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  1. #761
    Immortal Sorrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arganis View Post
    Ya but unfortunately not all people have or can even acquire "swag" and a lot of men that are considered "creepy" would probably makes better boyfriends then the "swag" masters. I guess in this case I'm biased as my "swagger" level is pretty much null and void but that's because my personality is simply incompatible and I think that's a problem a lot of men have, especially in this day and age.

    I guess the frustration here is with woman who don't see "swag" is just a seduction act but tbh if the girl you want is all about swag and you're a "creepy" dude then you're probably the one who needs to rethink things.
    This has been my experience as well..And i mean wth women who i have dated women i am friends with and so on. ALOT of them have either dated assholes who "seemed cool" were classic party boys or are attracted to the very things that most men KNOW mean they're a hump em and dump em type. To say nothing of abusers.

    Problem is then you get less confident men or guys who might be more passive in alot of ways or are just trying to be nice who really would do ll they can to care for them who get overlooked.

    It is honestly quite vexing.

  2. #762
    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    No, that's bullshit. False accusations are very, very rare. Rape is not.

    I love how this gets posted every time someone disagrees with you, its IMPOSSIBLE to know how many cases of rape go unreported... because they are unreported and its impossible to know how many of the accused are done so falsely because no woman is gona go "oh yea he didnt rape me, thats my bad" and then have no charges pressed against her.

  3. #763
    Immortal Reg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    This has been my experience as well..And i mean wth women who i have dated women i am friends with and so on. ALOT of them have either dated assholes who "seemed cool" were classic party boys or are attracted to the very things that most men KNOW mean they're a hump em and dump em type. To say nothing of abusers.

    Problem is then you get less confident men or guys who might be more passive in alot of ways or are just trying to be nice who really would do ll they can to care for them who get overlooked.

    It is honestly quite vexing.
    Sounds like you have an incredible case of being bitter about being put in the "friend zone" if it exists...

  4. #764
    Mechagnome Osyrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    This has been my experience as well..And i mean wth women who i have dated women i am friends with and so on. ALOT of them have either dated assholes who "seemed cool" were classic party boys or are attracted to the very things that most men KNOW mean they're a hump em and dump em type. To say nothing of abusers.

    Problem is then you get less confident men or guys who might be more passive in alot of ways or are just trying to be nice who really would do ll they can to care for them who get overlooked.

    It is honestly quite vexing.
    Because they are not woman. They are a girl stuck in a womans body.


    Plus. If they overlook you- they might not be that into you. We will go out of our way if we like you. Move on it also means they probably are not right for you, if they can not accept you in all your colors- no good.

  5. #765
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    I'm a man and I fear what some other men are capable of. Hell even I feel a little uncomfortable walking home alone because I didn't want to pay for a cab and I'm fairly built and capable of defending myself. There are some seriously dangerous men out there and there way more of them then women.

    One only has to look at the history books(and even today still in less fortunate areas then my own) to see what happened to a cities female citizens when they were conquered by an opposing army or total anarchy broke out. Beyond that there's the fact that males commit way more violent crimes then women. As a man I recognize that we really don't have the greatest track record historically when it comes to the safety of woman and considering there feelings. This is why they are so cautious I think at least partly, back in the day it was how they survived the fact they had little to no rights. That mentality isn't needed as much these days in modern society, but there no denying there are obviously still men around that give them need for it still.
    Last edited by Duncanîdaho; 2013-02-11 at 08:40 PM.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  6. #766
    Warchief Statix's Avatar
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    What are we really talkig about here?

    Men are childish and women are hypocrits. That's the conclusion. The end.
    Statix will suffice.

  7. #767
    Immortal Sorrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyxxi View Post
    This one paragraph seems to have spawned a massive debate into which the poster was attacked from multiple sides because people read it wrong....

    Lets analyse the post:

    His opinion was that he hates when people state that this crime is all about one person having power over someone else and the abuse factor and no other reason comes into it. Which is of course untrue, there are multiple reasons for people committing any crime.

    1. The sense of control/power over someone else
    2. Drink and the loss of inhibitions/conscience
    3. Temporary insanity

    (I'm sure there are others but these are the ones he listed)

    No matter what the reason it all falls under the same crime and the perpetrator is always guilty, a fact that Sorrior never argued against.

    He also said later on that if both parties are intoxicated that it could very well not fall under the crime (If consent was given; note that he did not say whether or not consent was given) but would still be seen by the public/authorities as such.

    However I don't like that he generalized that all men sometimes lose their senses

    ___________________________________


    I bet I get dragged into the flame war but I had to defend a post which I believe got undeserved stick, I couldn't be more against this crime so I will say no more on the subject.

    That is indeed it and you're right about what i meant. Just vexing when people fully dismiss my point or assume i'm bashing women. I may have issues with extremist feminists but i honestly do care for women and others. I just don't like how people ASSUME it's all about power when many other reasons could be there.

    And sorry about not clarifying but i DO feel that most men at least have the POTENTIAL to under EXTREME cases that will almost never happen IRL..I am not a 100% kinda guy so even that .001% chance for some men is still reason to consider.

  8. #768
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    This has been my experience as well..And i mean wth women who i have dated women i am friends with and so on. ALOT of them have either dated assholes who "seemed cool" were classic party boys or are attracted to the very things that most men KNOW mean they're a hump em and dump em type. To say nothing of abusers.

    Problem is then you get less confident men or guys who might be more passive in alot of ways or are just trying to be nice who really would do ll they can to care for them who get overlooked.

    It is honestly quite vexing.
    It's not really "vexing".

    You're just re-iterating the 'nice guy' fallacy, that girls date assholes and miss out on the 'nice guys' patiently waiting on the side.

    The issue with that is it's incredibly misogynistic and demeaning to women. What you're saying, really, is that you think your behaviour means you're owed a woman. You're not being an ass, therefore she SHOULD like you, and if she doesn't, that's not fair. That's bullshit. You're not "being nice", you just lack the self-confidence to express your inner asshole.

    There's plenty of guys out there who are decent guys, who aren't scared of women, and don't face either issue. The "nice guy" thing is just the passive-aggressive variant of the same assholes they complain about.

  9. #769
    Immortal Sorrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kadil View Post
    Rape has nothing to do with desire, it's about power over the victim, controlling them and hate, nothing else.
    Heh no THIS is what i HATE. This stereotype that it;s all power. There can be many reasons a man might go insane. NOT just power. You have NO IDEA how powerful a TRULY suppressed male sex drive CAN be.

    It obviously varies and most men never will but there are at LEAST some cases where it comes down to essentially hormonal override of reason. I am NOT saying it is right i AM however saying it is all about power is a lie that makes it easier to try and see things a certain way.

  10. #770
    Merely a Setback Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Heh no THIS is what i HATE. This stereotype that it;s all power. There can be many reasons a man might go insane. NOT just power. You have NO IDEA how powerful a TRULY suppressed male sex drive CAN be.

    It obviously varies and most men never will but there are at LEAST some cases where it comes down to essentially hormonal override of reason. I am NOT saying it is right i AM however saying it is all about power is a lie that makes it easier to try and see things a certain way.

    Insanity doesn't just include *rape*. It means a lot of things. It probably is power for some but not everyone. As for hormones taking over well personally I can't say that would happen to me but I'm not sure if I believe the hormone overpowering reason.
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

  11. #771
    Mechagnome Osyrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Heh no THIS is what i HATE. This stereotype that it;s all power. There can be many reasons a man might go insane. NOT just power. You have NO IDEA how powerful a TRULY suppressed male sex drive CAN be.

    It obviously varies and most men never will but there are at LEAST some cases where it comes down to essentially hormonal override of reason. I am NOT saying it is right i AM however saying it is all about power is a lie that makes it easier to try and see things a certain way.
    You have not been raped and do not understand.

    Just like i do not understand how embarrassing having a random erection is.

  12. #772
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Heh no THIS is what i HATE. This stereotype that it;s all power. There can be many reasons a man might go insane. NOT just power. You have NO IDEA how powerful a TRULY suppressed male sex drive CAN be.
    No, this is absolutely, 100% bullshit. No man is overpowered by his sex drive. He uses that to try and excuse the fact that he doesn't have a problem forcing a woman into sex. The only difference between this guy, and a guy who'd use roofies or who'd hold a gun on a woman while he forced her, is that he's an opportunist rather than a planner. That's the ONLY difference. He's still a rapist. Period. In every single goddamned case.

  13. #773
    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Heh no THIS is what i HATE. This stereotype that it;s all power. There can be many reasons a man might go insane. NOT just power. You have NO IDEA how powerful a TRULY suppressed male sex drive CAN be.

    It obviously varies and most men never will but there are at LEAST some cases where it comes down to essentially hormonal override of reason. I am NOT saying it is right i AM however saying it is all about power is a lie that makes it easier to try and see things a certain way.
    what is also lost in these debates is that the vast majority of rapes aren't stranger rapes. They are done by someone the victim knows and trusts and you got to wonder exactly how much the sexual history between the two might contribute to it. It could have been the result of years of teasing the guy and stringing him along leading him to believe that he had a chance and he finally just decides to take it for his years of trouble.

  14. #774
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    what is also lost in these debates is that the vast majority of rapes aren't stranger rapes. They are done by someone the victim knows and trusts and you got to wonder exactly how much the sexual history between the two might contribute to it. It could have been the result of years of teasing the guy and stringing him along leading him to believe that he had a chance and he finally just decides to take it for his years of trouble.
    All you're doing is explaining that he's a violent rapist. None of what you described are mitigating circumstances. They don't explain it. They don't justify it. All they do is describe the circumstances under which that particular person is going to rape someone. Because they're a rapist.

  15. #775
    Mechagnome Osyrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    It's not really "vexing".

    You're just re-iterating the 'nice guy' fallacy, that girls date assholes and miss out on the 'nice guys' patiently waiting on the side.

    The issue with that is it's incredibly misogynistic and demeaning to women. What you're saying, really, is that you think your behaviour means you're owed a woman. You're not being an ass, therefore she SHOULD like you, and if she doesn't, that's not fair. That's bullshit. You're not "being nice", you just lack the self-confidence to express your inner asshole.

    There's plenty of guys out there who are decent guys, who aren't scared of women, and don't face either issue. The "nice guy" thing is just the passive-aggressive variant of the same assholes they complain about.
    Please add this video. It is funny, but true.


  16. #776
    Quote Originally Posted by Osyrus View Post
    You have not been raped and do not understand.

    Just like i do not understand how embarrassing having a random erection is.
    So because youve been raped that makes you an expert on rapists? I bet if you asked every rapist in the world why they did it not all of them would say to control the victim.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-11 at 03:49 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    No, this is absolutely, 100% bullshit. No man is overpowered by his sex drive. He uses that to try and excuse the fact that he doesn't have a problem forcing a woman into sex. The only difference between this guy, and a guy who'd use roofies or who'd hold a gun on a woman while he forced her, is that he's an opportunist rather than a planner. That's the ONLY difference. He's still a rapist. Period. In every single goddamned case.
    He isnt saying he isnt a rapist he is fucking saying that it isnt always about power and hating women.

  17. #777
    Merely a Setback Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    So because youve been raped that makes you an expert on rapists? I bet if you asked every rapist in the world why they did it not all of them would say to control the victim.

    As if the Rapist is going to convict himself.
    Blizzard do not destroy Jaina Proudmoore's character. Make her who she once was, not full of rage and vengeance.,If you are curious about me or about my writing aspirations, feel free to pst me. Paladin-Sorcerer at your service! My Youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeluron Big fanboy of Yrel now. Love her now

  18. #778
    Legendary! darenyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by seta-san View Post
    what is also lost in these debates is that the vast majority of rapes aren't stranger rapes. They are done by someone the victim knows and trusts and you got to wonder exactly how much the sexual history between the two might contribute to it. It could have been the result of years of teasing the guy and stringing him along leading him to believe that he had a chance and he finally just decides to take it for his years of trouble.
    ah, trying to justify rape i see.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-11 at 12:55 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by A Day to Remember View Post
    So because youve been raped that makes you an expert on rapists? I bet if you asked every rapist in the world why they did it not all of them would say to control the victim.

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-11 at 03:49 PM ----------



    He isnt saying he isnt a rapist he is fucking saying that it isnt always about power and hating women.
    yeah sometimes its just about doing it cause you can. totally different!

  19. #779
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Day to Remember View Post
    He isnt saying he isnt a rapist he is fucking saying that it isnt always about power and hating women.
    Except that it is. It isn't complicated. Date rape ONLY happens because a guy decides that getting off is worth abusing and forcing a woman to have sex with him. That's it. That's the whole thing. He doesn't see her as an equal, he sees her as a tool, a means to an end. Her resistance is an offense, which is why he forces her. That's the entire dynamic.

    If you're claiming it's anything else, you're deluding yourself.

  20. #780
    I am Murloc! Tiili's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sorrior View Post
    Depending how far it's gone SOME men can't just turn off the switch.

    I'd say alot of things cone from biological differences not just ideological as far as this debate goes.
    Bullshit is all I can say about that.
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