretty dull life if that's what they find entertaining.
    I don't know, it's a hypothetical, but apparently it exists as it was posted in one of the replies.

    But since you responded to my op question with another question. I'll continue the discussion ( I do not support or endorse what i'm about to say but for discussions sake, here we go)

    What if said person, didn't really have an interest in wow, played it in the past the way it was supposed to, keeps his account and subscription going incase they ever get bored, its there. Logs on every now and then just to troll maybe make a few videos? Something to pass the time while bored looking for cheap lulz?

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Read my replies please. I'm not doing this. But clearly there are players that are as the first reply linked one.

    I'm slightly insulted you'd think i'd do something this childish. lol. I don't have the time to make videos, let alone troll videos.

    Please don't jump to conclusions about me and make accusations, perhaps it is you who is childish and "12"
    Perhaps you should read over your first post before you start accusing people of jumping to conclusions. If you don't want people to think you're doing this then you should make it clear that you're not the one doing it, instead of throwing a tanty when people make a logical assumption based on your post.

    Protip: if you don't want people to think that you're 12 stop using "lol" as punctuation and complete sentences. If you continue to do that don't get upset when people treat you appropriately for how you come across.

    Beyond which no, this isn't an interesting debate. It's very clear and very simple. People are obligated to play by the rules they agreed to, if their behavior harasses another player they can and should be stopped, it they do it routinely they clearly aren't willing to play by the rules they agreed to and shouldn't be permitted to play at all. I have no idea how you'd construct someone harassing somebody else as them having/exercising 'equal rights' as in doing so they're denying someone else their 'rights'.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Windfury View Post
    Perhaps you should read over your first post before you start accusing people of jumping to conclusions. If you don't want people to think you're doing this then you should make it clear that you're not the one doing it, instead of throwing a tanty when people make a logical assumption based on your post.

    Protip: if you don't want people to think that you're 12 stop using "lol" as punctuation and complete sentences. If you continue to do that don't get upset when people treat you appropriately for how you come across.

    Beyond which no, this isn't an interesting debate. It's very clear and very simple. People are obligated to play by the rules they agreed to, if their behavior harasses another player they can and should be stopped, it they do it routinely they clearly aren't willing to play by the rules they agreed to and shouldn't be permitted to play at all. I have no idea how you'd construct someone harassing somebody else as them having/exercising 'equal rights' as in doing so they're denying someone else their 'rights'.
    Yes the OP was written a certain way, it was intended to be that way.

    I like to look at it as some what of a thesis. Provokes thoughts, opinions, even emotion. In your case it's mostly emotional, very quick to jump to conclusions, without further reading. But that's okay.

    I like to use lol to make things more playful and take away from a serious tone. It just seems to make things more friendly. But i didn't use lol in the OP, so not sure how you could incorporate that into the first reply you made. As lol was used in the reply to your reply.

    If it isn't interesting, than why are you participating? and not ignoring it?

    you bring up an interesting point is this against blizzards terms and conditions to play like this?

    And to add to your statement about harrassment one reply noted...

    Quote Originally Posted by jahasafrat View Post
    I don't think being (purposefully) useless in a dungeon can be called harassment, even if you're spamming nonsense for the duration.


    ---------- Post added 2013-02-10 at 07:37 AM ----------

    I think it's a great discussion topic in my opinion.

    I think it's one of those things that falls into not rules, or restrictions, but player etiquette.

    Which can be an area of grey.

    And of course as shown many players feel strongly against it, and what makes a topic more exciting and intriguing, than passion and belief in support or not of a topic.

    And to get members of the community to articulate their words against these area of grey advocating points can be interesting. When the person responds with sometimes intellectual or metaphorical messages.
    Last edited by iadamson; 2013-02-10 at 07:41 AM.

  6. #26
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    I'm speaking for the purpose of discussion and obviously playing the role of the devils advocate.
    Just reading the original post that's not obvious at all. And for all of your walking this back since you didn't bother to say any of this in the first post, I'm not convinced either.
    If you have anything to contribute to a thread topic, please do so. Discussing moderation or calling out specific people is against the rules and makes a post liable for an infraction. Please report problem posts. If anyone is unclear about the rules please read our FAQ. Thanks.

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  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Eschaton View Post
    Just reading the original post that's not obvious at all. And for all of your walking this back since you didn't bother to say any of this in the first post, I'm not convinced either.
    Well no you couldn't put it in the OP, it wouldn't have the seem effect on people, they wouldn't feel obliged to comment and would take that passion and energy/ emotion away from their writing. But you gotta be able to articulate and over come flaming the topic or OP.

    I like to see strong opinions, i really do, for and against. In this situation points for are much more interesting as its so off the norm and expectation.
    Last edited by iadamson; 2013-02-10 at 08:03 AM.

  8. #28
    Yes that is punishable

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Well no you couldn't put it in the OP, it wouldn't have the seem effect on people, they wouldn't feel obliged to comment and would take that passion and energy/ emotion away from their writing. But you gotta be able to articulate and over come flaming the topic or OP.

    I like to see strong opinions, i really do, for and against. In this situation points for are much more interesting as its so off the norm and expectation.
    So you made the op in a blatant attempt to promote heated discussion?

    This is griefing, same faction griefing at that and yes it is bannable.

  10. #30
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    This could turn out to be a really interesting discussion.

    What about the player doing these negative things, is he entitled to play the game as he wants for his enjoyment?

    Does he have equal right?

    Or are you obligated to play within the norm?
    You don't have to play within the norm, but trolling and harassing people can get you banned. Doing that kind of shit in groups can get your account actioned so I would assume making videos of it would yield the same results assuming Blizzard found out who you were.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Amsden View Post
    You don't have to play within the norm, but trolling and harassing people can get you banned. Doing that kind of shit in groups can get your account actioned so I would assume making videos of it would yield the same results assuming Blizzard found out who you were.
    Yeah, we touched on if this is actually harassment though.

    If you want to look at it innocently and simply, is it anything beyond just being useless? and saying nonsense?

    That's why i'm thinking its a good topic because it seems to walk that fine line of clearly against the rules and simple etiquette.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noomz View Post
    How is it "outside the box" to troll people and act like a twat? I'm not saying you are, but you seem to have taken offense to it so I can only assume. It's not an accusation, I'm saying that IF you are doing it. But since your first post is so typical of a "Well I have this friend that does X"-attempt at trying to hide your own guilt so as not to admit to anything yourself. There's nothing fun about it. There's nothing cool, edgy or alternative about it. The things you describe is just douchebag behavior from people that are immature and without respect. To compare it to being a criminal in a movie just shows the immaturity of it.

    And I'm not your "mate".

    If you have found people who do this to you and/or your friends, using it against the people who did it might be effective.

    You don't assume! a boss of mine, American at his origins, told once in a meeting that only retards, weak and people without brain ASSUME something that could probably go wrong or otherwise.
    So i quote him, don't assume, stay on facts and don't throw accusations on the OP

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Yeah, we touched on if this is actually harassment though.

    If you want to look at it innocently and simply, is it anything beyond just being useless? and saying nonsense?

    That's why i'm thinking its a good topic because it seems to walk that fine line of clearly against the rules and simple etiquette.
    it's been said it is against the rules, there is no fine line, griefing, especially same faction griefing is against the rules and actionable, but go for it and see how your account goes.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Hakto View Post
    So you made the op in a blatant attempt to promote heated discussion?

    This is griefing, same faction griefing at that and yes it is bannable.
    I wanted to use an unorthodox and uncanny form of writing to trigger responses and discussion, between myself, and the community.
    I noticed early on I had to make it clear I was not actually doing what was stated in the OP.
    But I didn't want to add it to the OP because it would deter from the goal.
    Some people expressed themselves beautifully.
    Others seemed quick to presumption which was a little saddening because I felt like I was being flamed, and once it was clear I wasn't to be flamed, they flamed the idea of my thread. (subtly)

    This was also some what of an experiment to see how people would respond, I think it went well for the most part.
    Most kept it objective, some seem like they come into threads looking for fights. Odd. Probably a personality trait or something.
    Last edited by iadamson; 2013-02-10 at 08:15 AM.

  15. #35
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Yeah, we touched on if this is actually harassment though.

    If you want to look at it innocently and simply, is it anything beyond just being useless? and saying nonsense?

    That's why i'm thinking its a good topic because it seems to walk that fine line of clearly against the rules and simple etiquette.
    I would probably consider wasting 4 other peoples time harassment, it is definitely trolling. Both are bannable.

  16. #36
    nothing unorthodox or uncanny about it tbh.

    It's bait writing, cheapest tool in the book.

  17. #37
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Yeah, we touched on if this is actually harassment though.

    If you want to look at it innocently and simply, is it anything beyond just being useless? and saying nonsense?
    If I were a Blizzard CM or GM and the video was reported to me and I went and looked at it and I could identify the player in question, it's entirely possible that I would do something about it. That's a lot of ifs of course.
    If you have anything to contribute to a thread topic, please do so. Discussing moderation or calling out specific people is against the rules and makes a post liable for an infraction. Please report problem posts. If anyone is unclear about the rules please read our FAQ. Thanks.

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  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    I like to look at it as some what of a thesis. Provokes thoughts, opinions, even emotion. In your case it's mostly emotional, very quick to jump to conclusions, without further reading. But that's okay.
    Honestly it looks like crap.
    Anyways I strongly doubt it - you can do way too much stuff you easily get away with that making a video of yourself wiping someone would result in a ban.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Eschaton View Post
    If I were a Blizzard CM or GM and the video was reported to me and I went and looked at it and I could identify the player in question, it's entirely possible that I would do something about it. That's a lot of ifs of course.
    I like how you decided to join in on the topic, I think it's added a slight tad of controversy.

    With you not being "convinced" and all.

    This topics starting to turn into something more, it's like controversial writing, and I love it.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-10 at 08:21 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by whoranzone View Post
    Honestly it looks like crap.
    Anyways I strongly doubt it - you can do way too much stuff you easily get away with that making a video of yourself wiping someone would result in a ban.
    I got you to reply to it, so it worked, may have looked like crap, but for intents and purposes, you participated.
    Last edited by iadamson; 2013-02-10 at 08:22 AM.

  20. #40
    Pandaren Monk
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    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    What about the player doing these negative things, is he entitled to play the game as he wants for his enjoyment?
    Yes, as long as he is not doing so at the expense of other players' enjoyment.

    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Does he have equal right?
    Yes of course he does. He also has equal responsibility

    Quote Originally Posted by iadamson View Post
    Or are you obligated to play within the norm?
    It sounds to me like you are trying to warp your argument into a justification for griefing. No one is obligated to play within any norm. You are, however, obligated to play within the rules. Bullying other players (which is exactly what you are describing) for your own amusement is not ok and not cool. I would be highly amused if your account got banned permanently for being such a jerk.

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